Steddenm
Member
It is looking like the WCML is closed on Tuesday and Wednesday due to high winds and heavy rain with no services between Carlisle and Scotland. CS have already cancelled Monday nights services.
It is looking like the WCML is closed on Tuesday and Wednesday due to high winds and heavy rain with no services between Carlisle and Scotland. CS have already cancelled Monday nights services.
Is that where the flooding was over the weekend that shut the line most of the weekend?Specifically, at Beattock. There's a problem culvert which has been causing issues since a landslip occurred a couple of months ago. Every time there's bad rain it floods and ends up causing severe disruption.
Yep!Is that where the flooding was over the weekend that shut the line most of the weekend?
Specifically, at Beattock. There's a problem culvert which has been causing issues since a landslip occurred a couple of months ago. Every time there's bad rain it floods and ends up causing severe disruption.
Our network truly is an embarrassment. Where is the motivation and urge to forge forward through adversity and get the passenger from A - B. The lack of trying is just turning people to other methods of transport. Astronomically high fares which provide no value for money in turn being brought down further by the lack of service. Someone really does need to question this. Safety is important but if we all felt there was risk and got scared by it then we might as well just stay in bed all day
......and some freight services are being diverted via the G&SW and Annbank, as happened on Sunday. I wonder whether Avanti will operate a Voyager shuttle between Carlisle and Glasgow via the G&SW as they did during the Lockerbie Pendolino incident a couple of weeks ago?It is looking like the WCML is closed on Tuesday and Wednesday due to high winds and heavy rain with no services between Carlisle and Scotland. CS have already cancelled Monday nights services.
There's a grain of truth in what you say - a lot of the network is vulnerable to poor weather conditions, because it is predominantly made up of 19th Century earthworks and structures. That will only get worse as climate change intensifies.Our network truly is an embarrassment. Where is the motivation and urge to forge forward through adversity and get the passenger from A - B. The lack of trying is just turning people to other methods of transport. Astronomically high fares which provide no value for money in turn being brought down further by the lack of service. Someone really does need to question this. Safety is important but if we all felt there was risk and got scared by it then we might as well just stay in bed all day
Welcome to the forum Pawhi57! That's you, me and McRhu of the old crew now on board. We just have to persuade DF to join now. Looking forward to more reports from the Lockerbie area.Heavy rain at Lockerbie and WCML IS dead no movement
I believe a voyager left Carlisle to go over the south western at around 1115. It was planned to anyway.......and some freight services are being diverted via the G&SW and Annbank, as happened on Sunday. I wonder whether Avanti will operate a Voyager shuttle between Carlisle and Glasgow via the G&SW as they did during the Lockerbie Pendolino incident a couple of weeks ago?
No, but the volume of rain over the last months has been significantly in excess of normal. Lots of ground is saturated and so as soon as there's another downpour...But storms and high winds in February are not exactly unknown in the UK
I am sure Network Rail are putting all available resources on the job. But for example a lot of recent failures have involved continuous landslips. You can't start fixing those until they stop moving.a) the railway would have sorted out a "problem culvert" by transferring teams, if necessary, to work on it, they wouldn't have allowed a main arterial route to be vulnerable for long
Fine if you have a load of compatible diesel locos sitting around at Glasgow and Carlisle waiting for action, along with drivers. But see the above point re: efficiency - it's perfectly possible to do, but would cost a lot of money, so it's not worthwhile for the handful of times each year it happens.b) if necessary, the G&SW route would have been intensively used via diversions of the scheduled WCML, not by posting a notice saying "no trains between Carlisle and Scotland" and hoping nobody thinks of using this line
Certainly during the current restrictions there are very few long distance passengers and so rail replacement coaches, along with a limited number of diverted trains, can handle all passengers perfectly well.Basically this is an admission that in the UK we can actually do without even key train services if the weather's not fine and we can't be bothered solving infrastructure issues in a timely manner.
Those would be the same airlines that are operating barely any flights at the moment? Not much of an alternative.Good job we've got airlines
See above - much slower during normal times. A perfectly decent option during disruption of course.and motorway, eh?
Good job we have Citylink ,over the recent years it's been the bus taking the strain, not the train."A lot of the network is vulnerable to poor weather conditions". Well, yes. But storms and high winds in February are not exactly unknown in the UK, and I may be wrong but surely in BR days, or steam days at least:
a) the railway would have sorted out a "problem culvert" by transferring teams, if necessary, to work on it, they wouldn't have allowed a main arterial route to be vulnerable for long
b) if necessary, the G&SW route would have been intensively used via diversions of the scheduled WCML, not by posting a notice saying "no trains between Carlisle and Scotland" and hoping nobody thinks of using this line
Basically this is an admission that in the UK we can actually do without even key train services if the weather's not fine and we can't be bothered solving infrastructure issues in a timely manner. Good job we've got airlines and motorway, eh?
"A lot of the network is vulnerable to poor weather conditions". Well, yes. But storms and high winds in February are not exactly unknown in the UK, and I may be wrong but surely in BR days, or steam days at least:
a) the railway would have sorted out a "problem culvert" by transferring teams, if necessary, to work on it, they wouldn't have allowed a main arterial route to be vulnerable for long
b) if necessary, the G&SW route would have been intensively used via diversions of the scheduled WCML, not by posting a notice saying "no trains between Carlisle and Scotland" and hoping nobody thinks of using this line
Basically this is an admission that in the UK we can actually do without even key train services if the weather's not fine and we can't be bothered solving infrastructure issues in a timely manner. Good job we've got airlines and motorway, eh?
I believe a voyager left Carlisle to go over the south western at around 1115. It was planned to anyway.
During and after the decades of managed decline infrastructure maintenance was, I think, a case of 'make do and mend'. Now it's been realised that this is more expensive in the long run. It is better to do a 'proper job'. I'm sure the recent parapet failure on the Aberdeen route could have had a temporary fix, if only a speed limit. Instead they've made a permanent repair. In the same way this culvert near Beattock needs a planned solution which takes time to prepare and deliver.
A pair of class 156s. Realtime Trains - 1L54 1112 Carlisle to Glasgow Central
British Rail did, to an extent, see their role as managing decline with "rationalisation" - stripping out capacity that was no longer needed - as a common practice.
British rail also had good administration of their assets. They knew the condition of a piece of infrastructure and often reduced the linespeed to keep it open while deferring renewal
On the Maryport and Carlisle between Currrock Junction and Carlisle linespeed has been 10mph for as long as I can remember. The 1960 sectional appendix has it at 15mph.
It did yes.Did the expected flooding actually happen?
And when is the WCML in the area expected to be back open again?
Well done to all for their caution and pre-planning. It all paid off.It did yes.
Going by RTT, freight trains appear to have resumed running through Lockerbie, so probably fairly soon for passenger services.And when is the WCML in the area expected to be back open again?
Yep, it fell across the down line, very considerately not fouling the up (but only by maybe 2-3 feet).The service from Leeds has just been terminated at Armathwaite due to adverse weather conditions. Wonder what’s happening on the short section?
EDIT: Looks to be a fallen tree according to the signal diagrams, just before London Road Jn.:
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