Who designed the Intercity 125 prototype (Class 41) front end?

[Commoner]

I think you will find that Sir Kenneth Grange was actively involved in shaping the exterior and interior of the prototype HST cab. Attached is a letter from James Cousins, BR's Director of Industrial Design, which initiates KG's involvement with the Design Panel, BR's CMEE and the subsequent work undertaken between his (KG's) team at Pentagram and the Traction Design Office at Derby. .

 

[hexagon789]

Oddly enough, I think that if you squint at it long enough, it begins to look like a late-60s evolution of a blue pullman - similar shape, but more rounded. I would say it was an evolution of it, but the Blue Pullman was a Metro-Cammel train and thus not something that Derby would have been playing with (I'm assuming).

I can see where you're coming from, but the Blue Pullman was a far more elegant design I feel.

 

[GusB]

I think you will find that Sir Kenneth Grange was actively involved in shaping the exterior and interior of the prototype HST cab. Attached is a letter from James Cousins, BR's Director of Industrial Design, which initiates KG's involvement with the Design Panel, BR's CMEE and the subsequent work undertaken between his (KG's) team at Pentagram and the Traction Design Office at Derby.View attachment 47043 .

For the benefit of those who may not be able to read the text shown in the image, I've transcribed it here (any errors will likely be mine):

CLASS 41 LOCOMOTIVE

At the recent Design Panel meeting attended by Mr Calder, it was agreed by the panel that the services of a design consultant should be made available to co-operate with your staff on the finished appearance design as is now developing.

I am sure that you would agree this can be a natural extension of the work already in hand on the ergonomics side and the preliminary discussons and models prepared with Mr Hill of my department.

The design consultant I have in mind is Kenneth Grance, RDI, FSIA, a Royal Designer for Industry, who is retained as an industrial design consultant by a number of important companies at home and abroad including Japan.

In order to progress the wishes of the Design Panel in this respect, I would be glad if an early meeting might be arranged between your staff and Mr Grange to investigate how his services might be immediately useful.

As a result of this discussion I would then be in a position to assess his likely fee which should be met from Design Panel budget resources, but will, I assume, be a charge on the Railways Business.

 

[edwin_m]

A painted version of the close up of the nose of that model

That is identical or at least very close to the version bolted onto the class 86 in the previous link. So I think we have a definitive sequence of events:

• BR designs this bulbous front end (actually reminds me of the streamlined Stanier Pacifics if someone had put a letterbox in the end - was this designer a LMS man?)
• SKG asked to develop a livery but ends up re-designing it to be more aerodynamic (and incidentally a bit closer to the Gresley front end...), resulting in the Class 41 prototype
• Oddly enough, no mention of him having had any input to the prototype livery.
• In response to union criticisms about lack of second driver seat and lack of side windows (that wasn't mentioned on the programme), SKG further re-designed the end to come up with the Class 43 production version.

 

[43096]

I doubt he has dementia, but my memory says he did not design the initial Class 41 nose. I do not question that his Class 43 nose and livery was far superior and lead to the success it had.

All the evidence, including documents and the memories of those there, says otherwise.

You are frankly looking utterly stupid by persisting with this line.