Where Would You Build A New Rail Connected Airport to Serve SW Britain?

[Envoy]

I read* that £400 million is going to be invested in Bristol Airport - which has become the main airport serving SW Britain - and by that I include south Wales.

* https://www.walesonline.co.uk/news/uk-news/bristol-airport-launches-major-overhaul-30218013

Bristol Airport has launched an investment programme exceeding £400m to upgrade the customer experience at the airport. Dave Lees, CEO at Bristol Airport, outlined the improvements that will be coming.

"Over the next five years significant enhancements are coming to all aspects of the customer journey at Bristol Airport," he said.

Both Cardiff (Rhoose) & Bristol (Lulsgate) Airports developed from wartime airfields. Nobody in their right mind would have chosen either location for a modern airport to serve SW Britain. Of the old wartime airfields, Filton would have been the best option (railway alongside) but by the time it was no longer used for plane making, Cribbs Causeway shopping Mall (alongside) and Bradley Stoke housing had already been built.

The Blair Government set up a commission to look into airport provision in SW Britain and came to the conclusion that both Cardiff & Bristol Airports should remain. (The Welsh Government did not push for a new airport as Cardiff was/is the capital of a ‘nation’ and already had its own airport). Neither did they push for a new airport on the site of the mostly vacated Llanwern steelworks east of Newport which has a mainline railway alongside and could have been connected to a new M4 running to the south of Newport. It was also midway between Bristol & Cardiff with good links to the wider region. Noise would mainly have been over industrial south Newport. Now new housing covers much of the Llanwern steelworks site.

So, we are where we are with Bristol Airport pulling ahead in terms of expansion and Cardiff having a job attracting growth. Both airports are difficult to reach from the main lines of communication not being on or even near the motorways and with no dual highways to the M5 or M4. Neither airport has rail connection although of the two, Cardiff has a station at Rhoose with a 2 mile shuttle bus taking passengers to the terminal building along an uncongested road. (The shuttle buses on the longer journey from Bristol Airport to Temple Meads use congested roads but at least TM is a mainline station). Transport for Wales have been dragging their feet in getting a half hourly train service operating on the Vale of Glamorgan Coast line via Rhoose which connects with the mainline at Cardiff Central and at Bridgend for west Wales.

As pure speculation, if you were a planner, where would you build a new airport to serve SW Britain today that was near the main population centres of Cardiff, Newport & Bristol with good links by rail and road to the wider region? I will kick things off by suggesting the flatland near Pilning station which would be re-configured into an airport station. You have excellent motorway links nearby and most aircraft noise would be over industrial areas alongside the Severn at Avonmouth.

Google Map of the area.

 

[deltic]

Given we are in fantasy land I would build a combined Seven Barrage, between Cardiff and Weston and an island airport with connecting rail and road links to Cardiff and Bristol

 

[CastlebarKeith]

Hang on a minute!
BRISTOL Filton once had the longest airport runway in the whole U.K
There is still a railway station at Filton
Filton Airport has now been closed for house building

When l was growing up (many years ago) I was taught that people in other countries were mad

Welcome to the U.K folks!

 

[DanNCL]

I’d put it on an artificial island in the Severn just south of Severn Tunnel Junction.

Aircraft noise would be over the Severn and no villages would have to be demolished to build it so less likely to majorly frustrate the locals.
Transport links would be good as it’s next to the M4 and could be connected to the existing station at Severn Tunnel Junction by an automated people mover.

Would it cost a bomb? Yes. But would it be beneficial both to the South West of England and to the South of Wales? Yes.

 

[The exile]

Hang on a minute!
BRISTOL Filton once had the longest airport runway in the whole U.K
There is still a railway station at Filton
Filton Airport has now been closed for house building

When l was growing up (many years ago) I was taught that people in other countries were mad

Welcome to the U.K folks!

Expansion of existing airports in continental Europe has proved impossible where town growth has meant they are now “near neighbours” of a lot of residential property. Introducing regular / frequent flights from Filton would have been a non-starter for many decades - though it might just have still been acceptable at the point at which Lulsgate was chosen to replace Whitchurch.
Even if Filton were still available as an airport site, to say it is rail connected because of the existing station would be like calling Hayes & Harlington “Heathrow” as a sole rail connection.

