Tyne & Wear Metro: Fleet Refurbishment List

[142094]

All Arriva Trains UK staff get free travel on services within the group (also Nexus staff get this too). However when Metro no longer is part of Arriva on 31st March 2017, the staff lose this.

 

[jkkne]

Most places are open on NYD. Shops etc. are all open just like Boxing Day. A half hourly service (15 minutes through core) would likely be suitable, but obviously on Boxing Day it needed to be a Saturday service due to the match. If the match wasn't on I'd say a Boxing Day service should be reduced to Sunday service till 1830 (as it normally would be).

In my view, the service should run throughout NYE and NYD 24 hours.
NYE Start of Service till 2000 - Saturday service (Every 12 minutes)
2000-0130 - Every 20/30 minutes (10/15 through core)
0130-0430 - Hourly (30 through core)
0430-1800 - Every 20/30 minutes (10/15 through core)
1800-End of Service NYD - Hourly (30 through core)

There's no justification for a service. The Shops aren't open. The retail in Eldon Square and the Metrocentre are closed. A few supermarkets are on limited hours. There no connecting bus service. There's no football at Newcastle or Sunderland.

Even the Monday to Friday service from today to Friday is questionable. Most trains were carrying air.

 

[TC60054]

There will be events that people wish to attend on NYD, the fact buses and Northern aren't running supports the idea of running a fringe service. Only Blackpool trams and Glasgow subway aren't operating on NYD, so all of the others must seem to have a good reason to operate a sunday service on NYD?



I believea Saturday service during the festive period is a waste of money, like other networks a Sunday service may be of better use; the trains I saw yesterday were pretty much empty. I'm saying compared to other networks, especially NET, Metro is lagging behind, a later service on NYE and a service on NYD is which I advocate for due to the sheer number of people attending events on that evening. Once again, other networks, which are much smaller are providing this service so there must be demand for it.
Like anyone who moans, it's only from a megalomaniac perspective; a service on NYD would be greatly helpful for me!

Not all systems run a full Sunday service on NYD, and it's not only TWM which has an early finish on NYE, and this is a system which is in a bigger location than NET is...

 

[MetroCar4058]

Not all systems run a full Sunday service on NYD, and it's not only TWM which has an early finish on NYE, and this is a system which is in a bigger location than NET is...

Well most of these systems are running a fringe system at least, it would only make sense for Metro to do the same.

Does anyone have any information regarding what todays track fault was and what the specifics were? Many thanks in advance.

Also there seems to be a frequent issue with driver resources of late, has a bug been spreading around the staff room?

 

[ModernRailways]

Anything factual about this one? I'm not too sure but i don't remember wage increases being particularly great for any public sector service, including Metro for a long while; so why would this change? Metro staff have a lot of grievances with Nexus but I don't know of any mooted strikes, unless I'm a bit behind!

I think 142 has pretty much answered this for you. Nexus can't give a good pay rise because they are public sector and are frozen at 1% increases. All current Arriva/DB staff in the UK are given free travel across the whole of DBs operations within the UK, so for Metro drivers that is Cross Country, Grand Central, London Overground, Northern, Chiltern, Arriva Trains Wales, and if they come to fruition Alliance Rail. So basically they're going from being able to travel the country to being stuck in the North East (likely to keep free travel on Northern).

Ultimately would you be happy to lose that benefit of being able to travel the country and only receive a 1% pay rise to essentially cover that. I believe inflation is at 1.2% so they're wage will be less than inflation which means there wage won't go as far as it did. It's the Governments doing and I doubt we're going to see a solution in all honesty. The public will lose their minds but that's mainly because they have terrible unions who either don't care or have very little power.

In summary, drivers (and current DB staff) will be offered at most a 1% pay rise. Inflation is at 1.2%(?) so their wage won't go as far as it does and not only that but they lose all their current travel benefits. I'd be pretty annoyed at that too and I completely stand behind the staff on this. It'll just be interesting to see what happens.

There's no justification for a service. The Shops aren't open. The retail in Eldon Square and the Metrocentre are closed. A few supermarkets are on limited hours. There no connecting bus service. There's no football at Newcastle or Sunderland.

Even the Monday to Friday service from today to Friday is questionable. Most trains were carrying air.

The vast majority of supermarkets are open their normal hours on New Years Day (10/11am-4/5pm) - local and express store are their normal times too. Most of the retail parks etc. are open too. Eldon Square and Metrocentre both are open for leisure but shops are, for the most part, closed.

