Transport operators should call out government advice to use cars?

[nedchester]

As a train guard I don’t want trains full of non essential travellers and then one of them passing this horrendous disease on to me putting my wife (who has asthma) at risk and making me lock down when I have elderly relatives to shop for.

The advice is to only use public transport for essential journeys (when there are no alternatives) for a good reason. To minimise spread. It is not saying that public transport is unhygienic, it is just to prevent large groups of people in a small space and thereby aiding social distancing.

Put it this way, when I am on shifts which would normally allow me to commute by train I am still driving into work as I have that option to help keep numbers down.

We must remember that this disease is a killer, one way of preventing it is to minimise contact with others.

But for how long do you think this should continue? 1 month, 3 months, 6 months, One year etc?

The way it is looking at the moment this disease could be in the community for years (without a vaccine). If people can't travel by public transport then we might as well shut it down causing many job loses on the railway (and elsewhere) including sadly yours. The effects of that in terms of economics, socially and healthcare don't bear thinking about.

 

[yorksrob]

But for how long do you think this should continue? 1 month, 3 months, 6 months, One year etc?

The way it is looking at the moment this disease could be in the community for years (without a vaccine). If people can't travel by public transport then we might as well shut it down causing many job loses on the railway (and elsewhere) including sadly yours. The effects of that in terms of economics, socially and healthcare don't bear thinking about.

Quite.

No society is going to pay for trains to cart around fresh air indefinately. Either public transport is used, or you may as well turn it over to freight.

The industry should be looking at this as a short term interlude to be used as an opportunity to learn from other countries, and work out how best to make the trains useable with minimal risk. Hoping that the passengers never come back isn't going to work for anyone.

 

[philosopher]

I will certainly return to rail once I am no longer asked not to use it. I suspect this will come in time as we get closer to full timetables and have a better understanding of actual demand levels. We've just started cautiously now.

I do not have a car, live in inner London, and although I can drive, I really do not like it in that it makes me very stressed. In fact I consider the risk to myself of me driving to be greater than that of getting Covid19 from public transport. Given this and the high cost of buying and maintaining a car, even in this circumstance it makes very little sense for me to buy a car, particularly when things will likely go back to normal next year when there is a vaccine.

 

[Bletchleyite]

I do not have a car, live in inner London, and although I can drive, I really do not like it in that it makes me very stressed. In fact I consider the risk to myself of me driving to be greater than that of getting Covid19 from public transport. Given this and the high cost of buying and maintaining a car, even in this circumstance it makes very little sense for me to buy a car, particularly when things will likely go back to normal next year when there is a vaccine.

If you live in inner London, assuming you aren't elderly or infirm, cycling or walking are probably better.

 

[philosopher]

If you live in inner London, assuming you aren't elderly or infirm, cycling or walking are probably better.

True, I can and do walk for the majority of the journeys, so this does factor into the calculation. I still do need some form of non active travel for longer journeys, though at the moment there is little reason to take any longer journey. This I suspect will probably change over the next couple months

 

[CaptainHaddock]

If you live in inner London, assuming you aren't elderly or infirm, cycling or walking are probably better.

I'm a keen cyclist but would never cycle through London; the traffic both in terms of volume and behaviour is horrendous.

If the government wants to encourage people in urban areas to walk or cycle instead of driving or using public transport it needs to ban private vehicles from city centres altogther. The odd "pop up" cycle lane here and there is no good if it only takes you as far as a busy junction or roundabout.

 

[squizzler]

I do not have a car, live in inner London, and although I can drive, I really do not like it in that it makes me very stressed. In fact I consider the risk to myself of me driving to be greater than that of getting Covid19 from public transport. Given this and the high cost of buying and maintaining a car, even in this circumstance it makes very little sense for me to buy a car, particularly when things will likely go back to normal next year when there is a vaccine.

In my opinion you have considered alternatives and decided you want to make your lawful journey on the transport system. End of. There is no need to feel uneasy and nothing to apologise for.

