Tyne & Wear Metro: Fleet Refurbishment List

[Mark62]

The metro is good but passenger numbers are not increasing I believe the all time high for usage was more than 20 years ago. I must admit that this surprised me.
At best, passenger growth is stagnant on the metro.
Nexus spent £5 million rebuilding Gateshead stadium station this year. How could they justify this? It has minimal passengers and the previous station met all health amd safety requirements.
Regarding the use of the Leamside line for the metro. This has been planned since 2006. Much money has been spent on research into the metro extension but nothing done. And now more money is being spent on another piece of research.
Well I'm sure the people at nexus and their pals will make plenty of money from yet another piece of research.
i had a good chat to a Nexus researcher the other week.i told him that Nexus were a PTE by another name. This he denied!!!!
We had a good chat and it was obvious how little he knew about the transport industry, deregulation etc.
The metro is good but why aren't passenger numbers increasing?

 

[Tetchytyke]

At best, passenger growth is stagnant on the metro.

It's a bit more complicated than that, as passenger numbers on Metro have peaks and troughs, often linked to the financial health of the region. It depends which year you look at. Passenger numbers are up 9m on where they were in 2001 and nearly 5m on where they were in 2013. But they're about the same as they were in the last peak in 2009, about the 40m mark.

 

[ModernRailways]

The metro is good but why aren't passenger numbers increasing?

Quite simply because the Metro isn't good. It's becoming increasingly unreliable and I know of a few people who have started to drive instead of taking the Metro like they used too.

 

[507 001]

Quick question, are there any metro drivers on here? I'd just like to ask a couple of questions.......

 

[142094]

Possibly, I can't comment...

However I do my best to answer questions.

 

[Scott M]

I drove a metro in the depot once on work experience if that counts.

 

[MetroCar4058]

Central is now fully open for the Christmas shopping period and throughout December. The early evening closures are suspended.

I like the change in rhetoric from Metro, it sounds like the horrendous delivery of the project at Central is going to to continue on into 2017. If so, this is yet another Nexus failure.

Isn't it about time they:
A) Stop using Tolent
B) Hire some people who actually know what they are doing?

 

[ModernRailways]

I like the change in rhetoric from Metro, it sounds like the horrendous delivery of the project at Central is going to to continue on into 2017. If so, this is yet another Nexus failure.

Isn't it about time they:
A) Stop using Tolent
B) Hire some people who actually know what they are doing?

From what I know, there will be one weekend closure in January which will be when everything is finished.

I also believe all future work is being done by Nexus and being kept in-house. I'm not sure if that also includes station refurbishments though.

Imo, when it comes round to Monument getting it's refurb I genuinely hope they just close the station for a month or two and get the majority of the work done and out of the way. Yes, it will be quite disruptive but the work will be done a lot faster.

 

[Tetchytyke]

The main problem with Central is that they've tried to keep the station open whilst they're doing the works, and that really hasn't worked in this case, especially with the asbestos. They'd have been better off just closing the station for a period and getting most of the work done. It's what TfL usually do.

Quite simply because the Metro isn't good. It's becoming increasingly unreliable and I know of a few people who have started to drive instead of taking the Metro like they used too.

The Metro isn't that bad, it's a system that the people of Leeds, for instance, would kill to have. But it depends where you are travelling to: I wouldn't take the Metro if I worked on Cobalt or Quorum. But, even with the Metro being unreliable during the autumn, it beats sitting in a traffic jam all the way into town and then scrabbling for a parking space. I see the queues of cars every afternoon along Percy Street trying to get into Eldon Square and I just pity them, they must be queueing for half an hour just to get into the car park. Madness.

And it's only getting worse with the works at Billy Mill and Silverlink/A19/Coast Road. The Silverlink work is adding 15 minutes to t'missus' commute from here to Sunderland through the tunnel. When they start work on Haddricks Mill it'll be even worse again.

 

[Scott M]

Isn't the overhead part present at central, but not haymarket, there to hide wires?

Agree a full-time closure would have been preferable, especially with Monument within walking distance. However could monument have coped with the extra rush hour traffic? Also, could they have worked efficiently and safely on central during rush hour with non-stopping trains rushing through each platform every 3 minutes?

 

[MetroCar4058]

The Metro isn't that bad, it's a system that the people of Leeds, for instance, would kill to have.

