What activity is there on the railway on Christmas Day?

[Mag_seven]

There was an engineering train from Hillington to Carlisle yesterday hauled by GBRf 66779.

https://www.realtimetrains.co.uk/train/B15278/2019-12-25/detailed

https://www.flickr.com/photos/fishpl8/49273528147 (not my photo)

 

[Surreytraveller]

Am i missing something here? The 24th is the 24th but Boxing day is on the 26th What has happened to the day in between...... 25th Christmas day
For the sake of argument i consider midnight to be 00:00 so that's 0 Hours & 0 Minutes of the new day, therefore midnight is always the start of the new day and never the end, the end being @ 23:59.

Except the railway doesn't recognise midnight due to the confusion over which day it applies or whether it is the end or beginning of a particular day.
Railway schedules always say 23.59 or 00.01

 

[AndrewE]

Except the railway doesn't recognise midnight due to the confusion over which day it applies or whether it is the end or beginning of a particular day.
Railway schedules always say 23.59 or 00.01

Apart from on the continent (or in the Cooks Timetable anyway) where the convention is that a midnight arrival is shown as 2400 and a departure is 0000. Typical britishness/dumbing down to assume people here are too stupid to be able to learn it - but I suppose if lots still can't handle the 24-hour clock they might be right. It's a good job our network is quiet by midnight or that lost minute (2 minutes?) would sap capacity!

 

[Darandio]

Not missing anything - me being a complete muppet. Midnight on the 24th is the start of Christmas Eve. I've no idea why I was thinking of boxing day when I was typing...

Too much Christmas cheer?

 

[Steve Harris]

Am i missing something here? The end being @ 23:59.

Yes you are. The very end of the day is 23:59 and 59 seconds (and however many hundreths or nano seconds). Obvisiouly 00:00 is the start of a new day.

 

[DarloRich]

There was an engineering train from Hillington to Carlisle yesterday hauled by GBRf 66779.

https://www.realtimetrains.co.uk/train/B15278/2019-12-25/detailed

https://www.flickr.com/photos/fishpl8/49273528147 (not my photo)

so that is what rumbled past mums yesterday. I think we had a couple of trains actually.

 

[Deepgreen]

Yes you are. The very end of the day is 23:59 and 59 seconds (and however many hundreths or nano seconds). Obvisiouly 00:00 is the start of a new day.

That's what 'bobbyrail' said, without the fractions of minutes that are irrelevant for public timetabling anyway.

 

[Deepgreen]

There was an engineering train from Hillington to Carlisle yesterday hauled by GBRf 66779.

https://www.realtimetrains.co.uk/train/B15278/2019-12-25/detailed

https://www.flickr.com/photos/fishpl8/49273528147 (not my photo)

'Evening Star' acting as 'Christmas Star'!

 

[skh93]

Was there any work at Manchester Victoria? Seems odd to have the hourly service from Bolton only as far as Salford Central

https://www.realtimetrains.co.uk/search/detailed/BON/2019-12-26/0000-2359?stp=WVS&show=all&order=wtt

 

[D365]

Yes, most countries including have 365/6 day a year service.
Christmas day in Germany has a sunday timetable

I'm not as familiar with other cities, but Munich (in the past decade at least) usually sees partial closures of the S-Bahn during August each year.

 

[duesselmartin]

I'm not as familiar with other cities, but Munich (in the past decade at least) usually sees partial closures of the S-Bahn during August each year.

Summer holidays are often used for major engineering in Germany. Lower passenger numbers and good weather being a major advantage. As projects are bundeld, closure can last but it is not an annual occurance over the same line.
Munich is working in increasing capacity in its central Stammlinie, which is why it is more than one year in succession.

 

[infobleep]

Shared this before, but how I wish I had been a Carlisle fan on Boxing Day 1967

View attachment 71993

Wonderful photo.

Apart from on the continent (or in the Cooks Timetable anyway) where the convention is that a midnight arrival is shown as 2400 and a departure is 0000. Typical britishness/dumbing down to assume people here are too stupid to be able to learn it - but I suppose if lots still can't handle the 24-hour clock they might be right. It's a good job our network is quiet by midnight or that lost minute (2 minutes?) would sap capacity!

