What is the purpose of Bradford to Leeds electrification?

[cle]

What is the Bradford-Leeds electrification in aid of? The Calder route goes two ways, with no wires until Victoria or Preston... seems random. Unless part of something else un-articulated.

 

[snowball]

What is the Bradford-Leeds electrification in aid of? The Calder route goes two ways, with no wires until Victoria or Preston... seems random. Unless part of something else un-articulated.

Minimal sop to Bradford.

 

[GRALISTAIR]

What is the Bradford-Leeds electrification in aid of? The Calder route goes two ways, with no wires until Victoria or Preston... seems random. Unless part of something else un-articulated.

Minimal sop to Bradford.

Exactly my thinking too.

 

[hwl]

Exactly my thinking too.

You need to start Calder Valley route electrification some where without getting in the way of most of it being the TRU works diversionary route for the next decade...

 

[The exile]

Minimal sop to Bradford.

Or (trying to look at it positively) getting the complicated (and expensive) bit through in this plan - leaving a "no brainer" gap in the middle for a future announcement once actually doing the work doesn't clash with the "main" TP work.

 

[GRALISTAIR]

You need to start Calder Valley route electrification some where without getting in the way of most of it being the TRU works diversionary route for the next decade...

In my heart I know you are right.

Or (trying to look at it positively) getting the complicated (and expensive) bit through in this plan - leaving a "no brainer" gap in the middle for a future announcement once actually doing the work doesn't clash with the "main" TP work.

 

[Roast Veg]

What is the Bradford-Leeds electrification in aid of? The Calder route goes two ways, with no wires until Victoria or Preston... seems random. Unless part of something else un-articulated.

An attempt to reduce journey times with an electric shuttle between the two.

The whole IRP timetable only appears to start the clock in 2025. Rather than having a long tail, I think it's just that the head is set intentionally further back.

 

[cle]

It seems quite token, even for this mob. I can understand diversionary, but surely needs the whole route. All a bit of a mess, and I suggest, more clarification to come in the details...

 

[Roast Veg]

It seems quite token, even for this mob. I can understand diversionary, but surely needs the whole route.

It isn't for any sort of diversion. It is purely a speed issue between Leeds and Bradford. As a byproduct, it may well supplement the work of the WYCA Mass Transit proposal.

 

[LNW-GW Joint]

You could run Bradford-Leeds-York/Doncaster/Sheffield EMUs when all the legs are wired.
But then you could do that with the existing Aire Valley wires from Forster Square.
It does get another bit of the Calder Valley route wired.

 

[GRALISTAIR]

Well I can see the value of Interchange station being electrified but there will still be diesel trains using it for a while unless they go bimodes of course.

 

[Manutd1999]

Perhaps when/if everything is electrified the York and Hull stoppers could start from Bradford? The Calder Valley services could then skip New Pudsey and Bramley, reducing journey time.

So:
2x Bradford - stops - Leeds - stops - York/Hull
2x Bradford - stops - Leeds
4x Calder Valley - Bradford - non-stop - Leeds

Minimal sop to Bradford.

By far the most likely answer

 

[Roast Veg]

You could run Bradford-Leeds-York

This would make some sense, since there will be wires and there's no reversal. It will, of course, depend on how much capacity NPR can squeeze out of Leeds eastward. Another option would be bi-mode London services via Hambleton junction, if those ever materialise. With the upgraded ECML and no reversal, it would be jolly quick.

 

[JRT]

What is the Bradford-Leeds electrification in aid of? The Calder route goes two ways, with no wires until Victoria or Preston... seems random. Unless part of something else un-articulated.

It's a climb from both Bradford and Leeds (as opposed to the fairly level Airedale route), so maybe something to do with that??

 

[philjo]

I expect in a few years there will be a later announcement to then extend from Bradford Interchange via Halifax to join the wires at Huddersfield. Probably announced just before an election !
Phase 3 would be then via Hebden Bridge, probably around 2050 based on the current timetable.

 

[61653 HTAFC]

No doubt wires from Leeds to Bradford Interchange will get the Cross Bradford Link people going again...

 

[Hophead]

I've not read the documentation but, from the comments so far, this would appear to be the only local electrification scheme in the whole IRP, which seems pretty poor to me.

