trains in storage

[HSTEd]

As I understand it its not just the underframes, there was the traction control equipment that I thought they were going to reuse 442 style?

That stuff is a significant expense.

You can turn the train into a dual voltage one on-the-cheap by fitting a trailer with a pantograph and rectiformer and plugging the 750V output into the existing shoe bus.

 

[yorksrob]

As I understand it its not just the underframes, there was the traction control equipment that I thought they were going to reuse 442 style?

That stuff is a significant expense.

You can turn the train into a dual voltage one on-the-cheap by fitting a trailer with a pantograph and rectiformer and plugging the 750V output into the existing shoe bus.

I'm not sure. I remember reading an article about it in the Railway Magazine back in the nineties. I'll see if I can dig it out over the next few days.

 

[Blindtraveler]

and now X years on we are debating at length MK3 extention V IEP of 1 type or another and theoretically a similar debate could have been had with MK2s, some of which are stil happilly trundling round on both charters and in revinue service in varius states of refurbishment. They could, in theory still be0in mass usage today and until 2019 or so, but instead they scrapped or sold them and gave us0the biggest insult to the rail network ever built, voyagers!

 

[yorksrob]

I do wonder whether we should have pre-empted the New Zealanders and converted some of our Mk 2's into DMU's for the North !

 

[Blindtraveler]

doable?

 

[HSTEd]

Oh, and designing a new body shell to fit Mark 1 underframes might be quite expensive but once you've done it, just look at how many Mark 1 derived units the Southern Region had at the time.

The 4CIG is just a bit simpler because all its traction equipment is on one vehicle but any Mark 1 derived unit could probably have been converted for considerably less expense, even the Thumpers.

EDIT:

Would this work with small modifications for all Mark 1 derived stock? Because there is all that Glaswegian commuter stock that could have benefitted as well.

 

[tbtc]

In a way it's a shame it didn't happen - the money saved could have been spent building additional rolling stock to cope with overcrowding

If there were any money saved then the cynic in me suggests that British Rail wouldn't have "had" the money to spend, it'd have been "saved" in the Treasury.

 

[yorksrob]

If there were any money saved then the cynic in me suggests that British Rail wouldn't have "had" the money to spend, it'd have been "saved" in the Treasury.

Well, that's true. The railway would probably have had to beg for the money back from the treasury to buy new trains.

plus ca change

 

[tbtc]

Well, that's true. The railway would probably have had to beg for the money back from the treasury to buy new trains.

plus ca change

True, sadly.

It's a bit like the "if we don't spend billions on HS2 we can spend the money on lots of other railway things instead" argument - if we don't spend the money on what the Government have intended it for then they don't allow the railway to spend it on something "better" instead.

Not saying I agree with this, just that it's how things are.

 

[yorksrob]

True, sadly.

It's a bit like the "if we don't spend billions on HS2 we can spend the money on lots of other railway things instead" argument - if we don't spend the money on what the Government have intended it for then they don't allow the railway to spend it on something "better" instead.

Not saying I agree with this, just that it's how things are.

That's indeed true. But with HS2 there's always the SNCF worry that the Government will see something wonderful and shiny and use it as an excuse to cut back on the bread and butter railway.

Not how it should be admittedly - but then again, so are a lot of things.

 

[MCR247]

Surely we could just swap the 458 panto car with a 460 trailer?!

 

[Nym]

And what airport run needs 8 car units.....

Oh, Heathrow Express? 332s to Yorkshire?
--- old post above --- --- new post below ---
Oh and come on, this is Alstom, it will be more complex than that, although you could do to swap out two per unit, 8 cars with one transformer is asking a lot.

 

[Lampshade]

And what airport run needs 8 car units.....

The idea is to stop pushing absolutely everything through to Manchester Airport, terminate North TPE at Victoria/Piccadilly/Liverpool and have Airport shuttles every 15 minutes with 460s:

- xx00 and xx30 stopping to MIA and fast to Crewe
- xx15 and xx45 fast to MIA and stopping to Crewe

 

[Nym]

The idea is to stop pushing absolutely everything through to Manchester Airport, terminate North TPE at Victoria/Piccadilly/Liverpool and have Airport shuttles every 15 minutes with 460s:

- xx00 and xx30 stopping to MIA and fast to Crewe
- xx15 and xx45 fast to MIA and stopping to Crewe

Won't fit in any of the platforms on the Styal Branch...

 

[Lampshade]

Won't fit in any of the platforms on the Styal Branch...

Shorten them to 6 cars and use the 'spare' cars to lengthen 458s?

 

[Ministry]

I'd never heard of the Networker Classic concept before now, but that demonstration vehicle looks very impressive. However, in hindsight it's probably just as well they didn't do it - a 15 year life extension from 1998-2000 would mean they would have been heading to the scrap heap in the not too distant future, and given the current state of public finances and the shambolic nature of the franchise system I doubt the money would have been available to procure all the new vehicles we would have needed.

That being said, aren't the 442s essentially the same concept? They're still around and have done 23 years' service to date so maybe the 15 year life extension was a bit pessimistic. Out of curiosity could the same thing be done with the 313s etc?

 

[jopsuk]

442s only used the traction motors/controls. The Networker Classic was to use the frame with a new body bolted on. Very different, and given one of the concerns with mrk1s was having a seperate body and frame I'm not sure I like the idea.

 

[150222]

DMUs in storage currently (From what I know, servicable DMUs) sits at 5 units (Actualy 4 as one is on short term lease) these would be the five 180 units currently out of use.

EMU wise, I think I'm right in saying that it's only the ex. Gatwick Express stock currently in store, and is prohibitively expensive to convert for use outside of 3rd rail land.

Mk3 wise, most users of this forum don't realise just how much work would need to be done to return a lot of these to use, they have been sat in storage for a long time, and there is actually a lot of equipment in a Mk3 to go wrong and deteriorate over a period of time.

I invite corrections

Don't forget the 3 class 150's currently stored at eastleigh.

 

[Nym]

RE: 460s You mean like what I said a few posts erlier?
--- old post above --- --- new post below ---

Don't forget the 3 class 150's currently stored at eastleigh.

Doh, havn't they offically been allocated to FGW yet?

 

[swt_passenger]

Doh, havn't they offically been allocated to FGW yet?

They (150002 and 150209) moved from Eastleigh to FGW about 10 days ago now.