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Why are the Post Offices that are located inside W H Smith branches so poorly run?

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py_megapixel

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I'm not really sure the Post Office being a separate entity from Royal Mail is a particularly good idea. To the general public, they are intrinsically linked, and given PO exists mostly to sell Royal Mail services it's illogical, especially when you end up with things like fees to collect parcels from POs when having them redelivered is free!
 
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Peter Mugridge

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Have you seen the total hassle they've turned sending any Recorded Delivery, Special Delivery or tracked parcels into over the past few months?

Previously you could prepare the item at home normally, put a Recorded or Special Delivery bar code sticker on it ( if you had a stock to hand ), take it in and pay the postage.

Now... you have to bring the letter in with just the address on it and they'll spend ten minutes or more logging every single detail down on a computer terminal, which then prints a sticky label bigger than some of the smaller envelopes are and this label is expected to be stuck to the front of the envelope - it more often than not ends up getting folded onto the back or even doing a complete circumnavigation of the envelope. If you have two or more SDs to send, it's that whole time consuming process for each separate item...

All this does is frustrate the staff and waste everyone's time; in the case of those branches within WHS where the staff may be doing both postal and shop duties, it's going to be impacting on the shop duties as well.
 

Andrew S

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The one in Woolwich is pretty good and has a lovely manager who often queue-busts and shows customers how to use self service machines. Can’t complain.

I'm not especially impressed with that one. An untidy shop front area to navigate, queue stretching up narrow aisles, one counter position open out of many which appear semi-permanently disused. If you use the self service machine to pay for postage of a parcel you then have to throw the parcel onto a random heap in a corner. It could be so much better.
 

PeterY

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I've always wondered why the PO counters in WH Smiths are as far away as possible from the main entrance and upstairs (Hemel Hempstead branch) as possible. Again 6 counters and only 1 in use.
 

Busaholic

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Many sub Post Offices in my area have gone, quite a few because of the grotesque actions taken by Post Office management who refused to accept that the wonderful computer system they had introduced at great cost had huge flaws, instead preferring to believe that so many sub-postmasters were either totally incompetent or out and out fraudsters, usually the latter. It is scandalous that no P.O. top management were dismissed for their actions, with loss of pension rights. In many countries some would have faced criminal prosecution and jail, just like those Sub-Postmasters.

Now we have a P.O. in WHS that, in theory at least, is not able to be reached by car, or have P.O., Royal Mail or Parcelforce vans reach it, for most of the working day because of spurious 'climate change' prohibition of vehicles anywhere in the area. These restrictions are ignored by many, so you still get the diesel fumes etc, but if you parked, even with a disabled badge, you could get pounced upon for a £50 fine.
 

py_megapixel

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Now we have a P.O. in WHS that, in theory at least, is not able to be reached by car, or have P.O., Royal Mail or Parcelforce vans reach it, for most of the working day because of spurious 'climate change' prohibition of vehicles anywhere in the area. These restrictions are ignored by many, so you still get the diesel fumes etc, but if you parked, even with a disabled badge, you could get pounced upon for a £50 fine.
This bit of the post seems more like a moan about pedestrianisation than post offices!
 

Busaholic

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This bit of the post seems more like a moan about pedestrianisation than post offices!
When our thriving Post Office ( the most profitable in Cornwall on the P.O.'s own figures, until they factored in the empty flats above it which they refused to let 'for security reasons') was transferred to WHSmith an assurance was given by the local council that parking would be set aside for P.O. access, only for the same council to introduce the measures. By the way, there is no pedestrianisation because buses and taxis continue to use the road, as do many cars, which face no sanction unless they park! I walk with difficulty on a stick, and much prefer to walk in the road, especially when raining, but can't reliably do so.
 

yorksrob

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The Royal Mail is a private company.

A bottom of the barrel privatisation that pretty much no one (outside of Westminster) wanted, but such was the confidence of the Thatcherite establishment, they privatised it anyway. BTW I'm aware that the privatisation came under "new labour", so don't bother pointing it out
 

James H

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Royal Mail is private. The Post Office network is state owned, albeit with a very small rump of ‘crown’ post offices remaining.
 

Dai Corner

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The Royal Mail is a private company.

A bottom of the barrel privatisation that pretty much no one (outside of Westminster) wanted, but such was the confidence of the Thatcherite establishment, they privatised it anyway. BTW I'm aware that the privatisation came under "new labour", so don't bother pointing it out
Point of order. The Postal Services Act 2011 which enabled privatisation was passed by the coalition Government nearly twenty years after Mrs Thatcher left office. The driver was an EU Directive and the business secretary at the time was Lib Dem Vince Cable who I don't think would identify as a Thatcherite.

