New transport secretary

[jon0844]

How is what another user above is saying any more true then what I'm saying?

That makes no sense.

You say it's light outside. I say it's dark.

We look outside, it's dark.

What I am saying is true, what you are saying is not. End of.

It's as simple as that.

 

[the sniper]

Oh noes, looks like the grich has has been taken out of the equation by Thatcher's internet operatives...

When you get your land reward OT (can't be far off now! ), can you sort me out a dispatcher job at New Street please, or even better, bring back the second man role?

 

[Old Timer]

Oh noes, looks like the grich has has been taken out of the equation by Thatcher's internet operatives...

When you get your land reward OT (can't be far off now! ), can you sort me out a dispatcher job at New Street please, or even better, bring back the second man role?

But of course, Old Boy !

The Secondman's job.

Most important and something that should never have been done away with. Boil in the bag is not the answer, and has attracted some rather disreputable types who have failed in other career aspirations and would never have been allowed near the job in BR days.

As for a despatchers job, well, old chap, you shall be near the very top.

 

[the sniper]

The Secondman's job.

Most important and something that should never have been done away with. Boil in the bag is not the answer, and has attracted some rather disreputable types who have failed in other career aspirations and would never have been allowed near the job in BR days.

Being serious for a moment, I really wish the secondman role was still around today, it would have been perfect for someone like myself. I can fully see why it died out though.

I rather wish they'd bring it back as a voluntary role with a committed number of hours, much like how the Police have Special Constables. I don't know how the newer 'boil in the bag' recruited drivers would take to the scheme, but you'd have to think that older ex-BR drivers would be happy with it, seeing as most of them got in via the secondman's seat!

As for a despatchers job, well, old chap, you shall be near the very top.

Marvellous!

 

[Old Timer]

Being serious for a moment, I really wish the secondman role was still around today, it would have been perfect for someone like myself. I can fully see why it died out though.

The secondman role was a good method of training up drivers, as by the time the s/man was ready to go training he had a fair knowledge of the job, route knowledge, had proven himself able to handle the demands of shifts and irregular hours, and gained the respect of the qualified drivers.

A s/man who wouldn't make it was quickly identified and could be taken out of the system one way or another. In some cases they found the job did not suit them and moved on to work in a different post so that the grounding was not lost but could be put to good use elsewhere.

A similar situation occurred with signalbox lads, who in my days were in the majority of cases able to work the signalbox under supervision as capably as the resident man.

Many is the time I have worked the whole shift whilst the resident man read the paper and worked out the odds on the horses !

Those of course were the days when the sun shone in the Summer, and one could spend long balmy evenings drinking beer outside until closing time.

Remember we had double summer time then.

 

[Saltleyman]

When OT takes over the world he will do the following:-

11) Saltley depot to be re-opened


14) Professional driving to be as directed by former Saltley drivers

15) Removal of the requirement to use SC protocol when identifying train and signal via SPT....Dear God how many other people speak to a signalman in a different box from an SPT identified as SY or NS or RY or NN or SD4 ????

16) Proper line names to be reinstated, e. g. Down and Up Arley to become Birmingham, Down and Up Hinkley to become Leicester. Lines into Euston to be renamed Fasts, Slows, and Carriage. Those responsible to be sent to work for a local council (that will teach them !)

17) Proper Jct names to be reinstated, e. g. Kempston Road Jct NOT Bedford South ! Those responsible for renaming such places of long history to be excuted, slightly (but only just) quicker than SSI designers.

18 ) Signalmen to be made to learn the names of local places along the line...e.g. "This is OT calling from Lea Marston"...S/man "Where",...OT "Lea Marston".....Signalman "Where's that ?"

19) Proper Possession lengths implemented.

20) Punters to be told that the Railway does not respond to the "I want it and I want it now" culture. We are not here to run trains 24 hours per day on the off-chance that some ****ed up YUPPIE MIGHT want to travel at some God-forsaken hour of the night after some cocaine fuelled rave party.


Simples



Oh yes and Meercats to become fashionable.

