Two new stations: Bermuda Park and Coventry (previously Ricoh) Arena

[trubla]

Similar report on local BBC tv news programme tonight. LM spokeperson said they couldn't obtain any more diesel units to provide a better service. The reporter did say that when the line is electrified, the position might change.

 

[nuneatonmark]

Similar report on local BBC tv news programme tonight. LM spokeperson said they couldn't obtain any more diesel units to provide a better service. The reporter did say that when the line is electrified, the position might change.

Electrification is years away, what is needed now is a commitment to open phase 2 ASAP, that will include capacity for at least 2 trains per hour and a dedicated bay platform at Coventry, no delivery date yet though. It has been pointed out many, many times that building the new stations without longer, more frequent trains is just stupid. The chickens are now coming home to roost. In part this is LM waiting for someone to put their hands in their pocket to stump up extra money or to run charters for events, If there was money, then I am sure the longer trains would magically appear.

 

[87015]

Similar report on local BBC tv news programme tonight. LM spokeperson said they couldn't obtain any more diesel units to provide a better service. The reporter did say that when the line is electrified, the position might change.

What a load of spin. All those units that sit outside Tyseley at weekends as the peak strengthening doesnt happen obviously not spare at all honest guv... Just too difficult to do a few unit and crew swaps to get something else down there.

 

[The Planner]

Electrification is years away, what is needed now is a commitment to open phase 2 ASAP, that will include capacity for at least 2 trains per hour and a dedicated bay platform at Coventry, no delivery date yet though. It has been pointed out many, many times that building the new stations without longer, more frequent trains is just stupid. The chickens are now coming home to roost. In part this is LM waiting for someone to put their hands in their pocket to stump up extra money or to run charters for events, If there was money, then I am sure the longer trains would magically appear.

Like I said in #175 though, if this was partly funded by a time limited grant such as ERDF then they had to do it or they would lose the cash and it would never be built, why do you think phase 2 is flat on its arse? I'm not sure why the chickens are coming home to roost, everybody, including Coventry council would have known there wasn't the stock to do it. As for LM wanting someone else to pay, find me a TOC that wouldn't.

 

[bluenoxid]

Would a 153 hopping backwards and forwards between there and Coventry with bustitution on the remainder of the route for a few hours be an option?

Is the route cleared for Voyagers and can one park at Ricoh whilst a match is on and normal service remains. Is it also cleared for 170's and 150's?

There are some positive opportunities for this station.

 

[HSTEd]

5.5 route kilometres between Ricoh Arena and the termination of the current electrification at Coventry yard.
Peak linespeed between Bedworth and Coventry is only 45mph.

You would electrify both lines as far as the Prologis park line, after which you would electrify the last 1200m of the down line (towards Nuneaton) only.
That totals up at roughly 9.8km of low grade OLE is all it would take and you could run 12-car EMU shuttles on match days. You would use a wrong direction between the platform and the crossover to avoid the need for a new crossover and save some extra OLE.

In BR days it probably would have done - as it was at Old Trafford (electrification out to the ground but apparently no further).

They could take some extra 319s (that they are taking on to replace the 321s) to run the shuttle which would be available for Strengthening at other times.

9.8km of trolley wire probably wouldn't take much more than the station cost really - especially since you could be far looser with possessions on such a lightly used route.

 

[nuneatonmark]

5.5 route kilometres between Ricoh Arena and the termination of the current electrification at Coventry yard.
Peak linespeed between Bedworth and Coventry is only 45mph.

You would electrify both lines as far as the Prologis park line, after which you would electrify the last 1200m of the down line (towards Nuneaton) only.
That totals up at roughly 9.8km of low grade OLE is all it would take and you could run 12-car EMU shuttles on match days. You would use a wrong direction between the platform and the crossover to avoid the need for a new crossover and save some extra OLE.

In BR days it probably would have done - as it was at Old Trafford (electrification out to the ground but apparently no further).

They could take some extra 319s (that they are taking on to replace the 321s) to run the shuttle which would be available for Strengthening at other times.

