What would you like to hear from Boris Johnson's announcement on Sunday evening?

[bramling]

Perhaps train driver reported him.

I can’t really see it. Unless there was something a little more nefarious going on, such as an element of trespass for example, I can’t see a train driver being bothered about someone at a remote crossing. It wouldn’t be worth the hassle of going via the signaller and thence to BTP, and I can’t see a driver waiting until the end of the journey and then reporting it to BTP themselves. I’d definitely go more with the curtain-twitching local, or probably more likely the incensed dog walker!

Having said all that, there seems to be a bit of a crackdown going on in London today. I was stopped twice, once entering an Underground station, and more interestingly the second time in an interchange passage. In the latter case it was quite dystopian as key workers were getting a smiley “sorry to bother you, have a nice day” treatment, meanwhile others were being pulled in for interrogation and, it appeared, fines. There may have been a little more to it than met the eye however, as I know there’s been quite a bit of drug-busting going on. As regards tomorrow’s Boris announcement, evidently it seems we’ve a way to go before normality...

 

[Qwerty133]

It's 1.5 million

There are around 1.5 people in the extremely vulnerable group that are required to shield however according to the NHS moderate risk group (conditions such as diabetes and mild asthma) are also classified as vulnerable which brings it to around 17 million who are classified as vulnerable.

 

[Bletchleyite]

Having said all that, there seems to be a bit of a crackdown going on in London today. I was stopped twice, once entering an Underground station, and more interestingly the second time in an interchange passage. In the latter case it was quite dystopian as key workers were getting a smiley “sorry to bother you, have a nice day” treatment, meanwhile others were being pulled in for interrogation and, it appeared, fines. There may have been a little more to it than met the eye however, as I know there’s been quite a bit of drug-busting going on. As regards tomorrow’s Boris announcement, evidently it seems we’ve a way to go before normality...

FWIW, I'm pretty sure it'll be:
- Unlimited local outdoor exercise (which the law always allowed but the advice doesn't) - but still don't go to the Lakes etc.
- Some extra businesses opening e.g. garden centres
- Another 3 weeks

Enough of it has been leaked to get an idea.

 

[bramling]

FWIW, I'm pretty sure it'll be:
- Unlimited local outdoor exercise (which the law always allowed but the advice doesn't) - but still don't go to the Lakes etc.
- Some extra businesses opening e.g. garden centres
- Another 3 weeks

Enough of it has been leaked to get an idea.

Yes that ties in with what I’ve seen hinted internally at work. I suspect it’s going to be simply permissing what many have been doing anyway, with a couple of sweeteners like garden centres thrown in.

 

[leightonbd]

This is a little bit contrarian, but I think he needs to say something like ‘if you break the rules and kill yourself, it’s your own stupid fault’ - addressed to civvies, obviously, not to key workers - whose role he should celebrate to the point of saying ‘you will have a medal’ (a metaphor, but I hope you know what I mean). Something to emphasise individual responsibility.

Yes, they need to deliver testing and intensive care too, but it’s us who give it to each other.

 

[Bletchleyite]

This is a little bit contrarian, but I think he needs to say something like ‘if you break the rules and kill yourself, it’s your own stupid fault’ - addressed to civvies, obviously, not to key workers - whose role he should celebrate to the point of saying ‘you will have a medal’ (a metaphor, but I hope you know what I mean). Something to emphasise individual responsibility.

That won't work, as the natural answer to that is "I'll take the risk, then". As I've said I'm not scared of it at all, really.

The message still needs to be that you might kill your family by being inconsiderate. I would be scared of that.

 

[bramling]

This is a little bit contrarian, but I think he needs to say something like ‘if you break the rules and kill yourself, it’s your own stupid fault’ - addressed to civvies, obviously, not to key workers - whose role he should celebrate to the point of saying ‘you will have a medal’ (a metaphor, but I hope you know what I mean). Something to emphasise individual responsibility.

Yes, they need to deliver testing and intensive care too, but it’s us who give it to each other.

I don’t think there will be because ultimately Boris has been too busy just struggling to keep up with the basics through all this, however there should be some kind of nugget for key workers. Fatigue is really beginning to bite for many now IME, and there’s plenty of twists still to come.

 

[Islineclear3_1]

This is a little bit contrarian, but I think he needs to say something like ‘if you break the rules and kill yourself, it’s your own stupid fault’

The nanny state doesn't allow for that I'm afraid

 

[Bletchleyite]

Yes that ties in with what I’ve seen hinted internally at work. I suspect it’s going to be simply permissing what many have been doing anyway, with a couple of sweeteners like garden centres thrown in.