 

[BrianW]

These proposals are some way from Cornwall! How about Exeter?

 

[Mike Machin]

Bristol airport is just fine, I've not had any problems driving to it and nor have any of the people I know. Even at airports with amazing public transport provision, Gatwick, Southampton, Birmingham etc, the vast majority of people travel by car.

 

[LYradial]

These proposals are some way from Cornwall! How about Exeter?

I like that, build an artificial island in the middle of the estuary, from starcross seawards and the runway floating out to sea, perhaps with catapult help for takeoff and arresters for landing.

bit like the Isle of Man , hope you are going fast enough when you reach the end of the runway, Jersey is a bit like that, except the runway ends at a cliff edge.


gloucester airport is up for sale offers around 2.5 million, I flew from there once, park the car (free), walk across the road,
hop aboard the aircraft, Franz is flying today he is still learning, off we go.

lunch at home, afternoon tea in Jersey

 

[Tetragon213]

These proposals are some way from Cornwall! How about Exeter?

Why stop there? Let's make Land's End Airport the main airport for the SW!!
Being more serious, Yeovil might make for an interesting idea.

 

[The exile]

Bristol airport is just fine, I've not had any problems driving to it and nor have any of the people I know. Even at airports with amazing public transport provision, Gatwick, Southampton, Birmingham etc, the vast majority of people travel by car.

When either arrival or departure is at “no frills o’clock” it’s not so much the public transport links into the airport that are the determining factor - it’s the next / previous stage. The various airport buses run nearly round the clock but unless you’re within walking distance of the route arriving at central Bristol / Bath at 1am is going to leave you stranded.

 

[deltic]

Hang on a minute!
BRISTOL Filton once had the longest airport runway in the whole U.K
There is still a railway station at Filton
Filton Airport has now been closed for house building

When l was growing up (many years ago) I was taught that people in other countries were mad

Welcome to the U.K folks!

Economic and social benefits from the housing will be far greater than from an airport that shovels huge amounts of money out of the country to Spain, Turkey and Greece etc.

 

[stuu]

Bristol airport is just fine, I've not had any problems driving to it and nor have any of the people I know. Even at airports with amazing public transport provision, Gatwick, Southampton, Birmingham etc, the vast majority of people travel by car.

36% arrive at Gatwick by car. Which isn't the vast majority

It's a pain to get to by car or public transport, it could be much better. The Pilning idea above has some merit

 

[HSTEd]

A study of the wind rose for Portishead and Newport suggests the ideal runway orientation is somewhere around E-W or ENE-WSW.

Assuming this is a fantasy thread (because, unfortunately, the realistic answer is to do nothing), I would suggest a two runway airport in the Bristol Channel between Cardiff and Clevedon, with runways orientated at about 060/240 degrees. Rail access would be by two new crossings (from both sides) and it would likely take over the traffic of the Severn Rail tunnel completely.

 

[etr221]

My (one) experience of going to Bristol (Lulsgate) airport is that it was a long way down 'ordinary' (single carriageway, 2 lane) road to get there - from anywhere - it's a long way off the motorway (or anything looking like one).
Looking at the map, road access to Cardiff (Rhoose) is no better.

What should have been done is to make Filton Bristol's airport - it was as near to an ideal site as you could have got...

 

[Envoy]

Many thanks everyone for your responses thus far.

Some of you have mentioned building an airport on an artificial island in the Severn estuary. That island would have to be relatively high to overcome any prospect of rising sea levels caused by global warming. I also note that back in the 1607* that what may have been a tsunami came up the Bristol Channel flooding the neighbouring flatlands. (It may have simply been a high tide combined with a storm surge - who knows)?

An artificial island in the estuary would obviously attract the wrath of the green brigade for taking wading birds feeding grounds. (This happened when they flooded Cardiff Bay due to the construction of the barrage. Note that this barrage has in fact protected Cardiff from flooding due to storm surges). Anyway, the wading birds still have loads of exposed mud on which to feed in the estuary and that would be a problem for any such new airport = the danger of birds being sucked into jet engines.

* You can read about it here:> https://www.livinglevels.org.uk/stories/2018/12/10/the-great-flood-1607

 

[Sad Sprinter]

I vote for the Barrage idea. With a new mass transit system linking Cardiff, Newport and Bristol. However, surely if you really wanted to you can easily make Heathrow the main airport for SW England/South Wales?