9.8km of trolley wire probably wouldn't take much more than the station cost really - especially since you could be far looser with possessions on such a lightly used route.

It's all quite do-able within a reasonable amount of time and within a reasonable cost but requires 'someone' to take ownership and the will to get it done. Up to now it's been beset with delays and increases in costs. Neither local councils or anyone else has yet shown the necessary leadership to sort out these issues and get a proper service introduced.

Well done everyone! Two new stations, more passengers, but still a poxy 1 coach 153 shuttles along at a crawl once an hour which cannot be used for any events at the Ricoh, what an 'own goal'!

 

[LesF]

There are hundreds of buses each day passing Arena Park on Foleshill Road, a short walk from Ricoh Arena. Try the Traveline website - it will tell you which bus to catch at the time you want to travel.
No-one has mentioned the Vivarail D-trains that Adrian Shooter's firm is renovating from disused London tube stock. They are expected to be approved for main line use this autumn. That's years before any diesels will become available through electrification. LM operate the one-off Parry People Mover on the Stourbridge Town branch so why not operate D-trains on the Cov-Nuneaton line?
The snag with extra match-day trains is that the Wasps play on Sundays when LM staff only work if they want to. Employment legislation dictates that a future proprietor of the franchise (Centro or anyone else) has to preserve the same conditions of employment of the staff transferred to the new operator, including Sunday working being voluntary.
Hopefully Centro's next CEO will be more successful at getting rail development in WM than Geoff Inskip who is leaving.
And we have the prospect of an enlarged Centro area following the creation next year of the West Midlands Combined Authority (Mercia?).
Sounds like a new thread emerging.

 

[Xenophon PCDGS]

Are all the "official" sources keeping a very low profile at this point in time?

 

[chiltern trev]

Re units outside Tyseley at week-ends – how many on a Saturday and how many on a Sunday? Presumably the number does not vary during the day as there are no Saturday or Sunday peaks.

Which depot(s) provide the Class 153 and the train crew for the Coventry to Nuneaton line?

Needless to say, the article published by the Coventry Telegraph (and also the BBC) has not gone down well with Wasps fans and as well as being discussed a the bottom of the Coventry Telegraph article it is also being discussed on a Wasps fans Facebook group and other forums – the overall overwhelming comment is totally unfavourable for the railways and London Midland.

Having commuted by Chiltern Railways into London in the past, I know that Chiltern have units sitting around between the am and pm peaks and hence why on week-ends when the WCML into Euston is closed, the half hourly 4 car service each way Birmingham and Marylebone can be increased to half hourly 8 cars each way and on Wembley week-end match days when Aston Villa were playing at Wembley at the end of last season additional long (6,7 or 8 car) trains were run in addition to the normal service being 8 cars.

So if London Midland have no spare units, why not contract in some Chiltern units, or rob the London Midland Snow Hill services of units and back fill the Snow Hill services with Chiltern Units.

I am also guessing that the London Midland franchise was won on the basis on a 1 car train very hour for Coventry to Nuneaton, hence London Midland will be claiming change of franchise/contract and thus want more money.

So more passengers means more fares means more money unless the longer distance fares to the Ricoh happen to be the same as booking to the main Coventry station.

Wasps provide free shuttle buses between Coventry station and the Ricoh, so perhaps London Midland think they can have that money (that Wasps pay out or the free shuttle buses)

Wasps fan.

 

[Julian W]

Do we have an official opening date for the Arena station yet? Travelling to the Arena for an event next month and wondering if it will be easier to just take a bus like the footy fans!

 

[adrock1976]

5.5 route kilometres between Ricoh Arena and the termination of the current electrification at Coventry yard.
Peak linespeed between Bedworth and Coventry is only 45mph.

You would electrify both lines as far as the Prologis park line, after which you would electrify the last 1200m of the down line (towards Nuneaton) only.
That totals up at roughly 9.8km of low grade OLE is all it would take and you could run 12-car EMU shuttles on match days. You would use a wrong direction between the platform and the crossover to avoid the need for a new crossover and save some extra OLE.

