transpennine Earlybird

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34D

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Hello,

I was looking at Leeds-Manchester seasons and I see the 'normal' one is £260.00 per month, and there is also an earlybird at £161.30, this states:

Outward service to arrive at its destination before 0730
Return depart between 1000 and 1600 or after 1830.

Question (considering Leeds Manc) if I miss 1P07 (leeds 05:55, pic 06:54, airport 07:12) do I have to wait until 1P69 23:47 leeds, pic 00:57 air 01:15?

Is it the train arriving at its destination (not yours) by 07:30 that matters? But departing from your departure station (not the trains)?

Must confess that the combination of a WY metrocard and TfGM system one countycard is tempting... (Note to others that there is much debate over whether this combination is valid - and would require a strong-willed person to test it)
 
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Deerfold

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Must confess that the combination of a WY metrocard and TfGM system one countycard is tempting... (Note to others that there is much debate over whether this combination is valid - and would require a strong-willed person to test it)
I don't think you'll find much debate amongst the guards on that line...

Not when they've gone to such trouble to ensure it's clear when going to South Yorkshire from West Yorkshire that you can do that:

http://www.wymetro.com/NR/rdonlyres/B460561C-C18A-4310-8764-791B3674EC0A/0/Rail_map2011.pdf

(with South Yorkshire and West Yorkshire tickets both having validity at a common station).
 

Anon Mouse

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the combination of a WYPTE Metrocard and TfGM system one is not valid. What happend between Marsden & Greenfield? Also as TPE don't stop between Huddersfield & Stalybridge/Piccadilly (depending which train you catch) you have a bit that has not been paid for. Now if supposing you got a GMPTE & TfGM passes and the train you caught was a northern stopper you would need a Marsden to Greenfield ticket or a TPE non stop between Huddersfield to Piccadilly you would need a Huddersfield to Manchester. It is a bit of a minefield and if you want the flexibility of any train at anytime you would need a normal season from Leeds to Manchester.
--- old post above --- --- new post below ---
I don't think you'll find much debate amongst the guards on that line...
what about the bit between Marsden and Greenfield? The OP will not have a valid ticket for this part of journey. Its certainly not a good idea to give the OP advice that may get him issued with a UFN or TIR, regardless of the chance of a Guard or Revenue Protection Officer picking up on it. The OP may have less bother if he additionally bought a Marsden to Greenfield season, but this would still be incorrect as the WYPTE Metrocard and TfGM System One are zonal tickets issuied by the PTE.
 
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Deerfold

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Deerfold

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so therefore he would be travelling fraudulentley and liable for prosecution, dodgy advice telling him he would not have much debate travelling with a Metrocard and System One
Who's advised him of that? I certainly haven't.

I said there was no debate amongst guards - there isn't. It's definitely not valid.

I was saying they've gone to so much trouble to say South-West yorkshire is fine that thay'd have done the same if West Yorks - Manchester was too. Apologies if that wasn't clear.

I've bought enough of the horrendously expensive Marsden - Greenfield tickets.
 

Anon Mouse

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Who's advised him of that? I certainly haven't.

I said there was no debate amongst guards - there isn't. It's definitely not valid.
Sorry mate, I may have misunderstood your point. I thought you were implying that as the OP may have little debate you were suggesting he used the GMPTE Metrocard and GMPTE System One for his journey.

My apologies
 

34D

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so therefore he would be travelling fraudulentley and liable for prosecution, dodgy advice telling him he would not have much debate travelling with a Metrocard and System One
Can I refer you to the maps for both tickets. You'll see that the orange line on the wypte map continues beyond Marsden and the red (iirc) line on the system one map continues beyond Greenfield.

I would be wrong if I said it was 100% valid. And you are also wrong for saying it is 100% invalid.

Now, earlybird please?
 

Deerfold

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Can I refer you to the maps for both tickets. You'll see that the orange line on the wypte map continues beyond Marsden and the red (iirc) line on the system one map continues beyond Greenfield.

I would be wrong if I said it was 100% valid. And you are also wrong for saying it is 100% invalid.
And I refer you to the leaflet I linked to earlier:

Metro leaflet said:
This leaflet explains where your Metro
prepaid or concessionary pass is valid
when you are travelling on buses or trains
that cross the boundary from West
Yorkshire into East, North or South
Yorkshire, Greater Manchester or
Lancashire.

Validity of West Yorkshire prepaid tickets,
young person’s and scholars passes:

Metro ticket conditions apply between
...
Leeds - Darton
...
Huddersfield - Marsden
...
Leeds - South Elmsall
--- old post above --- --- new post below ---
Marsden-Greenfield is similar in price to tickets purchased outside PTE areas.
I'd say it's at the high end of that. And locally it's very expensive, with an off peak day ticket for all trains in West Yorkshire being £6.20 or all trains in GM being £4.60 (£2.30 evenings only) and a single from Marsden - Greenfield being £5.40 (return £5.80 off peak).
--- old post above --- --- new post below ---
Now, earlybird please?

http://www.nationalrail.co.uk/times_fares/ticket_types/season_tickets.html

says:

National rail said:
'Early Bird' Season Tickets

First Transpennine Express offers discounted Season Tickets for travel on earlier trains.ravel between Huddersfield/Dewsbury/Leeds and Manchester Piccadilly for those passengers who can arrive at Manchester before 0730. The return journey must depart between 1000 and 1600, or after 1830.
So it sounds like it's Manchester timings that matter, allowing you to get the 0625 from Leeds.
 
