What happens when a train hits animals?

[Railsigns]

In India I think there there is an issue with trains hitting Cows as they are scared in India

So would you be if a train suddenly appeared and you were standing in its path.

 

[Jamesb1974]

Deleted

 

[Huntscross]

I was on a train in Finland a few years back that hit 3+ deer in the middle of night, which mangled up the cowling on front of the train. After an anouncement by the driver a few passengers got off to assist and we were off again in just under an hour.

 

[thenorthern]

In North America trains do of course run across open country hence why many of the steam trains there were fitted with cow catchers.

I know when the Flying Scotsman was over there it had to have a cow catcher, electric light and bell fitted before it was allowed to run.

 

[Mickc1440]

The area I work in for NR have a contractor who collects most animals after reports of something being killed. We will initially remove from the track and get it to a location where it can be recovered. If the dog has a tag on we will contact the owner.
As for the roads reportable animal collisions were horse mule sheep pig bull ass goat and dog

 

[Dr_Paul]

When I was working on the Ffestiniog Railway a long time back, someone said that in the early years of preservation a sheep was hit and killed by a locomotive, and the crew picked it up and tipped it down a nearby mine-shaft. I don't know if this was true or was a wind-up by someone with a macabre sense of humour.

I once saw a very dead turkey in the Windsor Line six-foot in Richmond station. As it had been plucked, I suspect that it had not been killed by a train. But that makes its presence there all the more of a mystery.

 

[thenorthern]

As for the roads reportable animal collisions were horse mule sheep pig bull ass goat and dog

If I remember correctly with the Road Traffic Act despite what narcissist cat owners may say with their ridiculous petitions on Facebook of "Give Cats the same protection of dogs under the Road Traffic Act" one of the main reasons why accidents involving dogs must be reported but ones involving cats don't is because if you hit a dog its likely that their is an irresponsible dog owner in the area who needs to be dealt with to prevent future incidents. :roll:

I would imagine it would be a similar story with the railways that if a train hits a sheep or other farm animal then a farmer is likely not keeping proper control of their livestock and is a serious risk to the safety of the railways.

 

[Chrisgr31]

I've known 171s to come to a stand and be stranded for many hours (5+ in one or two cases) due to a loss of air caused by deer damaging the front of the train, mainly in the Hever Junction area where they regularly cross the railway. Unfortunately some of the equipment on those units is found in particularly daft places, so even a badly-positioned sheep or dog might be able to do significant damage. Luckily electrical power is less of a problem because those ones can cross-feed between coaches.

That herd is tiny compared to the one that lives between Eridge and Crowborough. Or at least from the passenger seats seems a loy smaller anyway. Bearing in mind how many deer there are I am surprised we dont hit them more often. The new fences that are appearing arent going to be tall enough to keep them out!

I do find, for some reason, that badgers seem to be some of the animals most likely to be electrocuted. I've seen quite a few. Even ubiquitous urban foxes seem to come second.

Is this because badgers only have short legs therefore have no chance to step over the third rail?

 

[Deepgreen]

Is this because badgers only have short legs therefore have no chance to step over the third rail?

Indeed, the problem is that they step on not over the third rail. Last evening, I was walking back to Epsom station and as I approached, the air was filled with acrid smoke. When I reached the platform the fire appeared to be further down the line, but I assumed it was a nearby bonfire. However, this morning I read that it had been an electrocuted badger that caught fire on the Waterloo to Epsom route just outside the station, with the fire brigade called. Horrible.

 

[ComUtoR]

Indeed, the problem is that they step on not over the third rail.

Other animals step on the third rail without problems. Pigeons and various birds frequently land on it. Squirrels are odd to watch as they either leap over, dive under, and also do a leap onto then off movement.

 

[al78]

If I remember correctly with the Road Traffic Act despite what narcissist cat owners may say with their ridiculous petitions on Facebook of "Give Cats the same protection of dogs under the Road Traffic Act" one of the main reasons why accidents involving dogs must be reported but ones involving cats don't is because if you hit a dog its likely that their is an irresponsible dog owner in the area who needs to be dealt with to prevent future incidents. :roll:

I thought it was because cats are classed as wild animals whereas dogs are not, presumably because unlike cats, dogs can be trained and controlled.

 

[A0wen]

Other animals step on the third rail without problems. Pigeons and various birds frequently land on it. Squirrels are odd to watch as they either leap over, dive under, and also do a leap onto then off movement.