In BR days it probably would have done - as it was at Old Trafford (electrification out to the ground but apparently no further).

They could take some extra 319s (that they are taking on to replace the 321s) to run the shuttle which would be available for Strengthening at other times.

9.8km of trolley wire probably wouldn't take much more than the station cost really - especially since you could be far looser with possessions on such a lightly used route.

It's all quite do-able within a reasonable amount of time and within a reasonable cost but requires 'someone' to take ownership and the will to get it done. Up to now it's been beset with delays and increases in costs. Neither local councils or anyone else has yet shown the necessary leadership to sort out these issues and get a proper service introduced.

Well done everyone! Two new stations, more passengers, but still a poxy 1 coach 153 shuttles along at a crawl once an hour which cannot be used for any events at the Ricoh, what an 'own goal'!

A thought has come into my mind here. In regards to electrification of Coventry - Nuneaton, you might as well do it properly first time round.

By doing it properly first time round, the present London Euston - Birmingham NS service via Northampton could run as 8 (or 12 depending on platform lengths at the smaller stations along the London & Birmingham Railway) to Coventry, with a portion detaching for Nuneaton. Similarly, the southbound run from Nuneaton could then attach to the portion(s) from Birmingham NS to continue to Euston.

This would eliminate the layover that is presently required for the shuttle service. However, I have a feeling that The Planner may find a flaw that would make my suggestion unworkable due to the volume of traffic that passes through Coventry.

 

[geoffk]

Headingley trains seem to cope with cricket crowds and extras are sometimes put on. Electrification to Rugeley will release some dmus but where will they go?

 

[The Planner]

A thought has come into my mind here. In regards to electrification of Coventry - Nuneaton, you might as well do it properly first time round.

By doing it properly first time round, the present London Euston - Birmingham NS service via Northampton could run as 8 (or 12 depending on platform lengths at the smaller stations along the London & Birmingham Railway) to Coventry, with a portion detaching for Nuneaton. Similarly, the southbound run from Nuneaton could then attach to the portion(s) from Birmingham NS to continue to Euston.

This would eliminate the layover that is presently required for the shuttle service. However, I have a feeling that The Planner may find a flaw that would make my suggestion unworkable due to the volume of traffic that passes through Coventry.

You did ask, the stations between Cov and Nuneaton can't do 4 car trains and aren't being extended to that length as part of this....

Splitting and joining at Cov would be seen as a bit of a risk considering the traffic, it isn't like it's Northampton where you are the sole operator mingling with freight.

 

[Mugby]

Even if there are spare units at weekends, my guess is that working them from Tyesley to Coventry is something LM simply can't be bothered with.

Apart from anything else, if they were 153s or 170s, effective fare collection from hordes of football fans on such units, on such a short journey would be well nigh impossible, something LM are no doubt very well aware of.

 

[james60059]

Is the route cleared for Voyagers and can one park at Ricoh whilst a match is on and normal service remains. Is it also cleared for 170's and 150's?

There are some positive opportunities for this station.

It is cleared for Class 170's as there used to be Coventry - Nottingham service in Central Trains days until 2004-ish with reversal at Nuneaton towards Leicester and beyond. Class 150's have also used the route in the distant past.

As for Voyagers I have no idea, although I remember seeing a Class 47 hauled train many years ago at Hawkesbury Lane level crossing (it was in 1993 as I was about to start secondary school at Woodway Park in Coventry)

 

[HLE]

Re units outside Tyseley at week-ends – how many on a Saturday and how many on a Sunday? Presumably the number does not vary during the day as there are no Saturday or Sunday peaks.

Which depot(s) provide the Class 153 and the train crew for the Coventry to Nuneaton line?

Needless to say, the article published by the Coventry Telegraph (and also the BBC) has not gone down well with Wasps fans and as well as being discussed a the bottom of the Coventry Telegraph article it is also being discussed on a Wasps fans Facebook group and other forums – the overall overwhelming comment is totally unfavourable for the railways and London Midland.

