Using return portion first

[Pumbaa]

Hi,

Is there anything to stop you using a return portion of a ticket first? In this instance, the ticket is almost £15 cheaper buying it from my destination to my origin.

Would be travellin with Virgin - would they get the hump?

 

[Max]

Technically it's invalid, but if they don't see unstamped the outward portion in your wallet I doubt they would ever know. Unless you couldn't physically have made the outward journey before you are departing. Then you'd be in trouble.

 

[me123]

Hmm... I'm pretty sure there's nothing to stop you. Ticket office needs to sell you the ticket you ask for and on the train, provided it's valid I don't see what could stop you.

Max has said it more succinctly above.

 

[Pumbaa]

Unless you couldn't physically have made the outward journey before you are departing. Then you'd be in trouble.

That was my worry. The Off-Peak for leaving Euston is after 0915. I'd be on the 0935. I doubt I could have come from Manchester in sub 1hr45, as the off-peak restriction lifts at 1059.

 

[glynn80]

Hi,

Is there anything to stop you using a return portion of a ticket first? In this instance, the ticket is almost £15 cheaper buying it from my destination to my origin.

Would be travellin with Virgin - would they get the hump?

Yes this is invalid.

The general use of tickets section of the fares manual states the following:

Tickets are issued subject to the National Rail Conditions of Carriage and availability of services. Where stations have a limited train service, check that the journey can be completed. Tickets must be used in the direction of travel for which they are issued. The outward portion of a two-piece return ticket is not valid for travel unless accompanied by a completely unused return portion.

Guards can and regularly do ask to see an unstamped return portions (especially with high value tickets like Anytime Returns), if you do fail to produce this you could be charged the FULL open fare or if you are in a penalty fare zone you could recieve a penalty fare.

 

[yorkie]

I don't think the asking to see the RTN portion is enforceable, and in any case that only arises on your return journey when you are using the outward portion and it is, by then, less suspicious.

On your outward journey you are using the return portion and they can't moan about the outward then.

There is a journey I regularly do using this method which saves approx 50% of the ticket price!

 

[glynn80]

I don't think the asking to see the RTN portion is enforceable, and in any case that only arises on your return journey when you are using the outward portion and it is, by then, less suspicious.

On your outward journey you are using the return portion and they can't moan about the outward then.

There is a journey I regularly do using this method which saves approx 50% of the ticket price!

And when your on your return? I would say it depends on which route you are using and assess the risk based on that. NXEC and I wouldn't both. XC and I'd say you have a good chance. Guards do have the right to check tickets and actively have to stop fraud.

They can ask to see an unstamped return portion which if you don't have and they believe you are trying to fare evade can charge a PF or full fare ticket. This is likely to be in the rarest of cases but isn't unheard of.

 

[Max]

Guards can and regularly do ask to see an unstamped return portions (especially with high value tickets like Anytime Returns), if you do fail to produce this you could be charged the FULL open fare or if you are in a penalty fare zone you could recieve a penalty fare.

Regularly? I don't think this has ever happened to me.

 

[glynn80]

Regularly? I don't think this has ever happened to me.

With Standard Open Returns (Anytime) regularly with an Outward portion (especially if it had been gripped when you have broken your journey) you are asked for unstamped return portions. I agree with Savers (Off-peaks) you are unlikely to be asked that often.