Again, I don't think we need a frequent service of trains 4 times an hour but we should have some service running.

 

[ModernRailways]

I was on 4088 yesterday and they look to be trailing/rolling out a new form of emergency door release stickers and instructions. The doors now feature green labels indicating where the releaser is on the left door and the right door has a sticker indicating that it is the door that is released in an emergency. The labels next to the release lever now features 4 step instructions and some fancy pictures. Should be more accessible for those who need them in an emergency.

I've noticed them myself. Been running around like that for a week or two now. Guessing it's just a trial, but when I looked it definitely made it a whole lot simpler. My only issue was the amount of stickers we now have everywhere and they just looked too big. The emergency door could probably do with a small sticker which just has a character sliding the door or something and then on the other door nothing. It just looks tacky to have the massive signs across the top. People will probably ignore them anyway. Something like I've attached would probably be more suitable but adapted to say push and slide.

 

[MetroCar4058]

I've noticed them myself. Been running around like that for a week or two now. Guessing it's just a trial, but when I looked it definitely made it a whole lot simpler. My only issue was the amount of stickers we now have everywhere and they just looked too big. The emergency door could probably do with a small sticker which just has a character sliding the door or something and then on the other door nothing. It just looks tacky to have the massive signs across the top. People will probably ignore them anyway. Something like I've attached would probably be more suitable but adapted to say push and slide.

Yeah I'd tend to agree, many green stickers may also be counterproductive as people frantically attempt to find the 'key information.' I wonder if normal passengers even care to read those things?

It looks like today has been a bit of a nightmare for Metro! Probably the worst day over the festive period for it to go wrong. There must have been 4/5 separate events today! One can only hope that Nexus is working extra hard on their sequels to all of their plans for Metro futures, only this time to actually get some funding.

I really do hope that the MetroCars get a bit more TLC when the service is back in Nexus' hands, but as we have discussed several times, they're probably past that point now. Why are our MetroCars struggling much more than the stock on the Pic and the Bakerloo line which were built by the same company in the same factory at pretty much the same time? Is it simply down to the longevity of the design?

 

[142094]

All comes down to Nexus in the end. 3/4 life refurbishment should have been done earlier, work on the actual mechanical parts of the train below the floor should have been carried out instead of a few new panels and new paint.

Remember that Nexus specify the timetable. If they were interested in improving the maintenance regime they could have cut some of the peak shorts long ago, but would rather fine DB for any delays and lack of serviceable trains as a result. Again, they have already planned to do this when they take over in April.

Also, Nexus have overspent on a lot of their own projects (North Shields and now Central Station). They are losing money elsewhere in the business, and also farebox revenue is down this financial year.

 

[Tramfan]

So is it April we'll see the revised timetable that's been mentioned?

 

[MetroCar4058]

All comes down to Nexus in the end. 3/4 life refurbishment should have been done earlier, work on the actual mechanical parts of the train below the floor should have been carried out instead of a few new panels and new paint.

Remember that Nexus specify the timetable. If they were interested in improving the maintenance regime they could have cut some of the peak shorts long ago, but would rather fine DB for any delays and lack of serviceable trains as a result. Again, they have already planned to do this when they take over in April.

Also, Nexus have overspent on a lot of their own projects (North Shields and now Central Station). They are losing money elsewhere in the business, and also farebox revenue is down this financial year.

You are totally correct on every level. I was reading about the 1972 stock on the Bakerloo line and TFL appear to be going about it in the right way. Sending off stock for an evaluation, in much worse condition than anticipated thus getting approval for extra funding, more than double the original expectation.

Nexus do appear to use DB as a cash cow and scape goat, but this is at the cost of the service provision; its a shame as I think the MetroCar is a great EMU. The refurbishment however brought no major improvements of any sort, and you can tell which units were actually refurbished and those which were given the bare bones touch up.

It is a major shame that Nexus is an example of a poorly performing PTE, of which is the core idea behind privatising such networks. Nexus, realistically are 5-16 years behind on planning new rolling stock and the continuum of expansion ideas published are farcical. How can you really qualify for public money when you can't even devise a contract to give a makeover to a station without it almost taking double the scheduled time. Perhaps Nexus could benefit from a new generation of leaders! On the flip side, those planning networks in Nottingham and Manchester to an extent are innovative, ambitious and calculating and this has paid off for their public transport networks. Does this not remind you of the TWPTE back in the 70s? Metro is Tynesides miracle, and its a shame to see it suffering the combination of poor planning and tightening government budgets.