Having commuted by Chiltern Railways into London in the past, I know that Chiltern have units sitting around between the am and pm peaks and hence why on week-ends when the WCML into Euston is closed, the half hourly 4 car service each way Birmingham and Marylebone can be increased to half hourly 8 cars each way and on Wembley week-end match days when Aston Villa were playing at Wembley at the end of last season additional long (6,7 or 8 car) trains were run in addition to the normal service being 8 cars.

So if London Midland have no spare units, why not contract in some Chiltern units, or rob the London Midland Snow Hill services of units and back fill the Snow Hill services with Chiltern Units.

I am also guessing that the London Midland franchise was won on the basis on a 1 car train very hour for Coventry to Nuneaton, hence London Midland will be claiming change of franchise/contract and thus want more money.

So more passengers means more fares means more money unless the longer distance fares to the Ricoh happen to be the same as booking to the main Coventry station.

Wasps provide free shuttle buses between Coventry station and the Ricoh, so perhaps London Midland think they can have that money (that Wasps pay out or the free shuttle buses)

Wasps fan.

Only Coventry traincrew sign the Coventry to Nuneaton line and operate it.

 

[chiltern trev]

Re "effective fare collection from hordes of football fans on such units, on such a short journey would be well nigh impossible, something LM are no doubt very well aware of."

Fare collection is not a problem at Twickenham on match days even wth a full house of 82000/83000 and about 20000 pass through Twickenham. Everyone gets directed out via the car park where a large tent (5m * 12m) for wet weather and a sun shade is erected at the car park exit fitted with simple vertical barriers (similar to a security check at an airport) in order to create about 12 exits 'gates' and plenty of staff to check every exit gate, every person, collect all the excess fares and staff back down the exit line well before the barrier to catch persons runing back to avoid the ticket check.

I suspect Chiltern Railways also do a full ticket check at Wembley Stadium.

So can be done.

 

[OwlMan]

Re "effective fare collection from hordes of football fans on such units, on such a short journey would be well nigh impossible, something LM are no doubt very well aware of."

Fare collection is not a problem at Twickenham on match days even wth a full house of 82000/83000 and about 20000 pass through Twickenham. Everyone gets directed out via the car park where a large tent (5m * 12m) for wet weather and a sun shade is erected at the car park exit fitted with simple vertical barriers (similar to a security check at an airport) in order to create about 12 exits 'gates' and plenty of staff to check every exit gate, every person, collect all the excess fares and staff back down the exit line well before the barrier to catch persons runing back to avoid the ticket check.

I suspect Chiltern Railways also do a full ticket check at Wembley Stadium.

So can be done.

But the Ricoh Arena is not Twickenham or Wembley - it is a much smaller stadium and all the extra traffic will be from Coventry (fare probably less than £2) and there is probably not the capacity at Coventry to run extra trains.

 

[chiltern trev]

For information, here are the attendances for Wasps games at the Ricoh.

21 Dec 2014 London Irish 28,254 Aviva Premiership
01 Jan 2015 Sale Sharks 15,343 Aviva Premiership
24 Jan 2015 Leinster 23,493 European Cup
01 Feb 2015 Cardiff Blues 9,640 LV Cup
15 Feb 2015 Harlequins 16,116 Aviva Premiership
01 Mar 2015 Gloucester 14,056 Aviva Premiership
08 Mar 2015 Saracens 16,874 Aviva Premiership
26 April 2015 Exeter 16,712 Aviva Premiership
16 May 2015 Leicester Tigers 32,019 Aviva Premiership - nearly a full house

 

[jfollows]

Is the route cleared for Voyagers?

Yes.

Used for short-notice diversions, such as when Birmingham New Street is blocked, I've done it on a Manchester-Southampton service in the past.

 

[paulb1973]

Yes.

Used for short-notice diversions, such as when Birmingham New Street is blocked, I've done it on a Manchester-Southampton service in the past.

And the 15-coach [3 joined together] Virgin blockbusters have also run that way too, heading to Nuneaton.

