Where is the operation boundary of London Taxis?

[miklcct]

Where can London Taxis operate? Specifically, in which area a London Taxi can't refuse hire, and outside which area a London Taxi is legally prohibited to operate at all?

 

[birchesgreen]

Black cabs are legally obliged to take on any job for journeys up to 12 miles (20 miles for cabs at the Heathrow Airport taxi ranks) or up to one-hour duration.

London taxis, black cabs and minicabs

Find all the information you need to travel around London by taxi, including London's black cabs and minicabs.

www.visitlondon.com

But i assume they can go further if they want to?

 

[Bletchleyite]

London taxis, black cabs and minicabs

Find all the information you need to travel around London by taxi, including London's black cabs and minicabs.

www.visitlondon.com

But i assume they can go further if they want to?

They can go wherever they like. Sometimes, in rail disruption, they'll end up going places like Manchester. If they do it's up to them whether they agree it, and up to them whether they want to use the meter or negotiate a fare in advance.

I might be wrong but I think they can only ply for hire in Greater London, though.

 

[Peter Mugridge]

I might be wrong but I think they can only ply for hire in Greater London, though.

We have black cabs in Epsom - however, these are registered with Epsom and Ewell Borough Council so may be operating under different regulations.

 

[MotCO]

Aren't they managed by the Public Cariage Office, a subset of the Met Police? Or is this ancient history?

 

[James H]

Aren't they managed by the Public Cariage Office, a subset of the Met Police? Or is this ancient history?

That's ancient history. They are now regulated by Transport for London's private hire and taxi division.

 

[MotCO]

That's ancient history. They are now regulated by Transport for London's private hire and taxi division.

Ok - so 'black taxis' can only pick up in the TfL area?

 

[GusB]

Taxis regulated by Transport for London will only be allowed to "ply for hire" within TfL boundaries, but there's nothing to stop them picking up anywhere else if they're pre-booked; they essentially become private hire cars at that point.

The firm I worked for had many corporate clients who would attend events outwith the London boundary, and they would expect us to pick them up afterwards. I recall one particular night-shift incident when we were struggling to get a driver anywhere near the "outside London" location and there was much grief. Ultimately, there's not much you can do to persuade a self-employed cabbie to head into deepest Surrey to pick up a corporate ****** bigwig who has a "don't you know who I am" complex and has had far too much to drink.

 

[Blindtraveler]

I attended a wedding back in August where one guessed had been so hopelessly delayed leaving Ilford bye a minor family emergency that they had literally picked up a black cab outside the station and ask the driver if they wouldn't mind going all the way to Maidstone. Driver quite happily obliged provided the customer could help them find a charge point in Maidstone as it was one of the new all-electric jobs

 

[route101]

Seen a few London black hacks in Southampton, seen a few white Southampton Taxis in London too.

 

[busestrains]

Taxis regulated by Transport for London will only be allowed to "ply for hire" within TfL boundaries, but there's nothing to stop them picking up anywhere else if they're pre-booked; they essentially become private hire cars at that point.

The firm I worked for had many corporate clients who would attend events outwith the London boundary, and they would expect us to pick them up afterwards. I recall one particular night-shift incident when we were struggling to get a driver anywhere near the "outside London" location and there was much grief. Ultimately, there's not much you can do to persuade a self-employed cabbie to head into deepest Surrey to pick up a corporate ****** bigwig who has a "don't you know who I am" complex and has had far too much to drink.

But i think if they pick up outside of the Greater London border than they are only allowed to take passengers to somewhere inside the Greater London border. They can not take passengers for a journey entirely outside of the Greater London area. So something like Tunbridge Wells to Orpington or Lewes to Croydon or Guildford to Sutton or Reading to Heathrow is fine to do. But something like Tunbridge Wells to Tonbridge or Lewes to Uckfield or Guildford to Dorking or Reading to Slough would not be allowed.