 

[I'm here now]

Just build a High speed line to London and eliminate the need for a SW airport. Much more sensible! Or Brum for that matter.

 

[Tomos y Tanc]

It's a great question.

It's impossible now, but the best option would have been the original Cardiff Airport at Pengam Moors which would have sat right betside the M4 and the SWML. Unfortunately, just as at Filton, the Government of the day (in this case David Maxwell Fyfe) baulked at the cost of diverting the river Rhymney to extend the runway and opted for a clapped out RAF base in Rhoose instead.

I suspect we have to live with what we've got with Bristol being the 'holiday airport' and Cardiff the centre for aircraft maintenance and new technology.

In terms of international travel, if a tiny fraction of what has been splurged on HS2 and the Elizabeth Line had been spent on a Reading to Heathrow link, the question wouldn't arise.

 

[AlastairFraser]

I read* that £400 million is going to be invested in Bristol Airport - which has become the main airport serving SW Britain - and by that I include south Wales.




Both Cardiff (Rhoose) & Bristol (Lulsgate) Airports developed from wartime airfields. Nobody in their right mind would have chosen either location for a modern airport to serve SW Britain. Of the old wartime airfields, Filton would have been the best option (railway alongside) but by the time it was no longer used for plane making, Cribbs Causeway shopping Mall (alongside) and Bradley Stoke housing had already been built.

The Blair Government set up a commission to look into airport provision in SW Britain and came to the conclusion that both Cardiff & Bristol Airports should remain. (The Welsh Government did not push for a new airport as Cardiff was/is the capital of a ‘nation’ and already had its own airport). Neither did they push for a new airport on the site of the mostly vacated Llanwern steelworks east of Newport which has a mainline railway alongside and could have been connected to a new M4 running to the south of Newport. It was also midway between Bristol & Cardiff with good links to the wider region. Noise would mainly have been over industrial south Newport. Now new housing covers much of the Llanwern steelworks site.

So, we are where we are with Bristol Airport pulling ahead in terms of expansion and Cardiff having a job attracting growth. Both airports are difficult to reach from the main lines of communication not being on or even near the motorways and with no dual highways to the M5 or M4. Neither airport has rail connection although of the two, Cardiff has a station at Rhoose with a 2 mile shuttle bus taking passengers to the terminal building along an uncongested road. (The shuttle buses on the longer journey from Bristol Airport to Temple Meads use congested roads but at least TM is a mainline station). Transport for Wales have been dragging their feet in getting a half hourly train service operating on the Vale of Glamorgan Coast line via Rhoose which connects with the mainline at Cardiff Central and at Bridgend for west Wales.

As pure speculation, if you were a planner, where would you build a new airport to serve SW Britain today that was near the main population centres of Cardiff, Newport & Bristol with good links by rail and road to the wider region? I will kick things off by suggesting the flatland near Pilning station which would be re-configured into an airport station. You have excellent motorway links nearby and most aircraft noise would be over industrial areas alongside the Severn at Avonmouth.

Google Map of the area.

I agree with your plan to build near Pilning in part, although I suggest building a pair of parallel runways with a long single terminal in between (image attached below), and a relocated Pilning station at the base of the terminal. Dual carriageway link from the M49 Avonmouth junction due to be connected through the airport to J21 of the M4/M48, with an emergency and bus/cyclist/pedestrian access to the dual carriageway from the B4055.

I'd then close Bristol (Lulsgate Bottom) Airport, build an eco town on it to help relieve Bristol's housing crisis, and replace Cardiff with Swansea Airport (same eco-town treatment for Cardiff Airport's site).

Give Swansea Airport a runway extension and connect it to a Swansea bay tramway/light rail scheme. Upgrade road links from Swansea Airport into Swansea proper, and to/from the M4.

 

[A0]

36% arrive at Gatwick by car. Which isn't the vast majority

It's a pain to get to by car or public transport, it could be much better. The Pilning idea above has some merit

Bit in bold - but does that figure include the people who use off-site parking who are bussed in for the "final mile" ?

 

[Bald Rick]

The very definition of moving the mountain to Mohammed!