 

[Mugby]

Thanks to chiltern trev for those interesting statistics, particularly the last one. If such attendances are repeated, which they certainly will be, lets assume that a third of the last number may wish to visit the arena by train.

How would 10,000 people be accommodated on an extra Cl.153?

 

[LesF]

Mugby, I think it's optimistic that 10,000 people will want to travel south from Coventry Arena after a match. Most of the crowd will be dispersing locally by bus and car.
The plan is to keep a 6-car train at Coventry north yard, ready for events that justify it, maybe twice a week. 6 x 75 = 450 seated passengers + standees. It could run in addition to the timetabled service, but I think it would merit running instead of the normal service, and to Nuneaton as well as to Coventry. No additional train staff or paths are needed. That could take 2 x 450 = 900 seated passengers. Some fans may stay at the Ricoh for a drink after the match so they will not all want the same train.
A further increase in capacity could be made by adding the 6-car train to a (future) 2-car normal service, with selective door opening so that only the 6-car unit serves Arena station, leaving through passengers unaffected by the match crowds. 8 cars x 75 x 2 directions = 1200 seated passengers. Not quite your 10,000 estimated demand but maybe adequate for the likely number of passengers.

 

[The Planner]

Except that wont work as only the Up platform is 6 cars and none of the other stations can deal with 6 car trains.

 

[chiltern trev]

From the Coventry Telegraph 29 August 2015 - http://www.coventrytelegraph.net/news/coventry-news/government-rejects-calls-intervene-34-9947215

Government rejects calls to intervene in £3.4 million Ricoh Arena rail station 'farce' .

The Department for Transport says it will not put pressure on train operator to provide an enhanced matchday service.

The government’s Department for Transport has rejected pleas to intervene in the Ricoh Arena railway station fiasco.

Coventry City FC and Wasps fans have been told not to use the station on match days after train operators London Midland said it would only run an hourly service for 75 people.

That prompted supporters, and the Campaign for Better Transport, to call on the government to put pressure on the train operators, and station owners Coventry City Council, to resolve the situation.

A total of £13.6million of public money has been spent on improving the line between Coventry and Nuneaton - with the Department for Transport (DfT) contributing about £4.75m.

The council said the Ricoh Arena station element of the project cost roughly £3.42m.

Sports fans have been left frustrated after a 10-year wait for a station at the stadium, only to be told they will not be able to use it when it opens next month.

But the DfT said it would not intervene in the situation and that it was up to the council and the train operators to find a solution.

Ben Duckworth, spokesman for the DfT, said: “The arrangements for operation are the responsibility of the council and the train operators.

“We agreed to provide funding to improve the line between Coventry and Nuneaton. The infrastructure sits there now which would allow changes in the future.”

He added that the station funding was not provided solely with matchdays in mind.

He said: “Coventry City Council has decided it can’t open the station during matches. It’s got to be safely used.

“The project was about opening up the Arena as a whole, as well as the development alongside it.”

London Midland claims it does not have the trains available to run an enhanced service during matches and is in talks with Wasps about a possible solution - potentially involving hiring charter trains.

Mr Duckworth said: “The train operators have made a clear point. It’s up to the train company and the council.

“We have done our part by providing the funding to create the station. That will serve a purpose beyond sports events that are held there.”

 

[rick9525]

Northen Rail run to Mancester United's Ground without any issues with 3 coach 323's and Bolton's Ground with 150's etc but Ashburys station near Manchester City's ground used to close. I am unsure if it still does after Metrolink line passed the ground opened.

 

[The Planner]

If the DfT wanted to change LMs franchise commitments to specify higher frequency services on match days, special events or weekends then I've no doubt stuff would happen, but as it isn't then LM would have to shoulder the cost for anything extra.

 

[Class 170101]

Perhaps LM should shoulder the cost. Would be interesting to see the financial cost and compare with the cost of the bad PR that LM will almost certainly get from this farce.

 

[The Planner]

I suspect LM will simply counter with the fact that they told everyone that this was the case even in the planning of the stations.