Trivia: Unusual / Interesting Calling Patterns?

[dk1]

On Sunday 15:19 Carlisle to Nottingham (19:59)

Essentially just your standard Carlisle - Leeds then a Leeds - Nottingham but 'direct'

If your joints are still working after 4 hours and 40 minutes straight on a Northern service then congratulations!

Still less than Liverpool-Norwich in a 158, so not so bad really.

 

[Sad Sprinter]

There’s a Brighton to Victoria train in the early morning that calls at Selhurst, Thornton Heath, Norbury, Streatham Common, Balham and Clapham Junction. A great way to have a night out in Brighton without paying for a hotel!

I once caught a very unusual service from Hatfield to Kings Cross once. The fast trains from Hatfield were 27 and 57 mins past the hour, so you can imagine my surprise when an unusual 17:47 (I think it was) turned up with a pair of 313s, calling only at Finsbury Park and Kings Cross.

Well anyway, I got on, grumbling that we’re probably going to be stuck on the slows all the way to London. But as we were approaching the crossovers at Marshmoor, the driver shut off power, “we can’t be crossing onto the fasts, we’re on a 313!” I thought.

But we did, over onto the 110mph max up fast and the 313 absolutely opened up. We absolutely screamed through Porters Bar and Barnet tunnels and at New Barnet, the suspension was having such a difficult time flying over the crossovers at 75mph luggage was flying off the overhead racks. We were still flying at max speed through Hornsey and Haringey before breaking hard into Finsbury Park. What a journey. I never did catch it again.

 

[JRT]

Each week day there is a Lancaster - Carnforth - Morecambe service that approaches Morecambe on the North Morecambe Curve via Hest Bank; it is the only booked passenger service to use the North Morecambe Curve all day, it usually being reserved for freights going to and from Heysham Nuclear, as well as engine and tamper moves; all other passenger services approach from Lancaster, via the South Morecambe Curve.

Presumably this is scheduled for route knowledge retention purposes.

There has to be a service on the Carnforth – Morecambe (direct) route, otherwise don't they have to apply for a line closure?
I doesn't matter where the service commences or terminates — it has varied through the years, eg.
for many years (1980s) the Leeds – Morecambe trains didn't call at Lancaster (change at Carnforth), before being revised to serve Lancaster & Morecambe.
Later, one late afternoon service ran Leeds – Lancaster – Morecambe – (direct)– Leeds
For a while there was a late night Lancaster – Morecambe – Oxenholme (Kendal/Windermere?) service

 

[Class15]

I once caught a very unusual service from Hatfield to Kings Cross once. The fast trains from Hatfield were 27 and 57 mins past the hour, so you can imagine my surprise when an unusual 17:47 (I think it was) turned up with a pair of 313s, calling only at Finsbury Park and Kings Cross.

Well anyway, I got on, grumbling that we’re probably going to be stuck on the slows all the way to London. But as we were approaching the crossovers at Marshmoor, the driver shut off power, “we can’t be crossing onto the fasts, we’re on a 313!” I thought.

But we did, over onto the 110mph max up fast and the 313 absolutely opened up. We absolutely screamed through Porters Bar and Barnet tunnels and at New Barnet, the suspension was having such a difficult time flying over the crossovers at 75mph luggage was flying off the overhead racks. We were still flying at max speed through Hornsey and Haringey before breaking hard into Finsbury Park. What a journey. I never did catch it again.

That sounds like an amazing journey!

 

[enginedin]

(I originally inadvertently put this in the past unusual routes thread... and apologies if it's been mentioned already)

I was surprised by the daily Transport for Wales Birmingham International - Manchester Picadilly route via Telford & Chester (https://www.realtimetrains.co.uk/service/gb-nr:L40335/2024-11-25/detailed). I assume it's convenient for TfW to have a late outbound Birmingham->halfway to Holyhead that then turns into a late Halfway from LLandudno->Manchester, or is there a different reason?

 

[cle]

There’s a Brighton to Victoria train in the early morning that calls at Selhurst, Thornton Heath, Norbury, Streatham Common, Balham and Clapham Junction. A great way to have a night out in Brighton without paying for a hotel!

I once caught a very unusual service from Hatfield to Kings Cross once. The fast trains from Hatfield were 27 and 57 mins past the hour, so you can imagine my surprise when an unusual 17:47 (I think it was) turned up with a pair of 313s, calling only at Finsbury Park and Kings Cross.

Well anyway, I got on, grumbling that we’re probably going to be stuck on the slows all the way to London. But as we were approaching the crossovers at Marshmoor, the driver shut off power, “we can’t be crossing onto the fasts, we’re on a 313!” I thought.