 

[Roast Veg]

No doubt wires from Leeds to Bradford Interchange will get the Cross Bradford Link people going again...

That's covered by the WYCA mass transit proposals, as opposed to heavy rail.

 

[Kite159]

If its a small start into wiring up the entire route from Leeds to Manchester via the Calder Valley then it's all good. Even if at the start use might be limited to a shuttle from Bradford Interchange to Leeds (then carrying on towards York when the gap is filled between Leeds & Church Fenton).

Would allow the Manchester/Blackpool - Leeds services to skip New Pudsey & Bramley [or at least reduce the call so maybe 1tph calls at both stations otherwise you will get someone moaning that they have to change trains on their infrequent journey from Bramley to Rochdale.

 

[matacaster]

No doubt wires from Leeds to Bradford Interchange will get the Cross Bradford Link people going again...

Bradford council would surely propose battery powered passenger road - railers to get between interchange and forster sq and then wonder why it wouldn't happen.

 

[Starmill]

Minimal sop to Bradford.

I have a feeling that it has literally been included with no strategic objective whatsoever and is there purely as you say because Ministers felt that something needed to be offered to Bradford.

 

[61653 HTAFC]

That's covered by the WYCA mass transit proposals, as opposed to heavy rail.

Exactly how it should be. Bradford Crossrail is the Crayonista project that will never die.

 

[Roast Veg]

Exactly how it should be. Bradford Crossrail is the Crayonista project that will never die.

The same goes for Manchester, which has a serviceable rapid transit system in place of a crossrail. If only it had integrated ticketing...

 

[61653 HTAFC]

Bradford council would surely propose battery powered passenger road - railers to get between interchange and forster sq and then wonder why it wouldn't happen.

Battery? That's no good, it needs to be some sort of magical future-fuel surely!

 

[YorksLad12]

Exactly how it should be. Bradford Crossrail is the Crayonista project that will never die.

Probably keeping SELRAP company...

On-topic, I did suggest in the other thread that starting electrification from Halifax, with a few speed improvements, would help (Hell-)Hull-Halifax services. I don't think Halifax-Huddersfield wiring will happen until it absolutely has to - it doesn't have the traffic.

 

[61653 HTAFC]

Probably keeping SELRAP company...

On-topic, I did suggest in the other thread that starting electrification from Halifax, with a few speed improvements, would help (Hell-)Hull-Halifax services. I don't think Halifax-Huddersfield wiring will happen until it absolutely has to - it doesn't have the traffic.

Though once you've done the TPE line via Huddersfield and you start doing the Calder Valley, filling in the gaps (Heaton Lodge to Milner Royd junctions plus the Bradley and Salterhebble curves) is a pretty quick win.

 

[Class 170101]

You need to start Calder Valley route electrification some where without getting in the way of most of it being the TRU works diversionary route for the next decade...

They should be using Bradford too for diversionary purposes when Mirfield is closed.

What is the Bradford-Leeds electrification in aid of? The Calder route goes two ways, with no wires until Victoria or Preston... seems random. Unless part of something else un-articulated.

or Huddersfield / Mirfield

 

[childwallblues]

Perhaps when/if everything is electrified the York and Hull stoppers could start from Bradford? The Calder Valley services could then skip New Pudsey and Bramley, reducing journey time.

So:
2x Bradford - stops - Leeds - stops - York/Hull
2x Bradford - stops - Leeds
4x Calder Valley - Bradford - non-stop - Leeds


By far the most likely answer

I agree with that.

 

[Bigman]

If Leeds to Hull gets electrified, I can see the Halifax - Hull starting from Interchange instead in which case it can be done by an EMU. I also wonder if LNER would switch to Interchange being able to run electric all the way. If Leeds to Interchange became a self enclosed service with no extensions to Halifax and beyond, in theory you should be able to increase frequency as there will be no crossing of paths at Mill Lane Jcn. You could then also have more trains from Interchange heading West.

 

[thejuggler]

Purpose? Potential to run LNER (and HS2 as Grant Shapps has just stated they will run to Leeds) services to Interchange rather than Forster Square? FS has platform capacity issues and platforms too short for ten unit sets.

That could also possibly meet the 12 minute Leeds to Bradford 'promise'.