 

[Fawkes Cat]

But i think if they pick up outside of the Greater London border than they are only allowed to take passengers to somewhere inside the Greater London border. They can not take passengers for a journey entirely outside of the Greater London area. So something like Tunbridge Wells to Orpington or Lewes to Croydon or Guildford to Sutton or Reading to Heathrow is fine to do. But something like Tunbridge Wells to Tonbridge or Lewes to Uckfield or Guildford to Dorking or Reading to Slough would not be allowed.

The point may well be moot as realistically, it's hard to think why anyone would try to call a London hackney for (say) Reading to Slough: anyone (or any organisation) remotely local would just call their local private hire operator. And it seems to me that these days someone unfamiliar with how British taxis work would be familiar with Uber - and would call one of those.

 

[philthetube]

But i think if they pick up outside of the Greater London border than they are only allowed to take passengers to somewhere inside the Greater London border. They can not take passengers for a journey entirely outside of the Greater London area. So something like Tunbridge Wells to Orpington or Lewes to Croydon or Guildford to Sutton or Reading to Heathrow is fine to do. But something like Tunbridge Wells to Tonbridge or Lewes to Uckfield or Guildford to Dorking or Reading to Slough would not be allowed.

The certainly do LUL work which does not enter London, Watford to Rickmansworth is common, also Rickmansworth to Amersham or even Aylesbury.

 

[miklcct]

The certainly do LUL work which does not enter London, Watford to Rickmansworth is common, also Rickmansworth to Amersham or even Aylesbury.

In this case are they operating on a pre-booked basis instead, or are they actually at the station rank plying for hire?

 

[philthetube]

But i think if they pick up outside of the Greater London border than they are only allowed to take passengers to somewhere inside the Greater London border. They can not take passengers for a journey entirely outside of the Greater London area. So something like Tunbridge Wells to Orpington or Lewes to Croydon or Guildford to Sutton or Reading to Heathrow is fine to do. But something like Tunbridge Wells to Tonbridge or Lewes to Uckfield or Guildford to Dorking or Reading to Slough would not be allowed.

In this case are they operating on a pre-booked basis instead, or are they actually at the station rank plying for hire?

Pre booked, they are deff not allowed to ply for hire outside London boundaries

I was replying to the above comment.

 

[Mojo]

The point may well be moot as realistically, it's hard to think why anyone would try to call a London hackney for (say) Reading to Slough: anyone (or any organisation) remotely local would just call their local private hire operator. And it seems to me that these days someone unfamiliar with how British taxis work would be familiar with Uber - and would call one of those.

There is a big shortage of the cheaper private hire vehicles with many drivers having left the industry at the start of the period of government restrictions due to Covid.

I was at Gatwick airport at 01.30 last week and there were simply no private hire vehicles available on the Freenow app with a huge queue for the local minicab company.

Plenty of TfL registered black cabs though. Just tried planning a route on Freenow and it’ll happily allow me to book a Levc black cab from Gatwick to Brighton, which is entirely outside Greater London.

 

[Basil Jet]

In this case are they operating on a pre-booked basis instead, or are they actually at the station rank plying for hire?

"LUL Work" in the taxi trade means contract work taking LUL staff to and from home in the small hours. It does not mean ranking at an LUL station.

 

[pepperpot80]

Licenced taxis (not minicabs or private hire vehicles), can legally ply for hire - i.e. accept a walk-up fare - anywhere they are licenced.

All-London licencees, denoted by their green licence badges (not the colour of their taxi) may ply for hire anywhere within Greater London. They are not allowed to refuse a fare that commences within 6 miles of the equestrian statue of Charles I south of Trafalgar Square, providing the destination is not further than 12 miles away. TfL have more details on their licencing website.

Suburban licensees, denoted by a yellow licence badge, may only ply for hire in the suburban sector(s) for which they are licenced. These sectors are typically similar to, but not always identical to, boundaries between collection of London boroughs. A suburban licencee may not refuse a fare which is wholly within their licenced sectors.

All TfL-licenced taxi, minicab, and PHV drivers can accept pre-booked fares to and from anywhere they like in England & Wales, as long as the vehicle, driver, and vehicle operator are licenced by TfL (which London taxis necessarily are in order to operate). So if you're willing to pay a cabbie for a Gatwick - Brighton fare, that's between you, the cabbie, and the money in your pocket. If you want to Google more, this is known as the Triple Licencing Requirement.