I totally agree! I use the Metro every day and I must say I very rarely have any major delays to my service. I was in Manchester a few days back, and I noticed how lucky we are to have a Metro and not the Tram. The tram is slow and takes ages to get through the city, as well as being costly for the commuters coming from outside of the city zone. I noticed that congestion seemed to be a big issue in MAN city centre; perhaps it would be different if they had a strong Metro network?

However could monument have coped with the extra rush hour traffic?

Most likely, as the Metro is well under capacity and evening rush is highly staggered. This alongside train frequency will quickly clear the platforms. If not the extra free staff could work crowd control measures.

could they have worked efficiently and safely on central during rush hour with a train rushing through each platform non-stop every 3 minutes?

Forgive me if I am wrong,but don't TFL put wooden boards around the platforms so that workers aren't at risk of oncoming trains? (full length) I'm sure they did this at Bank when it was being refurbished. This could easily be emulated at any of our stations.

I think closing Monument wouldn't be as big an issue for P1/P2 users, perhaps more of an inconvenience for those having to alight at St James. Personally, I'm all for closing stations for 1/2 months.

Finally, does anyone know which train was struck at Howdon today? I was also wondering, will/can Nexus claim damages to the rolling stock and delay compensation from the drivers insurance company? Now that would be interesting for the individuals future driving insurance.. (I assume the driver was in the wrong and it wasn't an accident which couldn't have been avoided)

 

[35B]

Isn't the overhead part present at central, but not haymarket, there to hide wires?

Agree a full-time closure would have been preferable, especially with Monument within walking distance. However could monument have coped with the extra rush hour traffic? Also, could they have worked efficiently and safely on central during rush hour with non-stopping trains rushing through each platform every 3 minutes?

For those of us who relied* on making connections at Central to/from main line services, a total closure would have removed the Metro from my itinerary. That makes Central different from Monument or Haymarket.

* I no longer visit Newcastle for work, but did so for several years week in, week out.

 

[Tetchytyke]

Agree a full-time closure would have been preferable, especially with Monument within walking distance. However could monument have coped with the extra rush hour traffic? Also, could they have worked efficiently and safely on central during rush hour with non-stopping trains rushing through each platform every 3 minutes?

There's no reason why Monument couldn't have coped with the extra passengers, it's the biggest station on the network.

Closing Central would have been a significant inconvenience for people connecting to and from main line trains, I agree. But then it was in the evenings anyway, Central was shut by the time the teatime trains from London and Birmingham arrived into Newcastle.

The efficiency wouldn't have been working all the way through, even if they didn't work during the day they'd have had the significant time savings of not having to tidy up every night to make the station safe for passengers in the morning. The escalator shaft and the concourse would have been sorted much quicker.

 

[MetroCar4058]

Does anyone know what the police incident was between Kingston Park & Airport? It looks to be an incident at Bank Foot level crossing; has anyone anymore information?

 

[142094]

From what I heard last night, a stolen van was dumped on the crossing at Bank Foot. Obviously nothing moving between Kingston Park and the Airport whilst the police dealt with it.

This was in addition to a few trains cancelled due to a lack of drivers, overhead wire trip, no lighting at Ilford Road and trouble on the Hylton line.

 

[ModernRailways]

The Metro isn't that bad, it's a system that the people of Leeds, for instance, would kill to have. But it depends where you are travelling to: I wouldn't take the Metro if I worked on Cobalt or Quorum. But, even with the Metro being unreliable during the autumn, it beats sitting in a traffic jam all the way into town and then scrabbling for a parking space.

I use it daily and it's definitely not as bad as people think. But to certain members of public anything below perfection and all hell breaks loose and they want DB gone etc. My point was that the majority of people will look at Metro's performance/look at what their friends are saying and decide that the Metro just isn't for them and that they will drive.

Does anyone know what the police incident was between Kingston Park & Airport? It looks to be an incident at Bank Foot level crossing; has anyone anymore information?

As 142094 says, a Van was stopped on the crossing and abandoned.

 

[MetroCar4058]

Thanks for the information.

I have noticed that most MetroCars lack a fully functioning heating system, for example only 2 of the 4(?) ducts will blow out air and the others are not functioning. Its often that one end is very hot and the other freezing; I assume this is causing a spatial imbalance as a full trains worth of hot air is coming out into only half of the train. Does this mean that the depot team haven't been allocated any time to maintain these systems?