Although I appear all doom and gloom in this post, I really do appreciate Metro and the hard work all of the staff put in day in and day out. It is nowhere near as bad as those on social media make out and Metro often gets a bit more stick than it deserves in my eyes.

 

[142094]

So is it April we'll see the revised timetable that's been mentioned?

Staff haven't been told when but from all the gossip it will be when Nexus take it back over. The timetable change will see a corresponding change to driver's duty content, as less drivers will be needed per day (however this should mean more spare drivers).

The timetable really doesn't make any sense in the first place. For example, if you look at 118, which is a peak extra in the evening and out from the depot for just about 4 hours. It runs in service from the depot to Monkseaton. It follows a St James train so picks up fresh air. From Monkseaton it then follows another South Shields train. Similarly, later on it follows another St James train. Never normally gets more than half full at most.

What this means is wasted mileage and increased faults, and capacity where it is not needed.

116 goes Regent Centre - Pelaw - Monkseaton and empty to the depot. 153 goes Monkseaton - Pelaw - depot. If I was a betting man then those would be the first two to be removed from the timetable.

 

[Tramfan]

The timetable really doesn't make any sense in the first place. For example, if you look at 118, which is a peak extra in the evening and out from the depot for just about 4 hours. It runs in service from the depot to Monkseaton. It follows a St James train so picks up fresh air. From Monkseaton it then follows another South Shields train. Similarly, later on it follows another St James train. Never normally gets more than half full at most.

I agree, but I can't understand why the evening diagrams seem so badly thought out when the morning peak timetabling seems a lot better.

Looking at Four Lane Ends as an example, it sees 8 Pelaw trains in the morning peak, all of which run 3 mins in front of the South Shields train. In the evening though 6 out of the 7 Pelaws run 3 mins behind the South Shields train.

The thing that disappoints me most is that I'd been hoping for a long time that the end of the 3/4 refurb would see reliability improve, simply because they no longer have 4, 5, or even 6 units either at Wabtec or being comissioned, heck we even have 4077 in use again after so long.

116 seems to be cancelled so often now, it's becoming quite a novelty to see it actually running, though it was today!

 

[142094]

116 seems to be cancelled so often now, it's becoming quite a novelty to see it actually running, though it was today!

I was half expecting it to be cancelled today with at least two major failures this morning but it went out. However, a South Shields train was taken out of service at South Gosforth around half 4 so not sure what was used to cover for that.

 

[Tramfan]

I was half expecting it to be cancelled today with at least two major failures this morning but it went out.

Are you able to give any clue as to what the cause of some of these major failures are (is it the same type of problem, or unrelated?)

 

[142094]

Are you able to give any clue as to what the cause of some of these major failures are (is it the same type of problem, or unrelated?)

First one at Jesmond apparently a fault with the intermediate couplers. Obviously if the couplers in the middle have a fault, the brakes apply and the train comes to a stand. Depending on what the fault is, you can either fix it in a few minutes, or due to the curved track at Jesmond, the train has to be split and moved as two separate cars. The same has happened a few times at Jesmond.

Second one at Chichester was a motor alternator fault. Normally one car can power both itself and a dead car, however if the fault transfers across cars then again bit more of a headache.

Unfortunately a lot of the faults we are now seeing are ones that never have seen before, so any sort of fault training given to staff goes out the window.

 

[Tramfan]

First one at Jesmond apparently a fault with the intermediate couplers. Obviously if the couplers in the middle have a fault, the brakes apply and the train comes to a stand. Depending on what the fault is, you can either fix it in a few minutes, or due to the curved track at Jesmond, the train has to be split and moved as two separate cars. The same has happened a few times at Jesmond.

Thanks, that one's certainly an unusual one. The reason I ask is I was on a set a couple of months ago that tripped the OHL* and we coasted over the QE2 bridge before trundling to a halt inside the tunnel at Gateshead where we were stuck for a while in darkness. I'd read that there'd been a few OHL trips lately so I'd wondered if this was a recurring issue.

*Obviously I can't be 100% sure it was the train I was on that tripped the OHL, as it did carry on in service but not long afterwards I saw it trundling back into the depot with one of the pantos down.

 

[MetroCar4058]

Just a quick question regarding signal 609, is it a constant amber nowadays? I'm sure I saw a train holding at a red signal at West Jesmond when the other had passed 609 and was in the platform at Jesmond, with no train on the Manors loop.

 

[142094]

OHL trips can be a number of different faults so hard to generalise. Normally it is caused by a flashover in the traction motor, meaning current drawn is more than normal and the breakers trip in the substation. So if the power is reapplied and it trips again, then the pan has to be dropped on the affected car.