 

[BRM]

The boundary must be somewhere between Heathrow T5 and Hilton T5 as several cabs wouldn't take us after arriving late on a delayed flight. Eventually one did and said a price before we set off. Apparently they can decline/refuse journeys that go outside their license zone. Anyway it's a poor service offer at 1am!

 

[Ediswan]

The boundary must be somewhere between Heathrow T5 and Hilton T5 as several cabs wouldn't take us after arriving late on a delayed flight. Eventually one did and said a price before we set off. Apparently they can decline/refuse journeys that go outside their license zone. Anyway it's a poor service offer at 1am!

Heathrow is a special case. Cabbies queue for a long time in the hope of getting a well-paying journey into the centre of London. They really don't want a short local journey, as I found out when I once wanted to get to Stockley Park (just north of M4 J4).

 

[Bletchleyite]

Heathrow is a special case. Cabbies queue for a long time in the hope of getting a well-paying journey into the centre of London. They really don't want a short local journey, as I found out when I once wanted to get to Stockley Park (just north of M4 J4).

I thought there was an option to "push in" the queue if you come back within a certain time?

 

[transportphoto]

I thought there was an option to "push in" the queue if you come back within a certain time?

At risk of taking the thread off topic, this video put together by a vlogging TfL hackney driver may be of interest to you:

 

[Ediswan]

I thought there was an option to "push in" the queue if you come back within a certain time?

If I recall correctly, my driver did collect some sort of ticket, but was not sure he would be able to get back in time. This was some ago.

 

[GusB]

At risk of taking the thread off topic, this video put together by a vlogging TfL hackney driver may be of interest to you:

Thanks for sharing this!

I have experience with London taxis in as much as I worked in an out-sourced call centre for one of the big London cab firms, but the people I had the least contact with were the cabbies on the front line. I met people at head office, the dispatchers in "control" and I had a lovely chat with the guys at the in-house maintenance centre. My colleague from Edinburgh and I were ferried about in taxis (on account) when it was reasonably quiet in town, but when it got to rush hour we were advised to jump on the tube back to Harrow and retain our tickets for expenses!

From the video, I get the impression that this lovely chap was a "lone wolf". There's nothing wrong with that but, when he had a fare beyond the outer edges of London, he had no choice but to head back to either Heathrow or central London. Perhaps if he'd been on one of the radio "circuits" he may have had the chance to pick up a pre-booked fare on the way back.

Without trying to go off-topic too much, I found that the happiest local taxi drivers were those who did lots of short fares within a fairly small geographical area and, if there was no "radio" booking in the meantime, were able to return to the city centre taxi ranks with minimum dead mileage. I can't imagine any of those drivers putting up with having to wait at an airport for two hours, regardless of how lucrative a potential fare may be!

 

[island]

But i think if they pick up outside of the Greater London border than they are only allowed to take passengers to somewhere inside the Greater London border. They can not take passengers for a journey entirely outside of the Greater London area. So something like Tunbridge Wells to Orpington or Lewes to Croydon or Guildford to Sutton or Reading to Heathrow is fine to do. But something like Tunbridge Wells to Tonbridge or Lewes to Uckfield or Guildford to Dorking or Reading to Slough would not be allowed.

That’s not correct. London black taxis operating on a pre-booked basis may carry passengers between any two points in England (possibly Wales also), neither of which need be in Greater London.

The boundary must be somewhere between Heathrow T5 and Hilton T5 as several cabs wouldn't take us after arriving late on a delayed flight. Eventually one did and said a price before we set off. Apparently they can decline/refuse journeys that go outside their license zone. Anyway it's a poor service offer at 1am!

The legal position is that black cabs can’t refuse a hire for less than twenty miles/1 hour originating from Heathrow if that journey is within Greater London, and they can attempt to negotiate a price for journeys that will leave Greater London. In practice, they will do anything they can to refuse “short” jobs from Heathrow as they would much rather a good central London fare which could push over £100.

The “T5” Hilton, as you have correctly discovered, is outside the boundary.