[/FONT][FONT=&quot]

[/FONT][/QUOTE]

Sorry sir,cannot agree to your terms !

SALTLEY is only mentioned as items 11 and 14 !!!
Can't be right can it ?

 

[Old Timer]

...Sorry sir,cannot agree to your terms !

SALTLEY is only mentioned as items 11 and 14 !!!
Can't be right can it ?

Well, Old Chap, I had proceded on the assumption that Saltley having been the Premier Depot would stand out on its own merits. In addition I was worried that to much reference to it may result in it coming to the attention of some of the less desireable types we now find on the job. I am sure you will know the sort, they have failed at everything else and are attracted by the money. Somehow they manage to pass through the system and then sit in supercillious judgement over those of us who have actually lived the job. No doubt examples spring to mind, and we would never want such individuals trying to associate themselves with the likes of us now would we.

Obviously as well, in order to make the job better for our Saltley men, we would need to have a signalling system that worked efficiently and effectively and this would have to be a high priority. Cheapo nasty and tacky systems that dont allow a man to work his train hard have no place in OTs world.

In all other cases we would need to undertake some considerable route training for the Saltleymen as well, out and back working to Naples perhaps ?

I was considering some of the less pleasant jobs for Bescot.

So do rest assured that although only mentioned a couple of times, this reflects nothing but good upon a splendid depot, with a first class reputation, which would be crewed with some very splendid chaps indeed.


I trust you are keeping well ? Have you been France-hopping recently ?

 

[bluebottle]

Have you been France-hopping recently ?

I believe it to be just the way he's sitting.

 

[Metroland]

Meanwhile back to reality

• The Government believes that a modern transport infrastructure is essential for a dynamic and entrepreneurial economy, as well as to improve well-being and quality of life. We need to make the transport sector greener and more sustainable, with tougher emission standards and support for new transport technologies.

•We will mandate a national recharging network for electric and plug-in hybrid vehicles.

•We will grant longer rail franchises in order to give operators the incentive to invest in the improvements passengers want – like better services, better stations, longer trains and better rolling stock.

•We will reform the way decisions are made on which transport projects to prioritise, so that the benefits of low carbon proposals (including light rail schemes) are fully recognised.

•We will make Network Rail more accountable to its customers.

•We will establish a high speed rail network as part of our programme of measures to fulfil our joint ambitions for creating a low carbon economy. Our vision is of a truly national high speed rail network for the whole of Britain. Given financial constraints, we will have to achieve this in phases.

•We support Crossrail and further electrification of the rail network.

•We will turn the rail regulator into a powerful passenger champion

•We will support sustainable travel initiatives, including the promotion of cycling and walking, and will encourage joint working between bus operators and local authorities.

•We are committed to fair pricing for rail travel.

•We will work towards the introduction of a new system of HGV road user charging to ensure a fairer arrangement for UK hauliers.

•We will stop central government funding for new fixed speed cameras and switch to more effective ways of making our roads safer, including authorising ‘drugalyser’ technology.

•We will tackle rogue private sector wheel clampers.

http://www.direct.gov.uk/prod_consu.../@dg/@en/documents/digitalasset/dg_187876.pdf

 

[DaveNewcastle]

just been reading through their coalition-manifesto, thanks Metroland. Interesting stuff.
the main rail issues being

•We will grant longer rail franchises in order to give operators the incentive to invest in the improvements passengers want – like better services, better stations, longer trains and better rolling stock.

I think that's generally welcomed, tho the supposed benefits haven't been calculated.

•We will make Network Rail more accountable to its customers.

I guess that means to THEIR customers, the TOCs, which isn't always going to make them accountable to the best interest of the travellers.

•We will establish a high speed rail network as part of our programme of measures to fulfil our joint ambitions for creating a low carbon economy. Our vision is of a truly national high speed rail network for the whole of Britain. Given financial constraints, we will have to achieve this in phases.
•We support Crossrail and further electrification of the rail network.

I guess there's mixed views on whether this might still be a Crossrail with its edges trimmed off.

•We will turn the rail regulator into a powerful passenger champion.
•We are committed to fair pricing for rail travel.