Well I guess every minute counts or they wouldn't be so keen on speeding up boarding & departures at stations.

I got a train from Haywards Heath yesterday at 13:39, well 13:44 as it was late arriving. The train wasn't busy until Gatwick Airport when people weren't all able to board.

I can only assume it was late into Haywards Heath due to some signalling, track or weather issue as the previous train left some 60 minutes earlier and it had departed Brighton on time!

It's been said to me in person recently that the trains don't make money on boxing day and so they wouldn't run if others don't insist upon it or someone else funds it.

Given not everyone at Gatwick Airport or East Croydon could board, delay repay might be due. Even less incentive to run a service, if its going to be is be late, due to numbers travelling and less trains running and delay repay refunding some of the money.

Victoria was a tale of two stations, just as it once was, when there was a brick wall between them and no link. One was empty, bar one member of staff let through and the other as if boxing day didn't exist.

On to the point of the engineering works themsleves. Do Network Rail priorities annual engineering works on lines that have no service over Christmas? So that they can maximise work on the lines that see no service over those that do. I do appreciate those with a service will need engineering works but as they are running anyway, they could choose other times too.

 

[island]

Yes you are. The very end of the day is 23:59 and 59 seconds (and however many hundreths or nano seconds). Obvisiouly 00:00 is the start of a new day.

In Ireland, this thorny issue was settled by the Interpretation Act 2005, which defined midnight as that point in time at which the day ends.

I am not sure if a definition exists in British legislation.

 

[AndrewE]

In Ireland, this thorny issue was settled by the Interpretation Act 2005, which defined midnight as that point in time at which the day ends.

I am not sure if a definition exists in British legislation.

but did it define how midnight is to be shown in the 24-hour clock? 2400 or 0000 or both (with an explanation of the convention to be followed?)

 

[Class 170101]

So where are you routing me tomorrow then. Through platform 1 & round the back?

Definitely until 31 December service close. 1 January closed - RR buses.

 

[dk1]

Definitely until 31 December service close. 1 January closed - RR buses.

It was through the up & down Goods Roads in front of Colchester PSB. Last time I did that down road was with a 170 in the late 2000s. My first EVER run in the up direction. No Intercity calls at Colchester today.

 

[Steve Harris]

In Ireland, this thorny issue was settled by the Interpretation Act 2005, which defined midnight as that point in time at which the day ends.

Which does kind of make sense, as when the clock strikes midnight it is a new day and even a nano second or even any smaller moment in time (before midnight) is the previous day. Therefore, any small increment in time before 00:00 is at the end of the day, but the day hasn't actully ended.

Obvisouly that is why 23:59 and 00:01 is used to stop any possible confusion.

 

[Edders23]

what happens when they add a leap second ?

 

[Esker-pades]

what happens when they add a leap second ?

You get times like 18:59:60 .

 

[Phil G]

About 20 years ago that now at Chippenham. Can remember Dad driving us there on Christmas Day to have a look. Was bigger than replacing a bridge. A new bypass was being built and the line at that location runs along a built up bank. So lines removed, part of the bank removed, bridge inserted, lines reinstated. Like you said, all between late Christmas Eve and early on the 27th!

That was an amazing feat, the bridge was built on rails and it is a huge dual carriageway bridge, think the rails were tunneled under the embankment as well and the footings put in place with rail traffic over the top the whole time. Then as you describe, the embankment removed and the bridge slid into place, awesome!

 

[AndrewE]

That was an amazing feat, the bridge was built on rails and it is a huge dual carriageway bridge, think the rails were tunneled under the embankment as well and the footings put in place with rail traffic over the top the whole time. Then as you describe, the embankment removed and the bridge slid into place, awesome!

That might have been the one that was the first big bridge slide: A colleague was there on site because of the lubrication expertise that had been offered from our department... Apparently it went like clockwork and slid like silk - but it didn't stop, which nobody had anticipated! Cue hasty rearrangement of rams to push it back to where it was supposed to end up. Nowadays the rams hook into a pocket on whatever they are pushing.