But we did, over onto the 110mph max up fast and the 313 absolutely opened up. We absolutely screamed through Porters Bar and Barnet tunnels and at New Barnet, the suspension was having such a difficult time flying over the crossovers at 75mph luggage was flying off the overhead racks. We were still flying at max speed through Hornsey and Haringey before breaking hard into Finsbury Park. What a journey. I never did catch it again.

Having some deja vu about 313s on fasts (semis) from Euston to Watford in the era when they called at Queens Park... pans up obviously and at speed.

 

[GN Boy]

There’s a Brighton to Victoria train in the early morning that calls at Selhurst, Thornton Heath, Norbury, Streatham Common, Balham and Clapham Junction. A great way to have a night out in Brighton without paying for a hotel!

I once caught a very unusual service from Hatfield to Kings Cross once. The fast trains from Hatfield were 27 and 57 mins past the hour, so you can imagine my surprise when an unusual 17:47 (I think it was) turned up with a pair of 313s, calling only at Finsbury Park and Kings Cross.

Well anyway, I got on, grumbling that we’re probably going to be stuck on the slows all the way to London. But as we were approaching the crossovers at Marshmoor, the driver shut off power, “we can’t be crossing onto the fasts, we’re on a 313!” I thought.

But we did, over onto the 110mph max up fast and the 313 absolutely opened up. We absolutely screamed through Porters Bar and Barnet tunnels and at New Barnet, the suspension was having such a difficult time flying over the crossovers at 75mph luggage was flying off the overhead racks. We were still flying at max speed through Hornsey and Haringey before breaking hard into Finsbury Park. What a journey. I never did catch it again.

What a great story. I absolutely loved driving the 313s on the fasts!

 

[Magdalia]

I once caught a very unusual service from Hatfield to Kings Cross once. The fast trains from Hatfield were 27 and 57 mins past the hour, so you can imagine my surprise when an unusual 17:47 (I think it was) turned up with a pair of 313s, calling only at Finsbury Park and Kings Cross.

This was a booked working for class 313s in the early 2010s, 174x Welwyn GC-Kings Cross, the departure time varying by a few minutes from year to year.

There were similar trains off Welwyn GC at 1640 and 1710, but those were usually outer suburban units that had stabled in Welwyn carriage sidings during the day.

They called at Hatfield, Potters Bar and Finsbury Park only, the same stopping pattern as the Cambridge/Peterborough-Kings Cross slows, but I don't know which, if any, were booked to use the fast line.

In those days Kings Cross panel turned any Hatfield, Potters Bar and Finsbury Park only trains out onto the up fast at Marshmoor if there were no fast trains approaching, mainly because it was a 70mph crossover, whereas the crossover at the south end of Potters Bar was 40mph.

Some very fast start to stop times could be achieved Potters Bar-Finsbury Park if the start and stop were both on the fast line.

 

[moonarrow458]

The southern WCML throws up a number of odd calling patterns on a Sunday evening, which presumably relate to the shutdown to 2 track operation after 20:00, although the exact reasons behind the timetabling of each service and the resultant calling patterns does baffle me somewhat.

2K51 - 20:10 Euston to Milton Keynes calls at all stations up to Cheddington then non-stop to Milton Keynes skipping BOTH leighton Buzzard and Bletchley, despite having 5 mins pathing time between Cheddington and Milton Keynes

Then theres 2 Milton Keynes Terminators that depart Euston within 3 minutes of each other with different stopping patterns:
2K53 - 20:39 Euston to Milton Keynes - calls at Watford, Hemel, Berkhamstead, Tring and Milton Keynes (arr. 21:34)
1K57 - 20:42 Euston to Milton Keynes - calls at Leighton Buzzard, Bletchley and Milton Keynes (arr. 21:30)
What makes this pair even odder is that 1K57 overtakes 2K53 and arrives at MKC first, so i'm not entirely sure where or exactly when the two track section begins, but 1K57 and 2K53 combine at MKC to form empties to Blethchley C.S

2N59 - 21:40 Euston to Northampton - calls at Harrow, Bushey (set down only), Watford then non-stop to Leighton Buzzard, then Milton Keynes, Wolverton and Northampton. Utterly bizzare calling pattern.
It seems 2Y59 at 21:31 to Birmingham New Street makes all the station calls between Watford and Milton Keynes hence 2N59 running fast from Watford to Leighton Buzzard after stopping at the Outer London stations. 2Y59 sits at Northampton for 24 minutes from 22:48 to 23:12 and 2N59 arrives at NMP at 22:55 so it's surprising they don't terminate 2Y59 at NMP and have 2N59 be the through running service to Birmingham as that would reduce the journey time to stations north of Northampton.

