hexagon789
Veteran Member
No worries, be interesting to see what the 16th entails when the time comes.I'm not prepared to share the finer details. Other than 16 diagrams are being planned for by Train Planning.
No worries, be interesting to see what the 16th entails when the time comes.I'm not prepared to share the finer details. Other than 16 diagrams are being planned for by Train Planning.
I think it's the vinyls that trap the dirt.One thing for certain the livery is horrible when dirty, do they ever go through a wash?
Possibly, but the new door recesses are the worst for this.I think it's the vinyls that trap the dirt.
Carriage washers not getting them because they aren't flush?Possibly, but the new door recesses are the worst for this.
There's one (or more) carriages where the vinyl on the has been ripped off leaving a large blue undercoat patch.I think it's the vinyls that trap the dirt.
It's both, but it's the colour temperature that's most offensive.
The coaches can be switched between full/half lighting as @hexagon789 says above. They often seem to be left on full (I've wondered what would happen if I flipped the switch myself) but even on half, the light is still fairly horrible.
You can also see the difference between some of the refurbed vestibule areas vs. the seating areas. I think I took this photo from next to the area with the accessible toilet, which seems to have been fitted with more sensible lighting than that retained in the seating area. You can see here the stark difference in colour temperature, between the area near the camera, and the area beyond, by looking at the colour the white wall panels appear.
View attachment 155203
(By the way, is it the 1st class coaches that have different lighting, or is it the extra carriages they've added to make 5-car rakes?)
Still 2030, likely later.I'm just wondering what the point of repairing the tree damaged power car, or reactivating the Slateford sets. Aslef's Scottish organiser has stated that the union and ScotRail are working towards retiring the HSTs in 2025, so it seems like more good money after bad. The same as fitting WSP, for one or two leaf fall seasons at best?
Are ScotRail contracted to keep them until 2030?Still 2030, likely later.
I believe so but ASLEF still want rid by next year.Are ScotRail contracted to keep them until 2030?
Yes. For the umpteenth time, they are covered by a Section 54 agreement until 2030.Are ScotRail contracted to keep them until 2030?
Yes, December 2030. The working group is presently looking at replacement with a new ordered or cascaded fleet by or around that point in agreement with ASLEF, the RMT, Transport Scotland and the other represented groups.Are ScotRail contracted to keep them until 2030?
Yes, December 2030. The working group is presently looking at replacement with a new ordered or cascaded fleet by or around that point in agreement with ASLEF, the RMT, Transport Scotland and the other represented groups.
I'm sure the owner would like their assets in full working order.
Are ScotRail contracted to keep them until 2030?
The HST fleet is leased until December 2030. A business case is currently being developed by the rail industry to recommend how the fleet should best be replaced when it is life expired.
Surely to goodness by 2030 the entire line from Glasgow to Inverness via Aberdeen could have the knitting up?
Three fleets have been discussed/explored to my knowledge.If this is the case, do you know what the "interim intercity fleet" which ScotRail refer to in their board minutes refers to?
I can't imagine that a replacement fleet 6 years in the future would be described as "interim".
Discussed on this thread, or within Scotrail? Is it realistic to think that they could replace the HST's with cascaded 222's bearing in mind the costs of cancelling the HST lease, cost of leasing the 222's, the costs of investing in staff training and equiping depots / stabling points with the facilities to maintain and service these? And does anyone believe fleet reliability would be perfect from day one?Three fleets have been discussed/explored to my knowledge.
By the steering group consisting of ScotRail, Transport Scotland, ASLEF, the RMT etc formed to discuss the HST operations and replacement.Discussed on this thread, or within Scotrail?
I'm surprised the board agreed to return long-term out of service power cars to service, including heavy overhaul.Indications are something is lined up for 2025,quite what that something is no one is really saying.
I'm surprised the board agreed to return long-term out of service power cars to service, including heavy overhaul.
Fund improved WSP.
Fund deep cleaning for the buffet counters.
Fund deep cleaning of the stored TSL vehicles.
If they are going next year.
I'd also be very interested to know what the fleet lined up is, given the 3 discussed were ruled out on grounds of availability, capacity, suitability and cost of lease. The latter for the 222s was in particular very high.
That was mentioned by someone that perhaps they have a value elsewhere.Ah, but maybe it's now realised a good price can be got for them in working order in Nigeria or Mexico.
I'm surprised the board agreed to return long-term out of service power cars to service, including heavy overhaul.
Fund improved WSP.
Fund deep cleaning for the buffet counters.
Fund deep cleaning of the stored TSL vehicles.
If they are going next year.
I'd also be very interested to know what the fleet lined up is, given the 3 discussed were ruled out on grounds of availability, capacity, suitability and cost of lease. The latter for the 222s was in particular very high.
Feel free to educate me, as I don't work in the rail industry. However I do have a reasonable grasp of business economics.I'd also be very interested to know what the fleet lined up is, given the 3 discussed were ruled out on grounds of availability, capacity, suitability and cost of lease. The latter for the 222s was in particular very high.
What am I missing?
Form a supplier point of view, the bold - because not neccesarily.Feel free to educate me, as I don't work in the rail industry. However I do have a reasonable grasp of business economics.
An asset is only "worth" what someone is prepared to pay for it, whether to buy or lease. And any asset sat idle is depreciating, i.e. costing money. Faced with a choice of a lower lease income or no income, surely the stock owner would prefer some income, unless they are acting to protect the lease prices of other assets. Even then though, if supply exceeds demand (at a given price) market forces should lower the price until a new equilibrium is reached.
From ScotRail's perspective, the running (mainly maintenance but also fuel) costs of 22x stock would almost certainly be lower than HST, and therefore command a higher lease price.
Whilst the HST lease runs until 2030, negotiating an early exit (in light of the evident export market) would be standard business practice.
What am I missing?
But it’s not is it! Still cancellations and short forms of 2 car 158s on IC services most days. Given the age of the fleet, it will never get to that stage, just not possible.Discussed on this thread, or within Scotrail? Is it realistic to think that they could replace the HST's with cascaded 222's bearing in mind the costs of cancelling the HST lease, cost of leasing the 222's, the costs of investing in staff training and equiping depots / stabling points with the facilities to maintain and service these? And does anyone believe fleet reliability would be perfect from day one?
Unless HST running costs and spars cost/ availability soar through the roof, it does not seem feasible. Better to think longer term. It's taken Scotrail 5 years to finally get the fleet running reliably.
How long will it take to procure a new fleet for 2030. There's only 6 years to go as it is. Building any new trains and introducing them is going to take time. The decisions on what to order need to be taken now.