Depends whether they are earthing - which I suspect those smaller animals don't whereas a badger most certainly will.

Pigeons are also adept at landing on OHLE - though they don't always get away with that - I recall about a couple of years back ago heading into London from Harlington station (Beds) as I walked out of the ticket office there was an almighty flash and a bang - cue a large number of FCC staff emerging from the station building to investigate - the culprit was found to be a pigeon the remains of which were smoking nicely in the gap between the rails on the slow lines.

 

[ChiefPlanner]

Way back - I had the pleasure of a cab ride on a Norwegian loco - (official) and was shown the "Elk" emergency kit - (for bagging up remnants as they apparently hit them quite often) - and they can be quite large as you can imagine .....

Back to the UK - there was - for quite a while - the remains of a dead dog on the up slow at Cricklewood - deteriorating badly - until the PW removed it as it was becoming a health hazard.

 

[HMS Ark Royal]

I remember a 156 coming into Hull some time ago

Little kid: Look, mummy, thats a bird badge on the train

Me: Thats not a badge, kid...

 

[philthetube]

There was a dead badger on the track by South Croydon station for at least three months about two years ago. I don't know if it was hit or electrocuted (the latter I suspect, as it was unmarked).

I think badgers are supposed to be reported to the ministry of agriculture or similar, to be checked for tb. I recall hearing pway discussing this.

 

[tsr]

That herd is tiny compared to the one that lives between Eridge and Crowborough. Or at least from the passenger seats seems a loy smaller anyway. Bearing in mind how many deer there are I am surprised we dont hit them more often. The new fences that are appearing arent going to be tall enough to keep them out!

Eridge is another problem area - and I've known a fair few trains to be cautioned because a driver on a preceding service hadn't been able to tell exactly what they'd seen on the track, and it turned out to be deer - but the problem with Hever is that they tend to run across the line in front of trains and get hit by them, mainly choosing only a few very limited spots in the cutting on the single track section between there and Mark Beech Tunnel - whereas near Eridge they tend to be beside and not on the track, or frightened away more easily. I know what you mean about "herds" or whatever the technical term is, but in my experience that doesn't always correlate with how often they cause issues!

The other hotspot (or, if they're really unlucky, hotpot) is in the cutting area between Uckfield and Buxted, but normally it just seems to be small and exceptionally stupid deer which only end up hurting themselves.

Is this because badgers only have short legs therefore have no chance to step over the third rail?

As has already been mentioned, I guess I'd agree that it probably is to do with their ways of moving over the track, on thinking about it.

 

[Jamesb1974]

Deleted

 

[nom de guerre]

Cats seem to be able to sense that the third rail is dangerous, in a way that badgers, foxes and even dogs, can't.

The resident moggy at my first box always crossed the double-track main line outside using a level crossing, even though it meant deviating by 50 metres or so.

 

[30909]

Eridge is another problem area - and I've known a fair few trains to be cautioned because a driver on a preceding service hadn't been able to tell exactly what they'd seen on the track, and it turned out to be deer - but the problem with Hever is that they tend to run across the line in front of trains and get hit by them, mainly choosing only a few very limited spots in the cutting on the single track section between there and Mark Beech Tunnel - whereas near Eridge they tend to be beside and not on the track, or frightened away more easily. I know what you mean about "herds" or whatever the technical term is, but in my experience that doesn't always correlate with how often they cause issues!

The other hotspot (or, if they're really unlucky, hotpot) is in the cutting area between Uckfield and Buxted, but normally it just seems to be small and exceptionally stupid deer which only end up hurting themselves.



As has already been mentioned, I guess I'd agree that it probably is to do with their ways of moving over the track, on thinking about it.

IIRC either with the Weymouth or Redhill -Tonbridge electrification "Badger Gaps" were provided in the third rail where known badger tracks crossed the railway. Badgers tend to follow well defined routes between their sets and feeding grounds and Deer from woodland seclusion to open grazing.

 

[Chrisgr31]

I hear that the Eridge/Crowborough herd is now 3 deer less. Apparently the 171 that hit them didn't break either!