(Spend £10bn building a new airport, or spend half a billion on a decent rail link to Bristol Airport)

 

[Tom125]

I’d expand Heathrow and build a high speed rail connection from Reading to serve Wales and the West. A high speed rail bridge over the Severn too to close the Victorian tunnels.

Alternatively an airport between Newport and Bristol , either side of the Severn bridge but probably the Welsh side as it’s flatter! with M4/ M5 access to serve Cardiff, Newport, Gloucester and Bristol. Close Bristol and Cardiff airports then.

 

[Western Lord]

Hang on a minute!
BRISTOL Filton once had the longest airport runway in the whole U.K

The runway at Filton was around 8,000 feet long and was never the longest in the UK. The crash airfields built during World War 2 at Manston, Woodbridge and Carnaby each had 9,000 foot long runways and there were two WW2 heavy bomber airfields built in Norfolk at Sculthorpe and Marham which also had 9,000 foot runways.

 

[Envoy]

I’d expand Heathrow and build a high speed rail connection from Reading to serve Wales and the West. A high speed rail bridge over the Severn too to close the Victorian tunnels.

Alternatively an airport between Newport and Bristol , either side of the Severn bridge but probably the Welsh side as it’s flatter! with M4/ M5 access to serve Cardiff, Newport, Gloucester and Bristol. Close Bristol and Cardiff airports then.

You are never going to get the cheapskate airlines such as Ryan Air, easyJet, TUI and Jet2 to use Heathrow because the landing charges are too high. You also have the problem of people out west having to pay the additional cost of getting to Heathrow plus the risk of something going wrong on the journey which means they have to pay for an overnight Heathrow hotel prior to flying. It would also make the people from Devon, Cornwall, Carmarthenshire, Pembrokeshire travel even further than already have to in order to reach the present Cardiff & Bristol Airports.

Many people drive to the airports and the M4 certainly does not need more people crossing southern England in order to fly from Heathrow or Gatwick for that matter. All well and good for long haul to places such as S America and the far east but for Europe and N America, I am thinking that a new decent airport between Bristol & Cardiff could have similar flights to that of Manchester.

Note that British Airways maintain their fleets at Cardiff Airport so that can’t be just shutdown and the land sold off. (A fat lot of use BA have been in actually providing any services from Cardiff. Years ago, they took over the Welsh Airline called Cambrian. They then changed the livery of the planes and just wrote ‘Cambrian’ in small print on the side. Next thing was they ceased operation at Cardiff Airport. Fact was they were after the planes so they could use them elsewhere).

Also note that it was foreign based airlines that did run long haul flights from Cardiff Airport. Canadian Airlines Air Transit & Zoom used to fly non stop from Cardiff to Toronto and more recently Qatar (pre Covid) had flights to Doha where people could change for Australia & the far east. Bristol has never had long haul airlines apart from some TUI flights for Caribbean cruises - which also go from Cardiff on rare occasions.

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[SirDanielGooch]

Expand Exeter Airport, with a Luton style people mover to Cranbook station. Remodel and expand cranbook station and rename to Exeter Airport Parkway. Redouble the line from Salisbury to Exeter and run extra services so it’s 3 tph between Exeter St David’s and Salisbury/Southampton.

Unfortunately, can’t see any of this happening and Bristol will continue to be the SW airport of choice with no rail link possible.

 

[SynthD]

Unfortunately, can’t see any of this happening and Bristol will continue to be the SW airport of choice with no rail link possible.

In the three miles from the GWR line near Nailsea to the airport, the ground rises from 30m to 180m. It needs a funicular.

 

[AlastairFraser]

The very definition of moving the mountain to Mohammed!

(Spend £10bn building a new airport, or spend half a billion on a decent rail link to Bristol Airport)

Issue is that there is limited scope for runway extension at Bristol Airport too. I don't think it is particularly realistic to build an airport at Pilning, but the idea was to create the best airport possible for the SW + South Wales.

 

[A S Leib]

Are you counting Dorset in South West Britain, or would Bournemouth and Southampton stay the main airports for there?

 

[Bald Rick]

In the three miles from the GWR line near Nailsea to the airport, the ground rises from 30m to 180m. It needs a funicular.

Or a transit link. See Luton. Easily able to do an average 3% gradient.

 

[stuu]

Bit in bold - but does that figure include the people who use off-site parking who are bussed in for the "final mile" ?

Yes