Also, when observing a few trains pass whilst waiting I noticed that quite a few units have rust bubbles! Once again, Wabtec did a great job.

I use it daily and it's definitely not as bad as people think. But to certain members of public anything below perfection and all hell breaks loose and they want DB gone etc. My point was that the majority of people will look at Metro's performance/look at what their friends are saying and decide that the Metro just isn't for them and that they will drive.

I agree, I use the metro daily and I rarely have anything more than a 5 minute delay, which I must say is rather rare. This said, the stats aren't great this month; 68%. I don't think Metro helps themselves when they post this after a disruption has cleared: 'We're running a frequent service but not to the usual timetable due to earlier disruption.' They seem to leave this on the boards for hours afterwards when there are no delays to service that are over 15 minutes and warrant an announcement. This does put many people off from travelling! As much as I admire the investment in a social media team, I do think the delay announcements before they were hired were much more accurate, concise and were useful.

Also, merry Christmas!

 

[142094]

I have noticed that most MetroCars lack a fully functioning heating system, for example only 2 of the 4(?) ducts will blow out air and the others are not functioning. Its often that one end is very hot and the other freezing; I assume this is causing a spatial imbalance as a full trains worth of hot air is coming out into only half of the train. Does this mean that the depot team haven't been allocated any time to maintain these systems?

I'm not 100% sure but it may be that the only one traction motor provides the heat for the whole car, and more often than not this is the B-end. It uses a fan to blow heated air through the car, and the heat is taken from the excess heat dissipated by the traction motors when they are powering and braking using rheostatic braking. This is also why there can be a burning smell if there is a problem and only the disk brakes are being used.

 

[S Lowes]

142094, is there any progress with 4002? Or is it a lost cause now.

Sent from my D5503 using Tapatalk

 

[142094]

142094, is there any progress with 4002? Or is it a lost cause now.

Sent from my D5503 using Tapatalk

Still sat at the depot. 4001 has joined it, hasn't been out in a few days either.

 

[MetroCar4058]

I'm not 100% sure but it may be that the only one traction motor provides the heat for the whole car, and more often than not this is the B-end. It uses a fan to blow heated air through the car, and the heat is taken from the excess heat dissipated by the traction motors when they are powering and braking using rheostatic braking. This is also why there can be a burning smell if there is a problem and only the disk brakes are being used.

Thank you! I do wonder why it is only fed from one traction motor.

I've also been looking into the festive timetables of all other intracity rail based transport units in the country (excluding those on National Rail lines) and I've found that all bar the Glasgow subway and Metro are providing a Sunday service on NYD. I think its rather poor that Nexus couldn't even arrange a fringe service to meet the needs of the modern day world. Surely two trains per hour on each line would be achievable? Even if this was at the expense of running a Sunday service on the bank holidays this week like the other networks do.

I must say, when looking at other networks, they have been really trying to push the public transport boat out. NET has extended its service on NYE into the early hours, TFL are offering free travel 2345-0400, albeit it is sponsored by the events manager and a lot of roads are closed. On the flip side, Metro is shutting up shop earlier.

I understand that our stock is ancient and dying and isn't really comparable to NET for example, as well as drivers and other metro staff probably not wanting to work on those days, but, at the same time, people do need to get around on this essential service, especially as car ownership is the NE is one of the lowest in the country.

Finally, its been great to see all of the CSOs really in the christmas spirit and being extra supportive and kind to the travelling public over the past few days. Its nice to have a positive vibe when you are walking through a station with everyone feeling happy. The festive service so far has been a success!

 

[Tetchytyke]

Why run a service on NYD? Nowhere is open. The buses aren't running. Northern aren't running. Seems a waste of money.

They ran until midnight on Christmas Eve, will do on NYE, and ran until 11pm on Boxing Day with a Saturday service. Not sure what you're complaining about tbh.

 

[MetroCar4058]

Why run a service on NYD? Nowhere is open. The buses aren't running. Northern aren't running. Seems a waste of money.

There will be events that people wish to attend on NYD, the fact buses and Northern aren't running supports the idea of running a fringe service. Only Blackpool trams and Glasgow subway aren't operating on NYD, so all of the others must seem to have a good reason to operate a sunday service on NYD?