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The arrival time is for YOUR destination not the trains, you can also buy a supplement to travel at peak times which must be bought before boarding, the supplement i think is called earlybird plus. I believe you can only get the earlybird seasons on flows into Manchester in the morning or at least that was the case a while back.
 
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SickyNicky

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I believe you can only get the earlybird seasons on flows into Manchester in the morning or at least that was the case a while back.
That's interesting because the fares data also shows the fare for the Manchester to Leeds direction.

However, the electronic version of the restriction code TH only shows a restriction into MAN in the morning, which backs up what you're saying.

It also means that data queries would find this ticket in the reverse flow and think it's valid ... if you could buy it online and get reservations, which you can't.
 

34D

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The arrival time is for YOUR destination not the trains, you can also buy a supplement to travel at peak times which must be bought before boarding, the supplement i think is called earlybird plus. I believe you can only get the earlybird seasons on flows into Manchester in the morning or at least that was the case a while back.
Many thanks
 

aformeruser

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I'd say it's at the high end of that. And locally it's very expensive, with an off peak day ticket for all trains in West Yorkshire being £6.20 or all trains in GM being £4.60 (£2.30 evenings only) and a single from Marsden - Greenfield being £5.40 (return £5.80 off peak).
It sounds like the off-peak fare increased more than others in January. £5.80 for an off-peak ticket and £6.40 for a peak ticket doesn't give much incentive for travelling off-peak. For Hartford to Runcorn, which is a similar distance, it's £5 off-peak and £6.70 peak.
 

Solent&Wessex

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Earlybird tickets are available in both directions.

They are valid on trains due to arrive at the origin / destination printed on the ticket (Forget stopping short etc) before 0730.

OR

Depart the origin / destination printed on the ticket on trains timed between 1000 & 1600 or after 1830.

Whilst this may be worded as outward journey and return journey on the validity information, this is essentially irrelevant. It doesn't matter which way you are travelling as long as it complies with those times. I have had this confirmed by official channels.

So, if you travelling from Leeds to Manchester with a Leeds to Manchester Earlybird you could catch any train up to and including the 0625, then any train from the 1008 to 1555 inclusive, then any train from the 1840 through to the 0625 the following morning, inclusive.
 

34D

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Earlybird tickets are available in both directions.

They are valid on trains due to arrive at the origin / destination printed on the ticket (Forget stopping short etc) before 0730.

OR

Depart the origin / destination printed on the ticket on trains timed between 1000 & 1600 or after 1830.

Whilst this may be worded as outward journey and return journey on the validity information, this is essentially irrelevant. It doesn't matter which way you are travelling as long as it complies with those times. I have had this confirmed by official channels.

So, if you travelling from Leeds to Manchester with a Leeds to Manchester Earlybird you could catch any train up to and including the 0625, then any train from the 1008 to 1555 inclusive, then any train from the 1840 through to the 0625 the following morning, inclusive.
Many thanks sir. Can you confirm the position regarding excesses (if someone with this ticket wishes to travel outside these times) please.
 

Solent&Wessex

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Many thanks sir. Can you confirm the position regarding excesses (if someone with this ticket wishes to travel outside these times) please.
An Earlybird Plus must be purchased from a ticket office. This costs £6 and covers the whole day. It basically turns it into an anytime season ticket for that date.

Earlybird Plus cannot be sold on trains - not just to stop people "trying it on" - but they aren't even in the Avantix machines, so even if we wanted to sell one we can't.
 
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£6 for the whole day is pretty good value, out of intrest would you have to sell anyone who hasnt bought the supplement a full anytime single?
 

34D

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An Earlybird Plus must be purchased from a ticket office. This costs £6 and covers the whole day. It basically turns it into an anytime season ticket for that date.

Earlybird Plus cannot be sold on trains - not just to stop people "trying it on" - but they aren't even in the Avantix machines, so even if we wanted to sell one we can't.
With presumably the caveat of the ticket office where their journey started being open. At a saving of £100 per month (normal season versus earlybird) the £6 per day is fine.

Can the whole season be excessed to the anytime season (either on train or at ticket office) please?
 

Solent&Wessex

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With presumably the caveat of the ticket office where their journey started being open. At a saving of £100 per month (normal season versus earlybird) the £6 per day is fine.

Can the whole season be excessed to the anytime season (either on train or at ticket office) please?
Well I don't know what we'd do if the office was closed as they aren't in Avantix!

As regards Excessing a season I don't know. It can't be done on Avantix so certainly not on trains. As for what can be done in a ticket office, you will need someone with ticket office knowledge for that one I'm afraid.
 
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