== Doublepost prevention - post automatically merged: ==

Back close to topic:

Here in Newport the central Post Office has ended up not in WH Smith but in a Londis convenience store.

Previously it had its own magnificent Edwardian building near the station, a nondescript building with a nightclub upstairs and a unit in a shopping centre.

The last time I was a Post Office was several years ago to renew either my driving licence or passport. Coincidentally, it was located in a different newsagent shop; McColls. As far as I remember it seemed well run and my more-complex-than-average transaction was handled efficiently.
 
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DelayRepay

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I've always wondered why the PO counters in WH Smiths are as far away as possible from the main entrance and upstairs (Hemel Hempstead branch) as possible.
Because that way you have to walk past all their treasures and delights, and may be tempted to buy something in the store.

Let's be honest, who hasn't been tempted by one of their special offers? Usually a chocolate orange which is twice the price it would be in any other shop.
 

Typhoon

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Because that way you have to walk past all their treasures and delights, and may be tempted to buy something in the store.

Let's be honest, who hasn't been tempted by one of their special offers? Usually a chocolate orange which is twice the price it would be in any other shop.
... and probably pretty close to the sell my date.

The Canterbury PO is upstairs and at the back in a Smith's, there is a lift but I'd be interested in what arrangements are made if the lift breaks down. Fortunately, for me, the aisles were both customer and assistant free so it was easy to reach the long queue; the mandatory one member of staff, looked like she'd just come out of school, very apologetic but (as I said to her) that wasn't her fault, she seemed efficient enough. There was a second counter open - the travel bureau. Saw one person while I was there. Clearly management has got its priorities right!

Nearest main post office to me is in a Co-op, you can reach the counters without entering the supermarket, three staff on when I went in, didn't have to wait long. I didn't get service with a smile, but I was asked whether I wanted a receipt, which I had forgotten to request. Some organisations can make a good fist of it, but Smith's by and large can't. Post Office Counters need to look at quality not just cash, they have a monopoly on many of the services they offer, but they also offer banking, insurance, even lottery; surely they would want people to get a good impression of the Post Office so they might sign up for these, from Smith's it is more 'if they can't do the day job right ...'
 

yorksrob

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Point of order. The Postal Services Act 2011 which enabled privatisation was passed by the coalition Government nearly twenty years after Mrs Thatcher left office. The driver was an EU Directive and the business secretary at the time was Lib Dem Vince Cable who I don't think would identify as a Thatcherite.

== Doublepost prevention - post automatically merged: ==

Back close to topic:

Here in Newport the central Post Office has ended up not in WH Smith but in a Londis convenience store.

Previously it had its own magnificent Edwardian building near the station, a nondescript building with a nightclub upstairs and a unit in a shopping centre.

The last time I was a Post Office was several years ago to renew either my driving licence or passport. Coincidentally, it was located in a different newsagent shop; McColls. As far as I remember it seemed well run and my more-complex-than-average transaction was handled efficiently.

My apologies. I was under the impression that it came under Labour, but it was a while ago.

In terms of identifying as Thatcherite, actions (in terms of unwanted privatisations) speak louder than words.

Looking at the other side of the equation, I can remember in the 90's WHSmith used to be a really good shop.
 

Djgr

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The worst contemporary Post Office that I have come across was at the back of a Subway!
 

Djgr

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In Hulme, just south of Manchester, there is the opposite arrangement - a PO with a Subway in the back!
Ha Same place! My memory is that they are side by side in one room. Seriously weird!
 

Iskra

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I just find the Post Office terrible in general. Went to my local today to find it closed, it just seems to open when they like. Drove 3 miles to the next one to find they don’t stock the Euro’s I was looking to buy. I then gave up and went to Meadowhall for them instead.
 

al78

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In Horsham they closed down the town centre post office (with eight windows) and moved the facilities to WH Smith (with 3 windows). Given the original post office was never fully staffed when I used it (because this is the UK), I didn't think it would be much different until I tried to use it in December 2019. There was only one window open and the queue stretched the full length of WH Smith with an hour and a half waiting time. The poor public facing staff were getting tons of aggro from customers and were very stressed, they were doing their best but it was an impossible situation for them. I asked one them (politely and with empathy) why the shortage of counter staff and they said it was a management decision. I am grateful that I very rarely need to use it, but it is the classic example of snip snip cost cut dump the consequences on everyone else.
 