FWIW I'm actually quite glad of that. I've been doing one long spell of exercise, mostly cycling as I can keep that going longer than running, but I'd probably rather do a shorter spell in the morning and a walk in the late evening. I could get away with that, sure, but I'd rather it was allowed.

 

[bramling]

That won't work, as the natural answer to that is "I'll take the risk, then". As I've said I'm not scared of it at all, really.

The message still needs to be that you might kill your family by being inconsiderate. I would be scared of that.

I don’t think *anyone* should be nonchalant enough to be completely unconcerned about getting it. As we know viruses mutate, so what’s held true so far doesn’t necessarily guarantee to always be so.

I’m content that my risk profile is likely to be fairly low, hence I’m happy to work with some level of mitigation in place. Like you I’m particularly bothered about passing it to others.

 

[Bletchleyite]

The nanny state doesn't allow for that I'm afraid

I'm very anti-nanny-state, but there's near enough nothing at all nanny-stateist about any of it. It's all about what the law's main purpose in my eyes is - stopping one person's ill-judged or immoral actions adversely affecting others.

If it would only affect the person who caught it and there was no spread (I know that's a ridiculous premise, but that it is sort of makes the point!), I'd be all in favour of chucking the doors open.

 

[Bletchleyite]

I don’t think *anyone* should be nonchalant enough to be completely unconcerned about getting it. As we know viruses mutate, so what’s held true so far doesn’t necessarily guarantee to always be so.

I wouldn't say completely unconcerned. I don't actively want it, it would involve being stuck at home (unable to even exercise or shop) feeling awful, but it doesn't worry me enough to wish to take any particular precaution to protect myself from it any more than I normally do[1] flu. My actions are being driven pretty much entirely by altruism.

[1] I had the jab last year but only because a pharmacist invited me to while picking up a prescription and I said I might as well while I was there. I wouldn't even have gone as far as making an appointment to have it. I've had flu, it was rubbish, I got better. It is overridingly likely this would be the outcome of COVID were I to catch it.

 

[Jamesrob637]

I was going to say the same - MK is very, very quiet, a bit Christmas Day or New Year's Day esque. Maybe everyone's gone to the seaside

Motorways are dead around here but local roads have picked up a bit more traffic since the end of April. That said, it (still) does go extremely quiet after around the time I type this (8pm) - the obvious exception being yesterday evening but where I live people did seem to be keeping their distance.

 

[CaptainHaddock]

FWIW, I'm pretty sure it'll be:
- Unlimited local outdoor exercise (which the law always allowed but the advice doesn't) - but still don't go to the Lakes etc.
- Some extra businesses opening e.g. garden centres
- Another 3 weeks

Enough of it has been leaked to get an idea.

This plus allowing people to meet up outdoors with friends, relatives or partners you don't live with. When you think about it, it seems daft you couldn't do this from the start of the lockdown seeing as you've always been allowed to share indoor spaces like supermarkets and corner shops with people you don't live with!

 

[Fawkes Cat]

When you think about it, it seems daft you couldn't do this from the start of the lockdown seeing as you've always been allowed to share indoor spaces like supermarkets and corner shops with people you don't live with!

You spend a lot less time walking past someone in the supermarket than you do if you have them round for tea.

 

[Huntergreed]

Surely any form of outdoor meetup, provided distancing is abided to, carries little to no risk.

 

[superjohn]

...seeing as you've always been allowed to share indoor spaces like supermarkets and corner shops with people you don't live with!

That was unavoidable though, shutting down everything would have been a practical impossibility. The point of the restrictions was to limit social contact as much as possible in order to limit the spread of the virus, not prevent it. Shopping for food is essential, meeting up with family isn’t.

I can understand the government's caution on easing at the moment. Once social meeting of any kind (even just in small groups or with immediate family) is permitted, enforcement will be pretty much impossible. People in the UK aren’t required to carry ID for themselves let alone proof of who their relatives are.

I expect the announcement to be little more than an attempt by Boris to capitalise on the VE commemorations and present himself as a modern day Churchill. There will be very little real content, just a supposed ‘easing‘ of the restrictions on the things people are already doing and are already within the law anyway.

Cummings and Co have already falsely briefed various options to the media to sound out public opinion. The consensus has come back that they can get away with a few more weeks of lockdown without losing public support.

 

[lyndhurst25]

I'd like to see more public services reopened, provided that it can be done safely, which I'm sure it could for most places. Where I am we've still got council rubbish tips, certain public parks, all public toilets and even some post boxes all closed up "due to COVID".

