What are the best and worst bus operators in the UK?

[VioletEclipse]

I may be slightly biased here, but in my opinion:
Best: Lothian Buses
Worst: First Glasgow

I rarely use any other operators, and I know First aren't too bad, but being used to Lothian I'm not exactly a fan of First.

 

[satisnek]

There was talk of the V3 merging with the Harlequin but that has sort of died off now unless they are waiting for room in the paint shop as the swift is currently being refreshed at the moment.

Got the villager home tonight which was a little bit of a experience in a good way. After the bus disappearing of the board at the bus station a team leader person came over to say that the buses has been held up in Burton with roadworks and traffic because the A38 was closed and the next bus was just leaving Burton which is around 75 minuets away and around 90 minuets late and he was looking to get a extra bus and driver so we could be on our way. After around 20 minuets a spare bus and driver was found and made a short trip to the outskirts of Burton in which everyone was allowed on for free and the driver was very apologetic for the delay and made sure everyone knew what was going on. Overall a great bit of customer service to ensure people knew what was going on and trying to keep people moving as quickly as possible.

Thanks for the info.

I too have experienced the driver refusing fares on one occasion when the V3 was delayed. Except in the case of people with concessionary passes who were still touching on. They're not daft.

 

[MrGriff500]

My opinion has changed, First Norwich worst as they keep giving away our lovely old former Oldham B7TLs for more stupid new Wright buses. When will they learn that they are heaps of ****? Why do they decide to keep the worst condition of the aforementioned B7TLs?

 

[TheGrandWazoo]

My opinion has changed, First Norwich worst as they keep giving away our lovely old former Oldham B7TLs for more stupid new Wright buses. When will they learn that they are heaps of ****? Why do they decide to keep the worst condition of the aforementioned B7TLs?

What Wright buses do you mean?

 

[Jordan Adam]

What Wright buses do you mean?

Streetdecks? aka a Bag For Life (Bodywork) with a food blender (Engine) inside it....

 

[rg177]

Had some 'interesting' experiences with First West Yorkshire using PlusBus tickets...

Couple months back on a 590 in Halifax, a driver couldn't possibly believe that it was valid because 'it's only £2'. It was eventually accepted, begrudgingly.

Saturday afternoon I boarded a 1 in Leeds and had the ticket snatched off me before it was handed back with the driver sniping "THIS IS A TRAIN TICKET!". It took several attempts before he'd finally accept it.

On the 617 in Bradford just now, I've had a driver ask 'where does it say bus on this?!' and 'this is the train ticket, where's the bus ticket?' before eventually relenting as I explained that he was looking at the bus ticket.

I know PlusBus knowledge lacks in general, but I've never had so many issues as with First around West Yorkshire in this respect as it's never an 'oh what's this?' it's downright rudeness.

 

[Deerfold]

Had some 'interesting' experiences with First West Yorkshire using PlusBus tickets...

Couple months back on a 590 in Halifax, a driver couldn't possibly believe that it was valid because 'it's only £2'. It was eventually accepted, begrudgingly.

Saturday afternoon I boarded a 1 in Leeds and had the ticket snatched off me before it was handed back with the driver sniping "THIS IS A TRAIN TICKET!". It took several attempts before he'd finally accept it.

On the 617 in Bradford just now, I've had a driver ask 'where does it say bus on this?!' and 'this is the train ticket, where's the bus ticket?' before eventually relenting as I explained that he was looking at the bus ticket.

I know PlusBus knowledge lacks in general, but I've never had so many issues as with First around West Yorkshire in this respect as it's never an 'oh what's this?' it's downright rudeness.

I've had occasional queries about plusbus but never had one refused. When I have one, I'm often using it on a bus in Keighley despite it being a Bradford or Leeds PlusBus. No queries last Wednesday as my other half and I both travelled on two buses home from Bradford for £2 each - Transdev drivers are usually pretty good (I'm most likely to get queries from Burnley drivers, but only usually asking what a ticket is or where it's valid to, not telling me it's invalid).

 

[TheGrandWazoo]

Streetdecks? aka a Bag For Life (Bodywork) with a food blender (Engine) inside it....

Didn’t know they had any new (or new to them) Streetdecks? They got a pair from Brizzle about a year ago so wondered what they were getting.

Besides, the alps of Norwich might be the best territory for Streetdecks??