Take comfort that Government advice on how to travel is something people freely ignore. When John Prescott was in the full swing of his push towards integrated transport I don't recall Jeremy Clarkson being made to say: "Oh dear, it looks like we must all stop driving to benefit society, shame as all that motoring was fun whilst it lasted but I suppose it's government advise so it must be done."

 

[Neptune]

But for how long do you think this should continue? 1 month, 3 months, 6 months, One year etc?

The way it is looking at the moment this disease could be in the community for years (without a vaccine). If people can't travel by public transport then we might as well shut it down causing many job loses on the railway (and elsewhere) including sadly yours. The effects of that in terms of economics, socially and healthcare don't bear thinking about.

It’s more a case of short term pain long term gain. If people minimise interaction with others now, it enables this disease to be under control quicker and then we can start getting back to normal. If we are all allowed to go and take non essential travel on public transport, thereby naturally increasing the risk, the death rate could easily go back up and we‘re back to square one and in stay at home lockdown and who the hell wants that again.

I‘m pretty sure that if public transport was unrestricted and one of you got COVID 19 on a crowded train or bus you’d be having a right old go at the companies for allowing it.

Damned if you do, damned if you don’t.

 

[AM9]

It’s more a case of short term pain long term gain. If people minimise interaction with others now, it enables this disease to be under control quicker and then we can start getting back to normal. If we are all allowed to go and take non essential travel on public transport, thereby naturally increasing the risk, the death rate could easily go back up and we‘re back to square one and in stay at home lockdown and who the hell wants that again.

I‘m pretty sure that if public transport was unrestricted and one of you got COVID 19 on a crowded train or bus you’d be having a right old go at the companies for allowing it.

Damned if you do, damned if you don’t.

You haven't said what you mean by "short term" though. I think most here understand the mechanics of reducing transfer by proximity (whether the reason for that proximity is essential or frivolous is irrelevant) and I would suggest that even a reduced load of commuters (in a few weeks of returning to work), will present a greater risk if transmission than even a normal level of leisure travel, and given the deployment of capital assets and human resources is far more wasteful to provide the normal timetable, merely exacerbated the cost of keeping the transport networks conveniently lightly loaded.

 

[Neptune]

You haven't said what you mean by "short term" though. I think most here understand the mechanics of reducing transfer by proximity (whether the reason for that proximity is essential or frivolous is irrelevant) and I would suggest that even a reduced load of commuters (in a few weeks of returning to work), will present a greater risk if transmission than even a normal level of leisure travel, and given the deployment of capital assets and human resources is far more wasteful to provide the normal timetable, merely exacerbated the cost of keeping the transport networks conveniently lightly loaded.

What I mean is it will be a shorter term with the current restrictions than if we open it up as a free for all right now.

I’m as frustrated as anyone with the restrictions in place but I’d rather spend time at home safely self isolating when I’m not at work than going for trips out and increasing my own and my family’s risk. I’ve had 2 holidays cancelled, so be it. There’s always next year so long as this is brought under control as quickly as possible, with everyone doing all they can to prevent the spread, whether it takes a month, 2 months or 6 months.

You mention off peak travel being less risky than reduced people travelling in the peak even with the current uplift. You obviously don’t see off peak services up here which are busy at normal times on 2 car units and bear in mind more people have spare time on their hands with many people being furloughed and kids off school on top of those that normally travel.

I am an advocate for using public transport but these are not normal times. We have to do all we can now to prevent the spread and get it under control as quickly as possible.

 

[37424]

The way see is that if your in the high risks such as myself then you should try and avoid public transport if possible for the foreseeable future which is what I will be doing. If your not in the high risks groups then using public transport is much less of an issue, however under the current social distancing guidelines make public transport somewhat difficult and inefficient and clearly will struggle to carry more than essential passengers at certain time of the day, therefore the premise of the thread makes no sense at the current time, and we as yet don't if and when we will be able to return to some form of normality.

At present we don't know how the virus we play out in the long term, ie will we find a workable vaccine?, will be a threat for many years, will it cause significant changes in the way work with many more working from home etc, we simply know at this stage and as a result I would put all future public transport investment on hold until we can get a better idea as to how things will pan out.