609 reverts back to danger once a train is in the section ahead. The signal at West Jesmond can be held by the signaller for a number of reasons. However what is likely is during disruption:

A) Better to have a train on a platform so passengers can get off/be detrained if needed.

B) If the train has to be turned at old Jesmond station, this can only be done without passengers. If the train was held at 609 and had passengers on, and a train was stuck at Jesmond platform 1, you would no longer have the option of turning trains back.

From what I am hearing 5th February is when the timetable will change.

 

[Paul_10]

OHL trips can be a number of different faults so hard to generalise. Normally it is caused by a flashover in the traction motor, meaning current drawn is more than normal and the breakers trip in the substation. So if the power is reapplied and it trips again, then the pan has to be dropped on the affected car.

609 reverts back to danger once a train is in the section ahead. The signal at West Jesmond can be held by the signaller for a number of reasons. However what is likely is during disruption:

A) Better to have a train on a platform so passengers can get off/be detrained if needed.

B) If the train has to be turned at old Jesmond station, this can only be done without passengers. If the train was held at 609 and had passengers on, and a train was stuck at Jesmond platform 1, you would no longer have the option of turning trains back.

From what I am hearing 5th February is when the timetable will change.

Why can't a train with passengers not head onto the single track at Jesmond and head back towards West Jesmond? Can't be a safety issue as the driver can change ends fairly easily one would assume.

On my last trip to Tyneside last week, I notice 4040 was on its own outside the depot and with 142094 report of 4001+02 coupled up inside the depot, I assumed none of the unrefurbished cars were in service and nor I seen any in service. I think as Tramfan says, its dissapointing despite the refurbishment programme being over with, its still a case of the full fleet not being avaliable. I do start to wonder if this is the start of the 4 unrefurbished cars being placed into "semi retirement"(as seemed to of been in the plan) but just seems a waste too me when the current fleet is having so many faults.

Its ashame its coming to some peak short trains being cancelled but as 142094 points out, some diagrams do seem rather pointless. What I would like too see though personally is the morning peak to be shortened as I honestly don't see the point of trains heading to Pelaw after 9am as they only carry virtually fresh air and for the evening peak to be extended towards 7pm as going from experience there is still many people around in the main core of the system between 6 and 7 yet the last peak train leaves Monument just before 6 heading southbund.

 

[S Lowes]

As far as I know the Manors curve isn't cleared for passenger use only empty stock due to the radius of the curve leaving Manors (I think)

Sent from my D5503 using Tapatalk

 

[Tramfan]

From what I am hearing 5th February is when the timetable will change.

New times are now appearing on the Nexus Journey Planner from 5th February

 

[MetroCar4058]

OHL trips can be a number of different faults so hard to generalise. Normally it is caused by a flashover in the traction motor, meaning current drawn is more than normal and the breakers trip in the substation. So if the power is reapplied and it trips again, then the pan has to be dropped on the affected car.

609 reverts back to danger once a train is in the section ahead. The signal at West Jesmond can be held by the signaller for a number of reasons. However what is likely is during disruption:

A) Better to have a train on a platform so passengers can get off/be detrained if needed.

B) If the train has to be turned at old Jesmond station, this can only be done without passengers. If the train was held at 609 and had passengers on, and a train was stuck at Jesmond platform 1, you would no longer have the option of turning trains back.

From what I am hearing 5th February is when the timetable will change.

Thanks for the info, something must have been up that day! Is the green aspect null now? I've never seen it.

From looking at the new timetable, there are some interesting points:
Service from Airport is the same until 1700 where there are 5TPH from Airport, prior to this it was 4 passing 1700. Trains appear to leave Airport 2 minutes earlier (evening timetable) and the final train departs 3 minutes later.

Central belt (Ilford Road as comparison station)
first service is 2 minutes earlier
0600: A few changes, appears that St James runs at 12 minutes instead of 19 and 17. (4 services instead of 3)

After this, there appear to be a few less peaks and trains running a few minutes earlier.