 

[MrGriff500]

What Wright buses do you mean?

We got 4 Wright StreetDecks (Daimler ones I think) and several StreetLite MAX’s. Also some knackered Gemini B9TLs. All of our good B7TLs and Tridents have either died like 32809, been moved to Lowestoft or First Kernow. It’s even more unfair the StreetDecks meant to be used on all routes are 90% of the time now used on my local route instead of our fair share of monsters like B7TL 32107, this is so wrong!

 

[rg177]

I've had occasional queries about plusbus but never had one refused. When I have one, I'm often using it on a bus in Keighley despite it being a Bradford or Leeds PlusBus. No queries last Wednesday as my other half and I both travelled on two buses home from Bradford for £2 each - Transdev drivers are usually pretty good (I'm most likely to get queries from Burnley drivers, but only usually asking what a ticket is or where it's valid to, not telling me it's invalid).

Yes Transdev always accepted them without fuss in the likes of Keighley and Otley. It seems to be a very 'First' thing to do in West Yorks as Yorkshire Tiger drivers have just accepted mine today without fuss.

 

[MrGriff500]

Didn’t know they had any new (or new to them) Streetdecks? They got a pair from Brizzle about a year ago so wondered what they were getting.

Besides, the alps of Norwich might be the best territory for Streetdecks??

The Bristol ones we got, 35149/50 have turned even more rotten and slow, Norwich’s worst BY FAR! The other two (35200/01 aren’t as bad but are not anything nice to ride)

Any Norfolk people might know how busy Fakenham Road gets just west of Norwich and a StreetDeck breakdown (not rare for 35149) and blocked up the road for a good mile!

The absolute worst thing about Norwich, once our noble 32809 suffered engine failure, we received Bradford’s lovely 30913 W768DWX(?) only for a week later to have it stolen by First Lowestoft! Then they took our second last B7TL 30948 YJ51RRV, leaving the knackered roaring 30947 YJ51RRU, nice but only on certain routes.

Also, Norwich has nine PINK Streetdecks, enough to hate them?

 

[Jordan Adam]

We got 4 Wright StreetDecks (Daimler ones I think) and several StreetLite MAX’s. Also some knackered Gemini B9TLs. All of our good B7TLs and Tridents have either died like 32809, been moved to Lowestoft or First Kernow. It’s even more unfair the StreetDecks meant to be used on all routes are 90% of the time now used on my local route instead of our fair share of monsters like B7TL 32107, this is so wrong!

I see nothing wrong with reducing the average fleet age...

 

[MrGriff500]

Would’ve been ok if we got Enviros, but no, first chose the most unreliable, uncomfortable buses imaginable.

 

[MrGriff500]

The question whilst riding First Norwich’s buses has gone from “When will we get there?” to “Will we get there?”

Reliability of the new ones has gone even more to the dogs. The B9TLs are pretty strong, the Tridents, B7TLs, B7Ls and B7RLE’s are likely to outlive humans if they will not be withdrawn and scrapped. Our 3 heritage B7Ls might be kept so they have a chance to.

 

[TheGrandWazoo]

The question whilst riding First Norwich’s buses has gone from “When will we get there?” to “Will we get there?”

Reliability of the new ones has gone even more to the dogs. The B9TLs are pretty strong, the Tridents, B7TLs, B7Ls and B7RLE’s are likely to outlive humans if they will not be withdrawn and scrapped. Our 3 heritage B7Ls might be kept so they have a chance to.

One of the problems is that you’re talking about some fairly aged fleet that is also heavy on fuel. They will need replacing; the B7Ls are certainly disappearing elsewhere around the country. Unfortunately, FEC doesn’t meet the criteria for new buses (ie - they have to meet LEZs or have partnership commitments) so they’ve had nothing for 3 years.

You’d hope that the Excel would get investment and allow the cascading of the Enviros onto the X21/22? Think that’s where the previous Excel fleet went?? The B9s could then head to Norwich. In the meantime, it’ll probably be more cascades.

Appreciate that they’ve been great machines but 18/19 year old deckers shouldn’t be asked to keep plugging away on front line service. Ok for schools or Bernard Matthews.

 

[MrGriff500]

Some of them definitely don’t feel their age, several Presidents have received multiple generous refurbishments in recent times, and with units being switched lines and being repainted, they seem to often get cleaned out. Mechanically id say 80-85% of them are sound, especially the B7TLs.