Then there are 4 stopping services from Euston to Northampton within 30 mnutes - roughly one every ten minutes, each with a slightly different calling pattern:
2N63 - 22:31 EUS - NMP all stations except Tring and Cheddington
2N65 - 22:42 EUS - NMP all stations except Bushey, Kings Langley, Apsley, Wolverton
2N67 - 22:53 EUS - NMP all stations except Kings Langley, Apsley, Cheddington
2N69 - 23:00 EUS - NMP all stations except Bushey

And on a Saturday evening 2B55 - 19:09 Euston - Bletchley calls at all stations except Apsley creating an hours gap northbound at Apsley, whilst Kings Langley still retains its call, following it is 2K57 at 19:19 to Milton Keynes which is essentially a Tring semi-fast extended to Milton keynes, running non-stop from Cheddington to Milton Keynes.

 

[A S Leib]

Sticking with the Sunday evening WCML, the 20:13 Crewe to Euston runs via Northampton and stops at every LNR station on the way except Polesworth.

 

[Intercity_225]

Does the 04:12 Kings Cross to Letchworth count? Yes, it is a staff train but it runs non-stop to New Barnet, skipping Finsbury Park & Alexandra Palace, and then runs as a normal Letchworth stopper.

 

[gg1]

An odd one I remember in the 80s was a single InterCity service per day (probably to either Paddington or Poole, can't remember which) calling at Marston Green in the evening, especially odd when you bear in mind it's only around 1.5 miles from the next stop at Birmingham International. I don't recall there being an equivalent northbound call.

 

[jfollows]

An odd one I remember in the 80s was a single InterCity service per day (probably to either Paddington or Poole, can't remember which) calling at Marston Green in the evening, especially odd when you bear in mind it's only around 1.5 miles from the next stop at Birmingham International. I don't recall there being an equivalent northbound call.

Hampton-in-Arden similarly, for example https://www.railforums.co.uk/thread...he-1970s-early-80s.228284/page-4#post-5545130 (in the 1970s)

 

[BeijingDave]

In the 80s/90s, I recall there were a number of WCML Intercity services with Hartford calls.

I wonder if these were ever well-used? I suppose they probably weren't or they might continue.

From what I know of the local area (cousin lives in Weaverham) people from Northwich are quite used to driving to Warrington or Crewe if they need a WCML service anyway.

Maybe if they had renamed it 'Northwich West', built a bigger (cheap) car park and had more services it might have been successful.

 

[Doomotron]

A few Southeastern services going between Sandwich and Ramsgate stop and reverse at Minster to serve as a school train. It's only a handful of trains in the morning in afternoon, which are longer than the standard ones. The afternoon one(s) is a Dover Priory to Victoria service via Ramsgate, and the morning service(s) is Faversham to Charing Cross services via Ramsgate and Dover.

A number of Ramsgate to Charing Cross services have, in the past, stopped at New Cross and/or St Johns, but I don't know what the reason for it was.

 

[gg1]

In the 80s/90s, I recall there were a number of WCML Intercity services with Hartford calls.

I wonder if these were ever well-used? I suppose they probably weren't or they might continue.

From what I know of the local area (cousin lives in Weaverham) people from Northwich are quite used to driving to Warrington or Crewe if they need a WCML service anyway.

Maybe if they had renamed it 'Northwich West', built a bigger (cheap) car park and had more services it might have been successful.

Wasn't Hartford a standard calling point for most/all InterCity services to Liverpool at one point?

 

[Bevan Price]

Wasn't Hartford a standard calling point for most/all InterCity services to Liverpool at one point?

Yes - but only for a minority of services. The platforms were shortened a few years ago and now are only long enough for 8 coach Class 350 formations.

== Doublepost prevention - post automatically merged: 28 Nov 2024 ==

Wigan to Liverpool via St Helens Central throws up a handful of oddities -
1F02 gains Garswood, Prescot, Roby & Broad Green
2C25 skips Broad Green & Edge Hill
1F02 gains Broad Green (this follows 2C25)
1F09 gains Roby, Broad Green, Wavertree & Edge Hill
2C34 gains Bryn, Garswood, Thatto Heath, Eccleston Park & Prescot but misses everything between Huyton & Liverpool (having come from Blackpool on this headcode)

There is also 09:24 (SX) Wigan NW to Liverpool that calls at Newton Le Willows, St. Helens Jn, Lea Green, Rainhill, Huyton & Liverpool only. (omitting Earlestown)

There are two trains in the opposite direction.
15:42 (SX) Liverpool - Wigan calls at Huyton, Rainhill, Lea Green, St. Helens Junction, Earleatown then Wigan (omitting Newton Le Willows)
18:31(SX) Liverpool - Wigan calls at all stations to Newton Le Willows then Wigan.