 

[HMS Ark Royal]

Just reminded of something... I remember hearing a story off a driver a couple of years ago about a Eurostar train that hit a deer. The driver contacted the French signaller who asked what he had hit. After trying desperately to make himself understood - trying to call it a deer and saying it was an animal with antlers, the driver, a British guy, ended up reporting he had hit a horse that had its own pantograph

I do not know if it is true or not, but re-reading this thread has made me think of it

 

[HH]

I was in a train a few years ago that hit a deer near Pitlochry, we were bussed to Inverness as the train had a smashed windscreen.
Then an hour later the coach hit another deer so it wasn't a good day for animals.

It was quite dear for ScotRail too...

 

[Masboroughlad]

I remember being on a Paignton to Sheffield return excursion in the late 70s. A 45 and long rake of mk1 coaches hit sheep that had got on to the line. A quick halt, a call to the signal box and a bit if a wait before proceeding.

As a sharp contrast, on a train in the Far East. We hit a yak or buffalo type creature. Brakes slammed on.....people seemed to appear from nowhere to collect whatever limbs or bits of carcass they could.....beef for supper that night for quite a few!

 

[Calthrop]

Then there's birds. Swans get a caution, partially because of size, they 'belong' to the Queen, and they're easy to identify. Others don't get a caution, but size (or rather weight) plays it's part when it comes to who pays for any delay. Anything heavier than a pheasant Network Rail pays for, anything the same size (I think) or smaller is the TOC's responsibility, presumably because the train should in theory be able to survive the impact without being damaged. You don't half sound daft asking what type of bird it was before you attribute the delay, then the number of times I've then had to consult the RSPB website to check bird sizes......!

I think with birds there is a liability rule for delays in that if a train hits a blackbird its the responsibility of the train operating company as they didn't stop (I know its almost impossible to though). With big birds such as ostriches however its Network Rail's responsibility as they haven't got good enough fences to stop the ostrich from coming onto the track.

I recall that in 1965, I was travelling on a dmu between Bodmin and Padstow -- sitting up front just behind the driver's compartment, with view ahead along the track. A buzzard flew across the track, right in front of us. It wasn't clear whether the bird was hit, glancingly; or had a hairsbreadth escape. Teenage me, felt a bit upset that the driver hadn't reduced speed to let the bird safely across -- at that time, buzzards were rare in Britain, with certain agricultural chemicals then in use having occasioned a lot of harm to birds of prey (the species has made an excellent comeback since then). I realise now, that I was being rather a twit: (A) the thing happened too quickly, probably, for the driver to have any chance to check forward motion, and (B) his job was -- subject to considerations of collisions perhaps causing delay -- to operate to the correct timings, the service which he was in charge of; not to be a nanny to wild birds.

 

[edwin_m]

I recall the guard apologising after several minutes of very slow running on a late night Bristol-Salisbury some years ago, because a dog on the line kept running along it instead of going off to the side.

 

[Mutant Lemming]

I recall the guard apologising after several minutes of very slow running on a late night Bristol-Salisbury some years ago, because a dog on the line kept running along it instead of going off to the side.

It's odd they have a habit of doing that - there was one on the S/B fast South of Moor Park that just wouldn't go off the track. Got a few jolts from the juice rail which was probably why it stayed on the track mind. Despite stopping and trying to catch it, it kept going on. The controller wanted me to run over it ... er no chance of that - and that's apart from the possibility of animal rights nutters burning my house down. It kept going and didn't get off the track until Harrow on the South a good few miles.

 

[Calthrop]

It's odd they have a habit of doing that - there was one on the S/B fast South of Moor Park that just wouldn't go off the track. Got a few jolts from the juice rail which was probably why it stayed on the track mind. Despite stopping and trying to catch it, it kept going on. The controller wanted me to run over it ... er no chance of that - and that's apart from the possibility of animal rights nutters burning my house down. It kept going and didn't get off the track until Harrow on the South a good few miles.

L.T.C. Rolt in Railway Adventure, tells of the way which all domestic animals seemed to have vis-a-vis the Talyllyn Railway in its first "preservation" days, of stubbornly proceeding (slowly) along the railway track ahead of the train. Attempts by the fireman to jump out of the cab and scare and scatter the creatures so that they'd get off the track, just caused them to pick up their pace and run faster, still determinedly along the track. The sheep (tending generally, to be annoying creatures) were the most annoying in this way -- they just would not "grok" the numerous openings on either hand, for them to get off the rail line. Finally, one was run over -- the driver being known forever after among his colleagues, as "the Butcher". Fortunately, in 1951 the militant animal-rights movement was in its infancy, if even that.