I understand that the B7Ls must soon step down from service, they’ve been great workhorses, and hopefully their B7RLE siblings will live on for a good while longer.

Regarding Excel, the B9 Gemini’s are often used in Yarmouth local services. I’d say Yarmouth’s fleet is by far the most depleted, although they are STILL putting more B7Ls/Scania L94s into service. The old Enviros are part of Yarmouth’s fleet too. The rest are now Lowestoft based ones.

Quite a few of Norwich’s fleet has been retrofitted to Euro 4 I think maybe Euro 5. So there is some hope for these units yet. Just no StreetWrecks with their engines that are ticking time bombs.

 

[MrTurbostar170]

Best: Trent Barton, Lynx, Borderbus, Coach Services, Ensignbus, Nottingham City Transport, West Norfolk Community Transport, Delaine

Good: Simonds, Konectbus, Chambers, Ipswich Buses, Stagecoach

OK: Galloway, Arriva, First, Brylaine, Whippet, TM Travel

Worst: Sanders, Semmence, Trustybus

 

[Jordan Adam]

Best: Trent Barton

Questionable... An operator who makes their network of services as confusing as possible!

Worst: Trustybus

Also known as "Rustybus".

 

[Sprinter150]

Arriva Midlands North (Cannock Depot)
Poor - 2/5
- Reliability is awful, with many buses on interworked routes 825/6 and 60 running 15 minutes late or more, due to 10 minute turnaround times at one end, 5 in the middle, and 5 at the Cannock end. Also, journey times are relatively long, packed with recovery time, which you think would be used by late running buses, but I find they never go above 30mph.
- Ticket prices are on the expensive side, although the Knot ticket is good; nevertheless, Arriva initially refused to accept it a few weeks ago.
- The fleet allocation must raise some eyebrows: from Cannock depot, in Stafford it's pretty much '61' Pulsars, '58' Eclipse Urbans, or older Cadets or Darts. Yet the Pulsars with Free Wifi and USB points are put on the Hospital Shuttle and some town routes with 10/15 minute journey time, but not the 825, on which journeys can last up to 90 minutes.
- Presentation: whilst the printed timetables are good, they have not been available since the major service changes in January (mainly splitting up of Cross town routes), and the Arriva website is rubbish. Also, whilst the new livery looks ok, it seems Arriva can only be bothered to paint it onto Wright Pulsars or Solo SRs.
- Virtually no evening services and no Sunday services whatsoever.

D&G Bus
Good - 4/5
- Journey times are competitive with car, and buses are generally on time - not much to complain about reliability.
- The fleet is good on most routes, although it doesn't have WiFi or USB Points, which is a drawback. But this is made up by the friendly drivers.
- The timetable booklet they make for Staffordshire / Stoke-On-Trent is useful.
- There has actually been an increase in service levels on some routes, and taking over certain routes when First Potteries in Stoke give up - however, a lot of their services only operate 9am-3pm timetables at best, which of course isn't useful for most people.

First Potteries
OK - 3/5
- Journey times are fine on interurban routes, and from the (more limited than Arriva / D&G) experience I have had buses are often on time, better than Arriva's at any rate.
- New E200 MMC buses are excellent, but there are only 8 of them, and most of the fleet is from early/mid 2000s.
- Drivers can be variable, but generally friendly.
- Big reductions in services over past 5 years or so, as anywhere, but there being several centres in the Potteries, this is difficult for many operators. Sunday services are sparse, but do run on core routes.

Other operators that I have not travelled as much on but in past 6 months:

National Express West Midlands - Good 4/5 (Platinum is excellent, but some ALX 400 buses etc are dated - I may rate up to 5/5 if I had more experience and this level was sustained)

Stagecoach North Scotland (11/11A to Airport) - Excellent 5/5 with brand new E200 MMC and E400 MMCs.

Bristol Metrobus - Excellent 5/5, but from what I gather First Bristol's other operations aren't so great; BCT E400 CBG Citys are fantastic.