1700:
151 terminates at West Monkseaton instead of SJM
155 doesn't run
150 changes destination to Monkseaton instead of Regent, runs ahead of a full service
116 swaps journey with 150
154 swaps with 157, running to Monkseaton instead
157 swaps with 154 as above
153 doesn't run
152 terminates at SGF instead of Regent

1800:
158 terminates at SGF not Monkseaton
117 terminates at SGF not Monkseaton
155 not present
118 terminates at SGF not Monkseaton
1831 the coast --> 14 minute gap till 1845 (beginning of the evening service)
1838 to Airport --> 15 min gap till 1853 (beginning of the evening service)
1903 service to SGF
1906 service to Benton


I've only looked at the service from Ilford Road towards South Gosforth, but from a brief look at the other end, it looks like more peaks start at Regent a little bit earlier, around 1600, its still only 4 in that hour though. If I have got the above correct, it seems like a very logical change to the timetable! Changes after 1800 aren't too great but it could have been worse. My question is, why are most services two minutes earlier?


Running timetable between end to end:
APT-SHL: is still 59 minutes.
SHL-APT: 58/59 mins instead of 60/61
SJM-SSS: Same
SSS-SJM: +1 min

 

[Tetchytyke]

New times are now appearing on the Nexus Journey Planner from 5th February

Interesting that they've cut a lot of the peak extras to West Monkseaton out, the 1759, 1810 and 1822 peak extras from Haymarket have all been scrapped.

Pretty poor, given that Coast passengers have seen their annual MetroSaver go up by £120 in two years.

 

[MetroCar4058]

Interesting that they've cut a lot of the peak extras to West Monkseaton out, the 1759, 1810 and 1822 peak extras from Haymarket have all been scrapped.

Pretty poor, given that Coast passengers have seen their annual MetroSaver go up by £120 in two years.

Yeah, it appears that 157, 117 and 118 terminate at SGF instead; is congestion bad at that time though? Or could the normal service suffice?

 

[Tetchytyke]

Yeah, it appears that 157, 117 and 118 terminate at SGF instead; is congestion bad at that time though?

By 1822 it's relatively quiet, both the extra and the full working are both probably about half full, but the 1759 one is normally pretty busy. Not everyone finishes work at 5pm.

It's a shame that they're cutting services. If they were bringing the peak forward I'd have more understanding, given the trains between 1600 and 1630 tend to be very busy. I wonder if it's the first step towards binning those three trains entirely, given that South Gosforth trains are empty even in the height of the peak (the 1705 Regent Centre is normally deserted).

 

[142094]

Why can't a train with passengers not head onto the single track at Jesmond and head back towards West Jesmond? Can't be a safety issue as the driver can change ends fairly easily one would assume.

General rule of thumb on the railways is that a move which is made using either a ground position light or a subsidiary shunt signal attached to a main running signal means no passengers are allowed on board.

None of the unrefurbished cars have run before Christmas, although a full set of trains has been going out over the past few days which means that there is enough to cover for the 4001/02/40/83 being stuck at the depot.
--- old post above --- --- new post below ---

Thanks for the info, something must have been up that day! Is the green aspect null now? I've never seen it.

609 only has the two aspects - yellow and red. So I've never seen it as well!

 

[ModernRailways]

None of the unrefurbished cars have run before Christmas, although a full set of trains has been going out over the past few days which means that there is enough to cover for the 4001/02/40/83 being stuck at the depot.

Fingers crossed it's a sign that they are being phased out and will only be used where necessary as extra services.

 

[Paul_10]

Fingers crossed it's a sign that they are being phased out and will only be used where necessary as extra services.

Why? If they are fit for service then they really should be used, even if its only in the peak extras because in theory, if the refurbished sets are using less mileage then there should be less reliability issues.

Never also knew you can't run passenger trains going pass the ground signals but suppose it makes sence though. Am I right in saying didnt there used to be a diamond crossover just before Jesmond station? Think I'm also right in saying this was taken out when the track was replaced a few years back?

 

[jkkne]

This Summers major line closure looks a right beaut! Added with Killingworth Rd closing, even the summer traffic might suffer somewhat.

I see the Chronicle acting as the Nexus PR machine again, front pager on fining that naughty DB Regio before the wonderful and flawless Nexus step in to save us all!

 

[ModernRailways]

I've just seen the full upcoming timetable change and I must admit there are a number of good changes.

The main standouts for me are that after 6am it will be a full 5 train an hour service thereabouts on both the South Shields and South Hylton branches.

A 12 minute service from Benton after 5:20am.

Evening peak services. Big changes. Tremendous changes. They have been retimed so that short services are now ahead of the full (standard as Nexus put it) service.

There is a disclaimer which does state that this has only been made possible by withdrawing the least used peak services and I must admit that from what I've seen in this notice it's not quite all doom and gloom yet.

The new timetable comes into action on the 5th February and station timetables will be uploaded in the coming days.