They ran until midnight on Christmas Eve, will do on NYE, and ran until 11pm on Boxing Day with a Saturday service. Not sure what you're complaining about tbh.

I believea Saturday service during the festive period is a waste of money, like other networks a Sunday service may be of better use; the trains I saw yesterday were pretty much empty. I'm saying compared to other networks, especially NET, Metro is lagging behind, a later service on NYE and a service on NYD is which I advocate for due to the sheer number of people attending events on that evening. Once again, other networks, which are much smaller are providing this service so there must be demand for it.
Like anyone who moans, it's only from a megalomaniac perspective; a service on NYD would be greatly helpful for me!

 

[ModernRailways]

Why run a service on NYD? Nowhere is open. The buses aren't running. Northern aren't running. Seems a waste of money.

They ran until midnight on Christmas Eve, will do on NYE, and ran until 11pm on Boxing Day with a Saturday service. Not sure what you're complaining about tbh.

Most places are open on NYD. Shops etc. are all open just like Boxing Day. A half hourly service (15 minutes through core) would likely be suitable, but obviously on Boxing Day it needed to be a Saturday service due to the match. If the match wasn't on I'd say a Boxing Day service should be reduced to Sunday service till 1830 (as it normally would be).

In my view, the service should run throughout NYE and NYD 24 hours.
NYE Start of Service till 2000 - Saturday service (Every 12 minutes)
2000-0130 - Every 20/30 minutes (10/15 through core)
0130-0430 - Hourly (30 through core)
0430-1800 - Every 20/30 minutes (10/15 through core)
1800-End of Service NYD - Hourly (30 through core)

 

[142094]

The two days that drivers are not contracted to work are Christmas Day and New Years Day. Unless DB or Nexus were to offer a significant incentive it isn't going to happen.

Also drivers do not work past 1am, so any shifts after this would be volunteers.

 

[MetroCar4058]

The two days that drivers are not contracted to work are Christmas Day and New Years Day. Unless DB or Nexus were to offer a significant incentive it isn't going to happen.

Also drivers do not work past 1am, so any shifts after this would be volunteers.

When the trains were tendered out to DB, did they have the option to change the drivers contracts? I could imagine any contractual change would simply be a no go.

Also, is the signalling centre staffed 24H & do sub surface stations require a staff presence; if so that would be another obstacle.

I just think its rather interesting that all other services which are much smaller than Metro are providing a better, modern day world equipped service on NYD. I wonder how the contracts on those systems compare to those on the Metro. I don't think its necessarily fair to contract drivers to work NYD, but instead make some form of provisional agreement with incentives as you say. Surely an hourly branch service would only require ~8 trains on the full network?

On another note, wheelslip seems to be a bit of an issue over the past few days, especially at Regent Centre!

 

[ModernRailways]

The two days that drivers are not contracted to work are Christmas Day and New Years Day. Unless DB or Nexus were to offer a significant incentive it isn't going to happen.

Also drivers do not work past 1am, so any shifts after this would be volunteers.

I'm aware of that, and it's the main reason it'll not happen. Plus the fact that we'll likely be seeing strike action anyway in the next year or so by drivers and staff because Nexus can't raise the wage.

Again, after 1am would require incentive, or a change in contract for that one day of the year. Something which quite obviously won't go down well, even if it just for the 1 day.

 

[MetroCar4058]

Plus the fact that we'll likely be seeing strike action anyway in the next year or so by drivers and staff because Nexus can't raise the wage.

Anything factual about this one? I'm not too sure but i don't remember wage increases being particularly great for any public sector service, including Metro for a long while; so why would this change? Metro staff have a lot of grievances with Nexus but I don't know of any mooted strikes, unless I'm a bit behind!

 

[142094]

Next pay talks are for April 2017. A 1% rise will not go down well, especially after losing travel benefits going from DB to Nexus.

 

[MetroCar4058]

Next pay talks are for April 2017. A 1% rise will not go down well, especially after losing travel benefits going from DB to Nexus.

Uh-oh! Why have Nexus removed the travel benefits; did drivers have this beforehand?

I was on 4088 yesterday and they look to be trailing/rolling out a new form of emergency door release stickers and instructions. The doors now feature green labels indicating where the releaser is on the left door and the right door has a sticker indicating that it is the door that is released in an emergency. The labels next to the release lever now features 4 step instructions and some fancy pictures. Should be more accessible for those who need them in an emergency.