C J Snarzell

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Nothing beats WH Smiths for luke warm juice and half-melted chocolate bars.

They always put 'whoopsy' labels on their chocolate in WHSmiths but when you compare the prices, the same bar of Daily Milk or Galaxy is actually cheaper in Home Bargains or B&M's.

CJ
 

D6130

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The worst contemporary Post Office that I have come across was at the back of a Subway!
Is that by any chance the one in Skipton? It was awful having to queue opposite the food counter, with the smell and smoke from sizzling burgers and sausages gradually permeating your skin, hair and clothing....especially for vegetarians and vegans. When we moved to the much smaller town of Hebden Bridge nearly nine years ago, we were delighted to find a friendly and efficient Crown post office in a nice early-1930s 'Arts & Crafts'-style building and I'm pleased to say that it's still going strong.
 

Butts

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How many Crown Post Offices (or proper ones) are left ?

Is there still a 24 Hour One in London somewhere ? - I'm sure there used to be.
 

Mcr Warrior

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Is there still a 24 Hour One in London somewhere ? - I'm sure there used to be.
Believe it might once have been the one at Trafalgar Square, but understand it's now permanently closed.
 

gswindale

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Can't remember the last time I used a "proper" Post Office, but think it might have been over 10 years ago when I needed to renew my photo card driving license.

Used the counter inside our local newsagents just before Christmas (needed to send a gift that could no longer be delivered in person due to Lockdown).

Other than that, anything I've needed to post has either been straight in the post box or paid the 30p for them to collect from the door.
 

RuralRambler

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Baffled how they're still in business when other places have gone to the wall. Genuinely a terrible shopping experience. Is it something simple like owning (rather than renting) their shops so running costs are relatively low?
Yes, they do own a pretty high proportion of their premises rather than renting, so they're not suffering with having to pay stupidly high rents. But there are other factors. One is the "terrible shopping experience" which keeps their costs low due to low staffing numbers, run down stores, etc - they can survive on lower sales volumes if their overheads are lower. They also have a long term "managed decline" business plan where a few loss making shops are closed each year - that's the opposite to the likes of Woolworths who tried to keep all their stores open meaning the loss making ones sucked the profits from the profitable ones. They know newspapers and magazines are in long term decline and that almost certainly the High St WHS shops won't exist in, say, 15 years, so they're not bothering with updating stores etc, just letting them decline in line with the declining market and close as and when they're loss making.

People say that it's the station/service station/airport stores that are subsidising their High St stores, but WHS say otherwise, that they are separate divisions and that the High Street division is still profitable on it's own, and not being directly subsidised by the station/airport stores, which is interesting and surprising really. But even if not directly subsidising, the High St stores will be benefitting from the economies of scale, purchasing power, etc arising from the high footfall premium location stores.
 

duncombec

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People say that it's the station/service station/airport stores that are subsidising their High St stores, but WHS say otherwise, that they are separate divisions and that the High Street division is still profitable on it's own, and not being directly subsidised by the station/airport stores, which is interesting and surprising really. But even if not directly subsidising, the High St stores will be benefitting from the economies of scale, purchasing power, etc arising from the high footfall premium location stores.
When I worked for them 15 years ago (as a student), it was made very clear to us that High Street and 'Elsewhere' are two separate divisions trading under the same brand. Terms and Conditions were different, pay was different, and even on a more basic level, airport store staff discount cards weren't valid in High Street stores, nor was my High Street one valid at airports.
 

TravelDream

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I think you are just talking about WHSmith's in general.

Their stores all look pretty run-down, tatty and a bit of a jumble sale.
The one on Cardiff Queen Street has had the same damaged books up for sale for the last decade. Some of them so damaged, they should just be binned. It's amazing to go through the store looking at the thick layer of dust on some of the items upstairs. Oh and the carpets. Well, they have their own Twitter profile.
The other thing is the complete lack of people in the store. I mean both staff and customers. It sometimes feels like you've entered when it's closed.

I think the Post Office thing is simply to make enough money for the company to survive. The travel division (train stations and airports) made money hand over fist (*well, not quite as others take a big cut, but still a very good margin) before Covid. The high street stores are dying and have been for a long time.


On the Post Office, my town's PO is still in its own standalone shop. Nowhere near as grand as the old one which is now a bar, but still on its own. It seems no different to your WHS example. About five counters, but never more than one open. Grubby and run-down with hand-made signs sellotaped onto the wall. It does still have a photo machine though.
 
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