Why is the Age of steam engines so beloved by transport enthusiasts?

[TBirdFrank]

Times are better - on what railway please?? Pacers - I know they were BR built - but they are still here thirty years later, all but no overnight trains, slavish routing to comply with franchising - God forbid you want to do a true cross country journey - and if you do it will likely be in a two car set! No restaurant cars. Blockades for maintenance and Sod the passenger. Faster trains means its necessary to cut out stops - now have you ever heard of Gun - foot - bang?? Franchise costing too much - hand it back to the taxpayer, quick!

And yes - I was there for the end of steam - thank goodness! Camaraderie, a time when the railway was the province of most lads - not a playground for blinkered obsessives who can't look outside themselves.

And of course the railway had a second coming in the fifties and sixties - changeover years - modernisation, electrification, acceleration, and was still an industry that connected freight, ferries, hotels and passengers, unlike today's poor broken backed activity.

 

[fowler9]

Not being facetious here, but many members may never have experienced trolleybus operation; just pointing out that these didn't stop in the middle of the road.

Indeed. Ha ha. Despite having been to other places with trolleybuses the only ones I have been on were in Wellington New Zealand and Valparaiso in Chile. I loved them, then ones in Wellington were surprisingly modern, the ones in Chile wonderfully vintage.

 

[341o2]

Not being facetious here, but many members may never have experienced trolleybus operation; just pointing out that these didn't stop in the middle of the road.

Indeed, the stock photograph of the trolleybus would be it passing another vehicle in its path. Promoters of the trolleybus pointed out how the tram was restricted to its tracks, but the trolleybus was so much more modern and flexible

Sorry to read that trams in Gent have been reduced, have memories of a difficult and stormy channel crossing in the 80's to see the expansion of the system and a new trolleybus operation open - since the closure of Liege Belgium had had no trolleybuses

Route 44 Brussels remains one of my all time favourites

 

[Busaholic]

Indeed. Ha ha. Despite having been to other places with trolleybuses the only ones I have been on were in Wellington New Zealand and Valparaiso in Chile. I loved them, then ones in Wellington were surprisingly modern, the ones in Chile wonderfully vintage.

You rightly say 'were' in relation to Wellington: more I shall never travel on! My first single deck trolleybus experience was on a school trip to Rome in 1964, where route 64 passed our hotel: I've a feeling it was that magnificent city's only trolleybus route by then. I was also very surprised to find a suburban short trolley route in Copenhagen in 1969, which complemented the remaining tram route, the 6 iirc.

 

[fowler9]

You rightly say 'were' in relation to Wellington: more I shall never travel on! My first single deck trolleybus experience was on a school trip to Rome in 1964, where route 64 passed our hotel: I've a feeling it was that magnificent city's only trolleybus route by then. I was also very surprised to find a suburban short trolley route in Copenhagen in 1969, which complemented the remaining tram route, the 6 iirc.

Have they got rid of the ones in Wellington?

 

[Busaholic]

Have they got rid of the ones in Wellington?

A few weeks ago, I believe.

 

[fowler9]

A few weeks ago, I believe.

Blimey that is a shame, they seemed pretty new to me. We got a few from the city centre to our hostel and also out to the Weta Cave in Miami near Wellington Airport (Where Peter Jacksons special effects place is).

 

[341o2]

31 October 2017 according to Wikipedia

 

[albert batten]

Yes - working with steam was dirty and unpleasant.
Yes - trains are more frequent on some routes (although sometimes with fewer seats per hour).
Yes - many modern trains give faster journeys than steam. But not always - although that is often due to insertion of additional stops, or route modifications (e.g. following the closures of Manchester Central, Liverpool Central High Level, etc.)
But the OP was asking why people liked steam, not whether they wanted to work on it
.

If you have ever been stopped at the foot of Dainton bank behind a Collett Castle class and then the driver has opened up to go it alone without assistance then you will know why you like steam. Will never forget that "bark" followed by the tremendous roar from the chimney as the engine got hold of its train. Absolute magic.

 

[chorleyjeff]

The steam age railways were more down to earth than what we have now. Village and small town stations for instance were very much part of the community, with locally employed staff.

Rail travel was exciting in the steam age and a lot more emphasis placed on comfort even in 3rd class you at least were certain to get a seat next to a window unlike now, some trains had compartments.
.