 

[benbristow]

There was an engineering train from Hillington to Carlisle yesterday hauled by GBRf 66779.

https://www.realtimetrains.co.uk/train/B15278/2019-12-25/detailed

https://www.flickr.com/photos/fishpl8/49273528147 (not my photo)

Interesting that you can get to Carlisle from Hillington/Paisley.

 

[neilmc]

So how many signalling staff are required to turn in on Christmas Day just for the occasional engineering train?

 

[furnessvale]

That might have been the one that was the first big bridge slide: A colleague was there on site because of the lubrication expertise that had been offered from our department... Apparently it went like clockwork and slid like silk - but it didn't stop, which nobody had anticipated! Cue hasty rearrangement of rams to push it back to where it was supposed to end up. Nowadays the rams hook into a pocket on whatever they are pushing.

They should have done! I was an assistant RE in the early 1970s sliding bridges in. The heaviest I was involved in weighed 8500 tons and stopping it was the major concern.

 

[Llanigraham]

So how many signalling staff are required to turn in on Christmas Day just for the occasional engineering train?

That I suspect is impossible to answer, but I certainly knew of a time when my Box was rostered for a very short shift one Christmas Day to allow a train into a Possession since it had to cross the controlled level crossing outside the Box. If I remember rightly they got paid a full shift for an hours work!

 

[High Dyke]

So how many signalling staff are required to turn in on Christmas Day just for the occasional engineering train?

It depends on the traffic requirements of the day. For example Peterborough PSB, Eastfield and Helpston had full shifts on both days, but further north Doncaster PSB and the associated crossing boxes at Claypole, Carlton & Ranskill merely had staff on duty for night turns.

In the past I've worked a shift on Boxing Day, but never signalled any trains - merely there to sign the location back into order after asbestos removal work had been carried out by contractors.

 

[LAX54]

I suspect it might also have something to do with Network Rail persuading signallers to work as well.

No persuading, if it's part of the week, then if you have to work, then you have to work, only when Sunday is Christmas day, is there a bit of an argument to not come in, it's what you agree to when you join

 

[LAX54]

It was through the up & down Goods Roads in front of Colchester PSB. Last time I did that down road was with a 170 in the late 2000s. My first EVER run in the up direction. No Intercity calls at Colchester today.

Been rest days, so you twigged, via P1 and the Goods it all seems to have worked well, unusually the train planning team consulted with the SSM's at Colchester a few months ago, to try and get a handle on the timings needed, so we ran a couple via the GL, and timed them from the Tey until clear on P1, the only thing that we could not double check, until closer to the time, was actually being able to set a route via the GL, with the tracks that needed to be disconnected for the work, to be actually disconnected, this was done (tried) in November, and few alterations made, so that we knew it would work
With the IC sets now only '8' they may well have been able to call, but of course they are not booked for short form !

 

[LAX54]

So how many signalling staff are required to turn in on Christmas Day just for the occasional engineering train?

Changed a bit over the years, sometimes a smaller box would just come in for the hours needed to get a train or two through, but assume RT / NR decided that if they have to pay for a shift, then the Siggy can jolly well stay there ! on our route, Liverpool Street, were nearly all in I think, Colchester had an SSM and 2 Signallers, covering all the panels, Stowmarket GB, was closed on the morning of the 25th, but open 24/7 from Christmas Day afternoon, think Bury was open throughout as well. (Cambridge would be similar to Colchester) in the afternoon on the up line from Bury, (25th) it was an hourly service from 1430 to 1930 with Ballast Trains bound for Colchester

and do not forget, it is not just the odd engineering train, there maybe lots of other work going on too, it's a good time to get a lot of work done, that is difficult when you have a service running, so you have the well publicised work, then loads of little jobs going on in between the big ones !

 

[thin_richmond]

Haymarket East junction was relayed over the festive period, caused a fair bit of consternation up this way with commuters.