West Yorkshire Bus Franchising to go ahead

[Bletchleyite]

Same effect as services operating from West Yorkshire to North and South Yorkshire, most likely. They'll remain under the brand and operator they currently do.

Not necessarily. TfGM are taking on quite a few cross border services, including if I recall some quite unlikely ones, with others being run commercially under a permit.

 

[158756]

I would guess the West Yorks/GM cross border routes will be franchised by West Yorks, except the 184 already franchised by GM.

Whether cross border routes in GM are franchised seems to have been largely determined by which depot they run from (Except the 184 which I think might have been subsidised by GM). So if West Yorks is similar, the 587, 590/1/2, the 66 between Keighley and Skipton etc would be franchised.

Transdev has a great relationship with the WYCA. They got their part of the partnership done far quicker than any of the other companies and they didn't suprise the authority out of the blue by asking for an extra million like a certain one did...
Arriva apparently didn't bid at all in Manchester, which was apparently due to the takeover. Since the bidding process is in three years the company will already be fully taken over and ready to compete in the bidding process.

Their relationship with the WYCA is basically irrelevant under franchising. The only thing that matters is is Transdev Blazefield capable of bidding lower than First, Arriva, Stagecoach, Go Ahead etc? First could be as obstructive as possible and WYCA would still give them every contract if they had the lowest bid.

 

[YorkRailFan]

So there will be a small island of commercially-operated routes in the borderlands between West Yorkshire and Manchester? I think a joint running approach would be more sensible. If necessary though, it would make sense for West Yorkshire to run them as that's where they are all currently operated from.

Depends on the depots that are used I guess.

Not necessarily. TfGM are taking on quite a few cross border services, including if I recall some quite unlikely ones, with others being run commercially under a permit.

Are the depots used for those services majority TfGM? If so, it makes sense to simply have other services using those depots to be operated by TfGM.

 

[TheGrandWazoo]

Transdev has Team Pennine which operates a large network in West Yorkshire and Arriva has a large presence in Wakefield as well as Leeds. But Transdev also has a lot of routes that leave West Yorkshire such as Coastliner and their services to Wetherby.

Er....and their long established, much larger operation at Keighley?

So there will be a small island of commercially-operated routes in the borderlands between West Yorkshire and Manchester? I think a joint running approach would be more sensible. If necessary though, it would make sense for West Yorkshire to run them as that's where they are all currently operated from.

As has been mentioned, probably not. As @Bletchleyite mentioned, you have routes such as the 362 Chorley to Wigan that ARE part of the Bee Network, and others like 125 Wigan to Preston where most of the route is in Lancashire so it runs into GM on a permit. @158756 is largely right that it's really dependant on the depot that operates them but also how much is that territory.

I would guess the West Yorks/GM cross border routes will be franchised by West Yorks, except the 184 already franchised by GM.

Whether cross border routes in GM are franchised seems to have been largely determined by which depot they run from (Except the 184 which I think might have been subsidised by GM). So if West Yorks is similar, the 587, 590/1/2, the 66 between Keighley and Skipton etc would be franchised.



Their relationship with the WYCA is basically irrelevant under franchising. The only thing that matters is is Transdev Blazefield capable of bidding lower than First, Arriva, Stagecoach, Go Ahead etc? First could be as obstructive as possible and WYCA would still give them every contract if they had the lowest bid.

Absolutely right. In public procurement, the existing relationship means nothing. It's a formal process where a commercial response (cost) is scored alongside a "quality" response (credentials, commitments, etc) plus a Social Value element (e.g. what you doing for the local community, sustainability etc).

 

[JD2168]

So there will be a small island of commercially-operated routes in the borderlands between West Yorkshire and Manchester? I think a joint running approach would be more sensible. If necessary though, it would make sense for West Yorkshire to run them as that's where they are all currently operated from.

It's more of an issue than it is for the boundaries with North Yorkshire and South Yorkshire. Franchising in N. Yorks is unlikely so there will be plenty of commercial operators to run the cross-boundary services. To South Yorkshire, the cross-boundary links are already very poor (is there anything significant except Wakefield to Barnsley?) so leaving those routes to South Yorkshire franchising is unlikely to be much of an issue.

West Yorkshire to South Yorkshire services are besides Barnsley to Wakefield:
Stagecoach:
28/28c Barnsley to Pontefract via Grimethorpe & Hemsworth, hourly Monday to Sunday.
Globe Holidays:
198 Barnsley to Hemsworth via Shafton.
39 Barnsley to Pontefract via South Elmsall.
Waterson’s/Globe:
36 Barnsley to South Elmsall via Shafton & Hemsworth.
TM Travel:
29 Sheffield/Chapeltown to Holmfirth via Penistone.
Arriva:
496 Wakefield to Doncaster, currently 2 return journeys on Mon - Sat but rumours of it increasing to hourly.

 

[yorksrob]

Perhaps they'll do something about the abysmal state of Sunday services which are threadbare to start off with yet still cancelled at the drop of a hat.

 

[syjunkie]

West Yorkshire to South Yorkshire services are besides Barnsley to Wakefield:
Stagecoach:
28/28c Barnsley to Pontefract via Grimethorpe & Hemsworth, hourly Monday to Sunday.
Globe Holidays:
198 Barnsley to Hemsworth via Shafton.
39 Barnsley to Pontefract via South Elmsall.
Waterson’s/Globe:
36 Barnsley to South Elmsall via Shafton & Hemsworth.
TM Travel:
29 Sheffield/Chapeltown to Holmfirth via Penistone.
Arriva:
496 Wakefield to Doncaster, currently 2 return journeys on Mon - Sat but rumours of it increasing to hourly.

29 is run by South pennine not tm travel

 

[SCH117X]

Transdev has Team Pennine which operates a large network in West Yorkshire and Arriva has a large presence in Wakefield as well as Leeds. But Transdev also has a lot of routes that leave West Yorkshire such as Coastliner and their services to Wetherby.

Wetherby is in West Yorkshire so the X98 and X99 will fall under franchising and more than likely no be operated by Transdev. The 7 runs through to Harrogate so probably will be exempted.