In 6 a side compartments 4 out of 12 had a window seat. In 3 a side compartments 2 out of 6 had a window seat and 2 had a corridor view. Open window meants grit and soot in the compartment and if you forgot to close the window before water troughs you got wet.

 

[chorleyjeff]

It's interesting regarding the age of steam. I would have loved to have had the option of all the branchlines to use, and Ioved the rolling stock (because thankfully most of it was still around where I lived into the noughties). But truthfully, I wouldn't have wanted to live in that era in other respects. From what my parents say, it sounds like a limited world in terms of social expectations, with limited horizons which I would have had difficulty fitting into (even though I have a lot of respect for my parents and grandparents generation who fought for, and rebuilt the country).

Of course, we should remember that that was the start of the era of free tertiary education, so in some ways, horizons weren't as limited as now.

Free tertiary education for only a few as I remember. You either had to go through a series of culls ( 11plus, O levels, Latin O level etc etc ) or. be well connected and born in the right bed.

 

[chorleyjeff]

If you have ever been stopped at the foot of Dainton bank behind a Collett Castle class and then the driver has opened up to go it alone without assistance then you will know why you like steam. Will never forget that "bark" followed by the tremendous roar from the chimney as the engine got hold of its train. Absolute magic.

Indeed yes. Similar was the drama of a London express leaving Lime Street into the tunnels. But then getting home 25 miles away by a roundabout route and changing twice ie to Preston changing at Wigan and Chorley. Direct trains from Exchange were few during the day. Nowadays one an hour through the day plus additional at peak times, plus the option of slightly less frequent by changing at Ormskirk. Also when I worked in Blackpool and lived in Preston the trains were difficult to use and on Saturday impossible - had to get a bus from town centre at 7.00 to get to work at 8.30.

 

[yorksrob]

Free tertiary education for only a few as I remember. You either had to go through a series of culls ( 11plus, O levels, Latin O level etc etc ) or. be well connected and born in the right bed.

No need for Latin in my day.

If you could scrape together three A-levels, you were in somewhere.

 

[chorleyjeff]

No need for Latin in my day.

If you could scrape together three A-levels, you were in somewhere.

Seems the rot had set by then My three good A levels but without Latin for arts subjects or French for everything else showed I was not of the right calibre to benefit from Uni. I suppose I could have got in a Poly. I did professional exams in my own time by correspondence course after fulldays work - not a route I enjoyed.
My neice got in Uni without any prequalification ( didn't get past first year of BTEC twice). Now got a degree in Business Studies and works in a cafe with no ambition to do more. But she had three jolly years and will not pay back a penny of her student loans. Does not seem to be much benefit to the country for the money spent.

 

[Flying Phil]

Ah the French "O" level.....I took it three times - and failed! but then found that I did not need it for some Universities so Bradford had me for four years on a "thin" sandwich course. I am sure there were some industrial steam engines still in use in 1969 up there for my first year.

 

[chorleyjeff]

Ah the French "O" level.....I took it three times - and failed! but then found that I did not need it for some Universities so Bradford had me for four years on a "thin" sandwich course. I am sure there were some industrial steam engines still in use in 1969 up there for my first year.

One chance only in my day at t'grammar. Didn't matter ifyou were ill or granny died the day before - one chance only. Part of the rutheless cull.

 

[yorksrob]

Seems the rot had set by then My three good A levels but without Latin for arts subjects or French for everything else showed I was not of the right calibre to benefit from Uni. I suppose I could have got in a Poly. I did professional exams in my own time by correspondence course after fulldays work - not a route I enjoyed.
My neice got in Uni without any prequalification ( didn't get past first year of BTEC twice). Now got a degree in Business Studies and works in a cafe with no ambition to do more. But she had three jolly years and will not pay back a penny of her student loans. Does not seem to be much benefit to the country for the money spent.

I think three good A levels in arts/modern language subjects would be a perfectly good indication that someone might benefit from tertiary education. The idea that someone proficient in a dead language would somehow be more deserving is pure snobbery belonging in a byegone era.