The 2 metre rule could do with tweaking, but as it is at least it is easy to understand. Maybe: something like it being okay to pass within 1m if you're moving, but stay 2m apart if stationary. That way I wouldn't get so many old ladies (so far it's only been old ladies) shooing me away like a naughty cat should we meet on a narrowish pavement or footpath.

I'd also like to see harsh penalties introduced for obstructing public footpaths and for putting up unauthorised home-made "go home" signs: something else that I have seen around here.

 

[Ianno87]

FWIW, I'm pretty sure it'll be:
- Unlimited local outdoor exercise (which the law always allowed but the advice doesn't) - but still don't go to the Lakes etc.
- Some extra businesses opening e.g. garden centres
- Another 3 weeks

Enough of it has been leaked to get an idea.

"Another 3 weeks" comes with it a near-implication of more significant easing of restrictions after that.

3 weeks also pretty much takes us all across the next Bank Holiday weekend as an obvious "punctuation point"

 

[chris11256]

There had been many reports that the late may review would have a more significant easing of restrictions, coinciding with the reopening of Primary schools and more business opening.

 

[Huntergreed]

I would like the following:

- 3 more weeks of the current restrictions, both to get cases down further and to keep the 'pro-lockdown' camp happy until the death rate falls to a number they'll be happy with or at least closer to it
- Announcement of a plan to get those who are not in the vulnerable group back to work and back to as near normality as possible (with distancing) within the next 2 months
- A reduction of the 2m which was brought in over a panic to the just as effective and far more practical 1m for social distancing
- An announcement to increase services to a Saturday service with morning and evening peaks in the next month or so to prepare for more to go back to work
- A change in messaging from 'go out and you will die' to 'we need to find a balance and get this country moving again', we need to focus on 'saving lives from covid' to 'saving lives from all causes (mental health, loss of livelihood, financial difficulty, covid, other health conditions), we need to open our eyes as a nation and realise this isn't about suppressing a virus, it's about minimising the damage to the population and the economy whilst keeping everyone as happy and as many alive as possible.

This is all necessary as I see it and I'm hopeful but not convinced it's coming.

 

[Bletchleyite]

"Another 3 weeks" comes with it a near-implication of more significant easing of restrictions after that.

3 weeks also pretty much takes us all across the next Bank Holiday weekend as an obvious "punctuation point"

Yes, the issue with BHs is that people are more inclined to travel afar. Locking down across the next one too gives them until August until there's a need to worry about that again.

 

[Bletchleyite]

There had been many reports that the late may review would have a more significant easing of restrictions, coinciding with the reopening of Primary schools and more business opening.

There were, but the cases aren't dropping as quickly as desired. That said, this is mostly in care homes I believe...

 

[bramling]

Yes, the issue with BHs is that people are more inclined to travel afar. Locking down across the next one too gives them until August until there's a need to worry about that again.

I don’t really see why we’re even having designated bank holidays this year now. It seems a completely unnecessary distraction.

 

[Huntergreed]

There were, but the cases aren't dropping as quickly as desired. That said, this is mostly in care homes I believe...

That's correct, however if you go on social media the 'pro lockdown army' are still convinced that all these cases are coming from 'the idiots who went to the park at the weekend' and that the fatality rate is around 100%.

 

[chris11256]

There were, but the cases aren't dropping as quickly as desired. That said, this is mostly in care homes I believe...

I think that's largely correct. Cases in the community have largely dropped massively, but they're struggling with outbreaks in hospitals & care homes. No amount of community lockdown fixes that problem.

 

[bramling]

That's correct, however if you go on social media the 'pro lockdown army' are still convinced that all these cases are coming from 'the idiots who went to the park at the weekend' and that the fatality rate is around 100%.

They might have a partial point with the way some runners seem not to have grasped any concept of distancing.

 

[Bletchleyite]

I don’t really see why we’re even having designated bank holidays this year now. It seems a completely unnecessary distraction.

TBH I've quite enjoyed the 3 day weekends, I'm still working as normal (remotely). To everyone else I suppose not, but then there's no *harm* in them if you're furloughed either, they are just totally neutral.

 

[Bletchleyite]

They might have a partial point with the way some runners seem not to have grasped any concept of distancing.

It's not believed that running past someone even right up close is likely to cause significant spread.

 

[Ianno87]

I don’t really see why we’re even having designated bank holidays this year now. It seems a completely unnecessary distraction.

The extra days off are useful mental breaks for homeworkers, especially those with other caring resonsibilities, to reinforce some kind of work-life balance that could otherwise become incredibly blurred.