Presumably these exist mainly to retain route knowledge, as they hardly provide a useful service between Wigan and stations Newton Le Willows to Whiston / Huyton. ?

 

[dk1]

An overnight Norwich-Liverpool Street via Cambridge used to call at Turkey Street.

 

[Jimini]

An overnight Norwich-Liverpool Street via Cambridge used to call at Turkey Street.

That's delightfully random!

 

[Babybirdrobin]

The first Southend to London of the day also calls at Severn Kings for staff, I’ve travelled on that a few times and it feels really surreal with Severn Kings on a GA service, I though though before reading this thread that it was the remains of the occasional extended Shenfield metro services that ended up in Southend but staff purposes definitely makes more sense

 

[alistairlees]

The Chelsfield fasts have existed in some form or other since the mid 70s (originally from CHX not CST) - as first introduced they provided convenient connections to Knockholt and Dunton Green which otherwise had no peak service to/from LBG/WAE/CHX. These days I imagine the prime market is Chelsfield-City commuters themselves, of which I imagine there are still many.

There has, however, never been a High Brooms to Chelsfield non-stop service until this recent change.

 

[BeijingDave]

That's delightfully random!

Things like this are usually for staff drops/pickups.

== Doublepost prevention - post automatically merged: 29 Nov 2024 ==

Around 1988-89 there used to be an early morning service that started at Greenfield. Presumably because this was the outer edge of GMPTE.

 

[Jimini]

Things like this are usually for staff drops/pickups.

== Doublepost prevention - post automatically merged: 29 Nov 2024 ==

Around 1988-89 there used to be an early morning service that started at Greenfield. Presumably because this was the outer edge of GMPTE.

Agreed -- have experienced many of these on late night trains in south London stopping at Selhurst unadvertised, for example.

Turkey Street just seems so random, hence the initial reply!

 

[MadMac]

The Carstairs/Glasgow Central Low Level workings, one train Down in the morning and one Up in the evening, are long-standing trains, dating back to when Carstairs had no other Scotrail/local services. They also had the benefit of retaining Route knowledge between Lanark Junction and Carstairs.

The evening Carstairs service used to run to Beattock. I recently found out that without realising it, I was on the very last one before Beattock station closed.

== Doublepost prevention - post automatically merged: 29 Nov 2024 ==

Retired SR Guard Bill Hayles (R.I.P.) told the story of receiving a “Please Explain“ asking why his train had not called at Denmark Hill: he replied to the effect that it was not booked to do so. Next day, he received another “Please Explain“ asking the same question: he referred to his response to the previous one. Two days later, he receives yet another asking him why said train had stopped there when it was not booked to do so: he replied along the lines of “I stopped the train there in what was a clearly futile attempt to put an end to these memos”. He never heard another word about it. It was apparently the only train that didn’t stop at Denmark Hill…..

 

[infobleep]

An overnight Norwich-Liverpool Street via Cambridge used to call at Turkey Street.

I guess when they decided to not stop there any more, they went cold Turkey... Street.

 

[dk1]

I guess when they decided to not stop there any more, they went cold Turkey... Street.

Don’t give up that day job

 

[Magdalia]

An overnight Norwich-Liverpool Street via Cambridge used to call at Turkey Street.

I suspect that someone is pulling your leg here.

There was only one overnight Norwich-Liverpool Street via Cambridge and it ran via the Lea Valley and Stratford.

 

[dk1]

I suspect that someone is pulling your leg here.

There was only one overnight Norwich-Liverpool Street via Cambridge and it ran via the Lea Valley and Stratford.

I was working on the railway at Norwich then. No leg pulling.

 

[Magdalia]

I was working on the railway at Norwich then. No leg pulling.

The overnight Norwich-Liverpool Street ceased to be advertised as a passenger train in May 1982, though it ran for a while after as an unadvertised mail train.

The booked route did not pass through Turkey Street. I have the WTT for the last year that it ran as a passenger train. It was booked to pass Brimsdown at 0155.

 

[Railman88]

There’s a GA service in one of the peaks which is non-stop Ingatestone to Liverpool Street. Always wondered why but I assume it’s so the train doesn’t get crammed with commuters getting on at Shenfield or Stratford

There’s a GA service in one of the peaks which is non-stop Ingatestone to Liverpool Street. Always wondered why but I assume it’s so the train doesn’t get crammed with commuters getting on at Shenfield or Stratford

It doesn't happen any more, but there is a service which starts at Ingatestone and goes to Colchester (2F66), which is used as a service to take children home from Anglo European School.