 

[Sprinter150]

Arriva Midlands North (Cannock Depot)
Poor - 2/5
- Reliability is awful, with many buses on interworked routes 825/6 and 60 running 15 minutes late or more, due to 10 minute turnaround times at one end, 5 in the middle, and 5 at the Cannock end. Also, journey times are relatively long, packed with recovery time, which you think would be used by late running buses, but I find they never go above 30mph.
- Ticket prices are on the expensive side, although the Knot ticket is good; nevertheless, Arriva initially refused to accept it a few weeks ago.
- The fleet allocation must raise some eyebrows: from Cannock depot, in Stafford it's pretty much '61' Pulsars, '58' Eclipse Urbans, or older Cadets or Darts. Yet the Pulsars with Free Wifi and USB points are put on the Hospital Shuttle and some town routes with 10/15 minute journey time, but not the 825, on which journeys can last up to 90 minutes.
- Presentation: whilst the printed timetables are good, they have not been available since the major service changes in January (mainly splitting up of Cross town routes), and the Arriva website is rubbish. Also, whilst the new livery looks ok, it seems Arriva can only be bothered to paint it onto Wright Pulsars or Solo SRs.
- Virtually no evening services and no Sunday services whatsoever.

D&G Bus
Good - 4/5
- Journey times are competitive with car, and buses are generally on time - not much to complain about reliability.
- The fleet is good on most routes, although it doesn't have WiFi or USB Points, which is a drawback. But this is made up by the friendly drivers.
- The timetable booklet they make for Staffordshire / Stoke-On-Trent is useful.
- There has actually been an increase in service levels on some routes, and taking over certain routes when First Potteries in Stoke give up - however, a lot of their services only operate 9am-3pm timetables at best, which of course isn't useful for most people.

First Potteries
OK - 3/5
- Journey times are fine on interurban routes, and from the (more limited than Arriva / D&G) experience I have had buses are often on time, better than Arriva's at any rate.
- New E200 MMC buses are excellent, but there are only 8 of them, and most of the fleet is from early/mid 2000s.
- Drivers can be variable, but generally friendly.
- Big reductions in services over past 5 years or so, as anywhere, but there being several centres in the Potteries, this is difficult for many operators. Sunday services are sparse, but do run on core routes.

Other operators that I have not travelled as much on but in past 6 months:

National Express West Midlands - Good 4/5 (Platinum is excellent, but some ALX 400 buses etc are dated - I may rate up to 5/5 if I had more experience and this level was sustained)

Stagecoach North Scotland (11/11A to Airport) - Excellent 5/5 with brand new E200 MMC and E400 MMCs.

Bristol Metrobus - Excellent 5/5, but from what I gather First Bristol's other operations aren't so great; BCT E400 CBG Citys are fantastic.

 

[Jordan Adam]

Stagecoach North Scotland (11/11A to Airport) - Excellent 5/5 with brand new E200 MMC and E400 MMCs.

If you had to live with Stagecoach North Scotland you'd very much not be saying that, they're by far one of the worst if not the worst operation within Stagecoach!

 

[TheGrandWazoo]

Bristol Metrobus - Excellent 5/5, but from what I gather First Bristol's other operations aren't so great; BCT E400 CBG Citys are fantastic.

First Bristol are actually fairly decent. The main problem being the horrific congestion. This is bad enough anyway but should there be a closure on the M4/M5/M32, then things gridlock. Even a simple set of TTLs or a badly parked vehicle can destroy reliability.

There are some old vehicles though the 2001/2 B7TLs were refurbished a few years ago and most other deckers were refurbished in 2012/3. However, the promised new fleet is now not due until early 2020 and the strain is showing. That wasn’t helped by increased PVRs as Wessex (Rotala) exited the area - and they were really abysmal.

 

[GusB]

Stagecoach North Scotland (11/11A to Airport) - Excellent 5/5 with brand new E200 MMC and E400 MMCs.

If you had to live with Stagecoach North Scotland you'd very much not be saying that, they're by far one of the worst if not the worst operation within Stagecoach!

To be fair, anyone who is visiting the area and travelling along the A96 corridor will likely have a fairly good impression of the company with the new E200s and the Elites, although on occasional an ex-D&E vehicle will occasionally stray onto the short 10s and the 11. All you need to do to get the real picture is stand at Raigmore Hospital for 20 minutes in the peak and it's easy to see what a mixed bag they really have.

 

[Tetchytyke]

I know PlusBus knowledge lacks in general, but I've never had so many issues as with First around West Yorkshire in this respect as it's never an 'oh what's this?' it's downright rudeness.