 

[Neptune]

The way see is that if your in the high risks such as myself then you should try and avoid public transport if possible for the foreseeable future which is what I will be doing. If your not in the high risks groups then using public transport is much less of an issue, however under the current social distancing guidelines make public transport somewhat difficult and inefficient and clearly will struggle to carry more than essential passengers at certain time of the day, therefore the premise of the thread makes no sense at the current time, and we as yet don't if and when we will be able to return to some form of normality.

At present we don't know how the virus we play out in the long term, ie will we find a workable vaccine?, will be a threat for many years, will it cause significant changes in the way work with many more working from home etc, we simply know at this stage and as a result I would put all future public transport investment on hold until we can get a better idea as to how things will pan out.

Agreed.

I‘ve given my opinion on how I want to stay fit, well and alive during this pandemic so will not comment further.

 

[nedchester]

The way see is that if your in the high risks such as myself then you should try and avoid public transport if possible for the foreseeable future which is what I will be doing. If your not in the high risks groups then using public transport is much less of an issue, however under the current social distancing guidelines make public transport somewhat difficult and inefficient and clearly will struggle to carry more than essential passengers at certain time of the day, therefore the premise of the thread makes no sense at the current time, and we as yet don't if and when we will be able to return to some form of normality.

At present we don't know how the virus we play out in the long term, ie will we find a workable vaccine?, will be a threat for many years, will it cause significant changes in the way work with many more working from home etc, we simply know at this stage and as a result I would put all future public transport investment on hold until we can get a better idea as to how things will pan out.

But putting public transport on hold for any more than a couple of months longer is unrealistic.

 

[37424]

But putting public transport on hold for any more than a couple of months longer is unrealistic.

How is it unrealistic? we have see how the situation unfolds and adapt accordingly at present we don't know whether the virus will continue to decline or will start going up again as lockdown is eased, and we are not going to be clear on the long terms implications for some time.

 

[nedchester]

How is it unrealistic? we have see how the situation unfolds and adapt accordingly at present we don't know whether the virus will continue to decline or will start going up again as lockdown is eased, and we are not going to be clear on the long terms implications for some time.

Because as the lockdown is eased there will be a great need for people to travel to work. The government's view that 'work at home if you can' will not stand up to scrutiny once shops and other work places open.

Additionally, those without their own transport will wish to visit city centre shops, hospitals and other places.

Also if the weather starts to get poor then those who've been dusting off their bicycles during the recent fine weather....will return to the train. I am not saying numbers will return to pre-Covid levels but there will be a greater demand than is currently the case.

 

[carlberry]

Oddly whilst the government wants transport operators to implement social distancing (therefore harming the more environmentally friendly way of traveling), the most environmentally damaging is being allowed to resume as normal and because they have 'confined spaces', dont have to follow such rules!

Easyjet flights to resume

EasyJet has said it will resume some flights on 15 June, with all passengers and cabin crew told to wear face masks to protect against the coronavirus.

The airline announced that it would restart a "small number" of routes where there is enough customer demand.

The initial schedule will include domestic routes across the UK and France.

Easyjet will require customers to wear face coverings and they will be expected to provide their own.

From June, EasyJet will fly between UK airports including Gatwick, Bristol, Birmingham, Liverpool, Newcastle, Edinburgh and Belfast.

However using public transport to get to the airport will be discouraged of course!

 

[MDB1images]

Oddly whilst the government wants transport operators to implement social distancing (therefore harming the more environmentally friendly way of traveling), the most environmentally damaging is being allowed to resume as normal and because they have 'confined spaces', dont have to follow such rules!

Easyjet flights to resume

However using public transport to get to the airport will be discouraged of course!

Totally confusing and inconsistent approach.
The only defence I could give to the English Government is I presume the covid alert table will drop from a 4 to at least 3 by then so restrictions elsewhere will be eased.

 

[AM9]

Totally confusing and inconsistent approach.
The only defence I could give to the English Government is I presume the covid alert table will drop from a 4 to at least 3 by then so restrictions elsewhere will be eased.

Bear in mind that the Government always has an eye on its re-election prospects so it doesn't want to alienate too many of those that it sees as a way to continue in power.