Excellent pledges! So lets now see how it will work.

 

[455driver]

bring back the second man role?

Absolutely, somebody has to look after the bloody steam heat boiler (and drive when the driver cant be bothered )

 

[EM2]

No mention of Thameslink or IEP?

 

[WatcherZero]

Or rolling stock

Also sadly Adonis is going to the back benchs, Labour want the shadow transport minister to be in the commons so probably will be Sidiq Khan.

 

[Old Timer]

Or rolling stock.

Why should there be ??

Government's job is to manage the larger economic factors, not decide the type and use of rolling stock. We have already seen the results of DfT and Civil Service interference in the running of the Railways, and rolling stock allocation.

The whole point of Privatisation was to remove that link.

 

[Saltleyman]

Well, Old Chap, I had proceded on the assumption that Saltley having been the Premier Depot would stand out on its own merits. In addition I was worried that to much reference to it may result in it coming to the attention of some of the less desireable types we now find on the job. I am sure you will know the sort, they have failed at everything else and are attracted by the money. Somehow they manage to pass through the system and then sit in supercillious judgement over those of us who have actually lived the job. No doubt examples spring to mind, and we would never want such individuals trying to associate themselves with the likes of us now would we.

Obviously as well, in order to make the job better for our Saltley men, we would need to have a signalling system that worked efficiently and effectively and this would have to be a high priority. Cheapo nasty and tacky systems that dont allow a man to work his train hard have no place in OTs world.

In all other cases we would need to undertake some considerable route training for the Saltleymen as well, out and back working to Naples perhaps ?

I was considering some of the less pleasant jobs for Bescot.

So do rest assured that although only mentioned a couple of times, this reflects nothing but good upon a splendid depot, with a first class reputation, which would be crewed with some very splendid chaps indeed.


I trust you are keeping well ? Have you been France-hopping recently ?

Thank you sir for your usual detailed response,and I accept your reasoning for the demotion of Saltley to 11th and 14th places in your remit,however to mention that obnoxious place beginning with "B" in the same response is not to be tolerated !
As to my wandering through France,alas sadly this cannot happen this year,but there's always next year .

 

[WatcherZero]

The problem however is since Dft mandates what rolling stock can be run and whats suitable since it finances most of its daily operation. Longer franchises will cause some desire to invest in new rolling stock by the franchises but the ROSCO's wont unless they have Dft's guarentees on what they will fund in operation, what types to buy, and more importantly how many.

 

[Old Timer]

Thank you sir for your usual detailed response,and I accept your reasoning for the demotion of Saltley to 11th and 14th places in your remit,however to mention that obnoxious place beginning with "B" in the same response is not to be tolerated !
As to my wandering through France,alas sadly this cannot happen this year,but there's always next year .

My dear chap, I stand admonished.

I really should have stated that the place in question was some terrible, dank, dirty place whose name could not be mentioned in polite company.

In future I shall ensure that Saltley (as befits its position) is indeed at the top of the list.

One sincerely hopes that this will be treated as a minor error, and that one shall not be blackballed for this unforgivable mistake.

By way of mitigation may I plead distraction by a most delightfully pleasant (and blonde) lady stewardess, and bearing in mind OTs little "weakness" of which I know all are aware, one hopes that the massed ranks of Saltley men will be munificent and demonstrate the compassion for which they are famed towards one who has erred.

I place myself in your and Mr Saltleyman1043's hands as I go before the Court at Saltley

 

[Aictos]

She had to be blonde didn't she! Why did I know you were going to say that!!!

 

[Metroland]

Thought this was interesting and compares Tory and Labour

Last Spring, sharp-eyed journalists at the Independent on Sunday spotted in a technical magazine that New Labour are about to announce a huge new boost to road-building -£10,000m or £20,000m in England alone – Scotland, Wales and Northern Ireland more besides.

The history’s interesting. Yes, the Road Lobby is always there: bureaucrats and ministers know that, if they want it, a happy rich retirement awaits. But it was fascinating how the oldest tricks in the book worked once again – especially the one where the Department of the Environment, Transport and the Regions/Roads Lobby use the lefty greeny environmentalists as a front.