First West Yorkshire drivers have always had a tendency to be rude and obnoxious, even back in Yorkshire Rider days, so it's nothing new. I've recently had a First Huddersfield driver challenge me on a scratch-off Family DayRover because there was one ticket for me, wor lass and the bairn. Madness. The clue's in the title.

If you had to live with Stagecoach North Scotland you'd very much not be saying that, they're by far one of the worst if not the worst operation within Stagecoach!

You should see the ragbag collection of knackered MANs we have down here. And not on the marginal routes either, the ex-Scotland E300s are branded for the MetroCentre shuttle. Still, at least the Kinetics have largely rusted away (it didn't take long) and been put out of our misery.

 

[Jordan Adam]

To be fair, anyone who is visiting the area and travelling along the A96 corridor will likely have a fairly good impression of the company with the new E200s and the Elites, although on occasional an ex-D&E vehicle will occasionally stray onto the short 10s and the 11. All you need to do to get the real picture is stand at Raigmore Hospital for 20 minutes in the peak and it's easy to see what a mixed bag they really have.

Or go to Aberdeen and see the inconsistencies of vehicle allocation, every vehicle being covered in dents and the Buchan Xpress Interdecks with their faded paint. The new E400MMC's on the 35 have done absolutely nothing to improve reliability!

Not my photos but vehicles like this are a classic "NScot" case... I don't think there's a single North Scotland vehicle older than 2 years old that isn't covered in endless dents.
https://www.flickr.com/photos/busmanscotland/38612584830
https://victoryguy.smugmug.com/Stagecoach-in-the-Highlands/i-LzsKzFJ
https://victoryguy.smugmug.com/Stagecoach-in-the-Highlands/i-M9qLj8w
https://www.flickr.com/photos/busmanscotland/46782054755/

Don't even get me started on that Plaxton Premiere bodied Volvo B10M trainer at Aberdeen, that thing should have been retired years ago! It's actually starting to disintegrate.

You should see the ragbag collection of knackered MANs we have down here. And not on the marginal routes either, the ex-Scotland E300s are branded for the MetroCentre shuttle. Still, at least the Kinetics have largely rusted away (it didn't take long) and been put out of our misery.

See some of those links above :P. I've seen much worse than those too.

It's not uncommon for North Scotland vehicles to randomly loose body panels en-route.

 

[MrGriff500]

Best: Trent Barton, Lynx, Borderbus, Coach Services, Ensignbus, Nottingham City Transport, West Norfolk Community Transport, Delaine

Good: Simonds, Konectbus, Chambers, Ipswich Buses, Stagecoach

OK: Galloway, Arriva, First, Brylaine, Whippet, TM Travel

Worst: Sanders, Semmence, Trustybus

I agree with Simonds being good, their fleet is consistent, the B7RLE Evolutions are great, and they have some nice old ones too! BorderBus also quite good.

 

[Sprinter150]

Fair enough on Stagecoach North Scotland - I suppose I can hardy have a balanced picture if I have only been on their flagship routes.

I thought Enviro 200 MMCs were now I the Metrocentre shuttle - although E300s did seem quite old for the express route.

 

[Jordan Adam]

Fair enough on Stagecoach North Scotland - I suppose I can hardy have a balanced picture if I have only been on their flagship routes.

I thought Enviro 200 MMCs were now I the Metrocentre shuttle - although E300s did seem quite old for the express route.

Indeed, i had figured that out so no hard feelings :P. There's been quite a chunk of investment on the main "Moray Corridor" routes (10, 11 and 35) between October 2017 and April 2019. With 10 Elites, 15 E400MMC's and 8 E200MMCs. However the vehicles have done nothing to improve reliability and arguably on the 35 the E400MMC's have made it worse.

The paint jobs on the Ex-D&E vehicles are just laughable.... As GusB says if you stand at Raigmore Hospital for a little while (or even in Aberdeen for that matter) you soon realise just how poor of an operator they are.

This was quite funny last year...

 

[Bungle965]

First West Yorkshire drivers have always had a tendency to be rude and obnoxious, even back in Yorkshire Rider days, so it's nothing new. I've recently had a First Huddersfield driver challenge me on a scratch-off Family DayRover because there was one ticket for me, wor lass and the bairn. Madness. The clue's in the title.

That's why I like my bus service to and from Huddersfield Uni, as it requires almost no interaction with the drivers, scan your m-ticket and move on.
Sam