 

[ChiefPlanner]

Off topic - but failing the 11 plus was not a death sentence educationally , my brother failed by a few marks , but was promoted from the (excellent) Technical School to the Grammar School in less than 6 months. Transfers the other way happened also for those who did not like the more formal stance to a more vocational one. This was in SW Wales - an area where until the destruction of the system in the late 1960's was pretty fluid. (Matters have since considerably improved after the badly planned implementation that I was caught up in)

 

[30907]

Latin O level ceased to be a qualification (even) at Oxbridge in 1960.

 

[Flying Phil]

One chance only in my day at t'grammar. Didn't matter ifyou were ill or granny died the day before - one chance only. Part of the rutheless cull.

Well I was indeed fortunate that, at my Grammar, we were allowed resits in the sixth form and the expansion of the former "Colleges of Advanced Technology" to University status meant that I crept into the new "University of Bradford" with my three poor A levels ....and there I was allowed resits of odd subjects each year until I passed my degree (just!). It was part of the increasing opportunities in the late 60's ...or was that the same as the relaxing of standards?
Talking of "Standards" it is interesting how the "Standards" of BR steam seem to be much more appreciated in preservation than they were in the 60's.

 

[HowardGWR]

^^^Ah, back on topic. Yes I've noticed that. In the 50s we considered them to be very ugly beasts, so I assume that, like fashion, they are now more in vogue. The high running board does emphasis the works, and that feature is supposed to give the steam engine its allure.
Not for me though, as you can see on the left.

 

[neilmc]

Ah the French "O" level.....I took it three times - and failed! but then found that I did not need it for some Universities so Bradford had me for four years on a "thin" sandwich course. I am sure there were some industrial steam engines still in use in 1969 up there for my first year.

I remember going to Esholt Sewage Works in Bradford around that time and watching their two steam locos shuttle around with piles of steaming "freight"! Wouldn't have endured that for any diesel!

 

[Flying Phil]

I remember going to Esholt Sewage Works in Bradford around that time and watching their two steam locos shuttle around with piles of steaming "freight"! Wouldn't have endured that for any diesel!

They had other things going around Esholt as it was used for a "Special Stage" for the RAC Rally in 1972 or 3! So Twin Cam Escorts, Cooper "S"s and Opel 400's etc...(Sorry OT again....)

 

[gaymale]

The sheer variety and quantity of steam locos even into the 1960's when I started train spotting makes the relatively few classes of diesels and electrics, especially those now in service, rather sad by comparison. It's only the variety of liveries since the 70's which has given some level of interest.

The experience of having so many steam sheds to visit - at all times of the day and night - in many parts of England and Wales was part of the attraction. Sadly never got into Scotland before Aug 68 or the IOW before the closures.

 

[Flying Phil]

^^^Ah, back on topic. Yes I've noticed that. In the 50s we considered them to be very ugly beasts, so I assume that, like fashion, they are now more in vogue. The high running board does emphasis the works, and that feature is supposed to give the steam engine its allure.
Not for me though, as you can see on the left.

I do enjoy seeing the "works" of steam engines when moving slowly, with the combined motion of the valve gear linkages comparing to the simplicity of the connecting rod. It is very different to the view of modern traction where only the wheels are in movement.
Having said that, of course, several classes of Victorian steam locomotives with inside cylinders, only showed moving wheels ( 4-2-2 Midland Spinners) or coupling rods (4-4-0/ 4-6-0 classes). The Stirling "Single" is a particular favorite of mine, with its elegant combination of curves and symmetry.

 

[krus_aragon]

I do enjoy seeing the "works" of steam engines when moving slowly, with the combined motion of the valve gear linkages comparing to the simplicity of the connecting rod. It is very different to the view of modern traction where only the wheels are in movement.
Having said that, of course, several classes of Victorian steam locomotives with inside cylinders, only showed moving wheels ( 4-2-2 Midland Spinners) or coupling rods (4-4-0/ 4-6-0 classes). The Stirling "Single" is a particular favorite of mine, with its elegant combination of curves and symmetry.

Yes, this. With a steam engine you can *see* things happening, moreso than on a diesel or electric engine.

In a similar vein, many of my childhood holidays involved flying on jet planes, where there's not much to see w.r.t. the engine: you can't even see the fan blades from the cabin. But the first time I flew on a turboprop plane (as an adult!) my nose was glued to the window for most of the short flight, because I could *see* the propellor spinning round!