Buses or trams?

Let’s go back to 1997: gleaming New Labour triumph and the Tories slink away. Now I am the first to agree that the Tories were corrupt greedy road-building scum. But I am a statistician and am also aware that under horrible Thatcher and Major four new tramways/light rail systems (Manchester, Sheffield, Tyne and Wear, Docklands) totalling 158 kilometres had been built. [Note: According to The Times the road network expanded by 24,000 miles (38,624 km) between 1985 and 1995]

The Road Lobby hate trams worse than the devil hates holy water – and most of all they hate street trams: you take the road space away from cars in a no-argument way (very different from bus lanes) and give it to public transport. A London Transport survey showed that only trams can attract passengers out of their cars while buses have zero credibility with anyone who can afford a car.

So in 1997, John Prescott’s first step was to announce that there would be no more trams. Buses, he trumpeted, would be the racehorse of transport – but he would keep his own fleet of cars. Not a beep from the Green lobby. Now – three years on – British buses remain what they have been for forty years, an underclass slum on wheels with whooping, guzzling teenagers inside, marooned in traffic outside.

1998 White Paper con

Johnny’s next step was the July 1998 White Paper. We pleaded with the Green bodies, we harried environmental journos, to read the Papers and not just the spinners’ briefs. In vain. The White Papers made clear that the spending on public transport would be axed as compared to recent Tory levels – but if reported at all, this was in unread final paragraphs.

And on road building the trick is worth a study. John Major had found some 500 major road schemes and had cut this to 156. But now in July 1998, screamed the headlines in all the press, goody greenspeaking papers as well as nasty Tory, this 156 was axed to a mere 37 schemes.

We tried and tried to get the newspaper hacks to read the papers and see that not a single scheme had been axed: the 156 schemes had been split into nine categories of which 37 were ”targeted” – and all the rest were also to be built, subject to meaningless reservations. And of course all the ongoing schemes, including those not to be started for years for which the holy sacred contracts had been issued, would continue undisturbed.

Again and again, we pleaded with FoE, Transport 2000, Greenpeace and all the green gang of journos: to no avail. Let me emphasise: we weren’t asking anyone to investigate some crazy conspiracy theory. We were just asking them to read the plain words of the White Paper. Forget it. Too difficult. New Labour weren’t hateful Tories, and New Labour had cut something, whatever it was: thinking beyond this made their heads hurt.

Archway people – proud to count Simon Wolff as one of their greatest members – never had much trust in New Labour’s green noises. It had been “idealists” like William Rodgers whom we had fought at Archway. At a meeting held by Socialist Environment and Resources Association in 1995, we asked Labour transport spokesman, Frank Dobson, to pledge “no more roads in London”. Not a whisper of support from the assembled greenies – instead shouts of “fascist” and “scum”.

New Labour had pledged a six-months moratorium on road-building. Nina Tuckman questioned them. Not a single road being built would actually be stopped. Not only that, said Dobson, any road for which contracts had been issued would go ahead – so years of road-building were guaranteed. The moratorium meant that schemes years in the future, existing only in a bureaucrat’s mind, would be put on hold – in his mind – and after six months go ahead again. Even Plato wouldn’t have dared to sell this.

A sidelight of the SERA meeting mentioned above: a mob of green idealists sought to drag me, fat and nearly 60, out by my feet. I was wearing heavy “Callaghan” shoes and gave Roger Geffen, dynamic young leader of Reclaim the Streets, a really good kick, and the heroic greens fell back. I now always buy Callaghan shoes: whenever I don them, I think of that kick with pleasure.

The doyen of green journos, John Vidal of The Guardian, wrote (15 November1995) that Nina Tuckman and I were paid to disrupt environmentalists’ meetings. The Grauniad, of course, refused to print my reader’s letter and it needed six months and a case before the Press Commission to force the great liberal paper to publish our item revealing how the green bodies help road building.

Road Lobby triumphs

Back to 2,000: we’ve had the Platonic moratorium, the road bulldozers never missed a beat, and now comes the big one – not just the on-going £2,000m a year of new roads which never stopped, but a huge £10,000m or £20,000m boost. No money will be left for public transport and anyone who wants to get anywhere had better get in a car.

So having done nothing to make public transport credible, in fact having done nothing but increase fares and extinguish whatever slender hopes there were for improvement, New Labour is now “forced” to go for the full Road Lobby package. Huge new roads to smash through townscapes and sensitive country areas – even the notorious Salisbury scheme through Constable landscape is back.

And the unemployed will get loans to buy cars. Old bangers will be part-exchanged for new models on “environmental” grounds – the catalytic converter will make things better – for a few months.

We saw, this year, how New Labour, helped by all the press and not hindered at all by the Greens, harried Ken Livingstone for having committed the supreme sin – cutting fares in London in the Eighties and overseeing the only period ever when car traffic in London dropped and public transport usage soared. Incidentally, Tube revenues actually went up and the need for subsidy down - but Ken was “wasting public money”. It’s OK having ideals, children, but God help you if you put them into operation successfully!

The Greens, by and large, have settled happily to their allotted role. They sit on Government committees and accept Road Lobby aims such as 44-ton lorries. They “impose” good conditions, but Government ignore these. In England, people know how far to go. The Los Angeles model ( Seventies style – not the current one with Metros) is still the official aim, and all that professional green campaigners will achieve are badger tunnels under the motorways.

http://www.simonwolff.org.uk/content/labour-bent-mega-road-building…-and-environmentalists-help

 

[WatcherZero]

Well Hammonds first rail moves not endearing, according to the telegraph not only are they not going for the lib dems idea of changing the fare rises to RPI -1%, but to save money (since they get big chunks of fare revenue anyway) according to DFT insiders Hammond is considering removing the RPI +1% cap.

http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/ukn.../Commuters-face-threat-of-big-fare-rises.html

 

[Old Timer]

She had to be blonde didn't she! Why did I know you were going to say that!!!

Regrettably, old boy I have committed a Cardinal Sin in the eyes of Saltley men.

I have mentioned by name a place so terrible, so representative of darkness that many, many Saltley men will have been gravely offended by the mention of such a desolate wilderness in the same conversation as Saltley depot.

The comparison between both places is absolute and polar.

The penalty for such lewd and disrespectful blasphemy is to be ostracised, cast out upon the street without thought or care..

Such a fate awaits, only Mr Saltleyman and Mr Saltleyman 1043 have the respect and status to plead my mitigation.

As Lord Melchett stated at the Court Martial of Captain Blackadder..."Who will represent this man and face certain death by firing squad !!" ?

Such is the emotion generated by simply mention of the place of darkness.

 

[Saltleyman]

Regrettably, old boy I have committed a Cardinal Sin in the eyes of Saltley men.
As Lord Melchett stated at the Court Martial of Captain Blackadder..."Who will represent this man and face certain death by firing squad !!" ?

Such is the emotion generated by simply mention of the place of darkness.

Be advised that the"firing squad" are loading their rifles as I type this post.

 

[Wyvern]

I have mentioned by name a place so terrible, so representative of darkness that many, many Saltley men will have been gravely offended by the mention of such a desolate wilderness in the same conversation as Saltley depot.

Tsk. Tsk. A Midland man as well :roll:

 

[Old Timer]

Tsk. Tsk. A Midland man as well :roll:

I can quite cleary see there is a very large mountain to climb here, and I can see the range of opinion already is not favourably disposed.

I think at this stage the cards are stacked against me by some considerable margin !

The Jury may be "out" but I suspect that may well be just academic. Crimes such as this do not go down well.

All must rest on mitigation, and the persuasive argument of the defence.

 

[shinkansen1966]

Next general election is supposed to be May 2015. Wonder how many transport secretaries, we'll have had by then.

Based on previous experience, average life expectancy in this cabinet post is about 18 months. We'll probably be onto our next secretary before the end of next year, which means more pointless new announcements.