Wires to Windermere announced

[Xenophon PCDGS]

A second platform wouldn't give you much more though - all you'd save in terms of occupation of the single line is perhaps three or four minutes, at the cost of much longer layovers and thus less efficient use of resources.

Noting what is said here about Windermere station, has Kendal station ever been a 2-platform station at any time in the past ? I see that over 217,000 used it in the 2011/2 statistics.

 

[Dunc108]

Noting what is said here about Windermere station, has Kendal station ever been a 2-platform station at any time in the past ? I see that over 217,000 used it in the 2011/2 statistics.

Yes, Kendal had 2 platforms until branch singling in 1973. the site of the southbound platform is a car park for the GP surgery in the former station building. Cars actually access it up the old subway.

 

[yorksrob]

This is certainly a sensible add on. I would hope that Middlesbrough is also included (or added) as this must surely have as good a case.

 

[cuccir]

Wordsworth will be spinning in his grave...

 

[Eagle]

The BBC are running this story with a picture of a Virgin 390. Optimistic much?

Oxenholme to Windermere railway could be electrified
Electric trains could soon be running on a route in the Lake District, the Transport Secretary has announced. Patrick McLoughlin said he wanted to electrify the 10-mile Lakes Line Railway between Oxenholme and Windermere at a cost of £16m. He said electrifying the route would enable faster and greener travel between Kendal, Burneside and Staveley, as well as to Manchester, by 2016. He revealed his plans during a visit the county.

Cumbria Council welcomed Mr McLoughlin's plan and said it would bring environmental and economic boosts to the county. The government has asked Network Rail to draw up a full business case for the scheme.

Mr McLoughlin said: "This is a key line to one of the most important tourist areas in the UK and I believe the rail industry has a role in making sure more people can travel comfortably to enjoy the beautiful lakes. I recognise that strong rail links across the country are important drivers in our economic recovery, that is why we are pushing ahead with the biggest programmes of rail electrification ever."

Councillor Jo Stephenson, deputy leader of the county council, said: "I'm delighted the government has recognised there is a strong economic and environmental case for electrifying the Lakes Line. Not only will it bring newer trains for passengers, but it will also strengthen our case for maintaining and improving direct services from Manchester Airport to Windermere."

 

[Xenophon PCDGS]

Wordsworth will be spinning in his grave...

I wondered lonely as a cloud
That floats on high o'er vales and hills
When all at once I saw a crowd
Of....Network Rail catenaries.....

 

[yorksrob]

Well, I don‘t agree with everything Mr McLoughlin says, but he certainly seems to be an improvement on Mr McNulty

 

[HowardGWR]

I wondered lonely as a cloud
That floats on high o'er vales and hills
When all at once I saw a crowd
Of....Network Rail catenaries.....

Apparently the inspiration for the original lines came from Dorset. Being local, I know the actual field next to where Wordsworth (what an appropriate surname for a poet, like Mr Bun the Baker) lodged.
--- old post above --- --- new post below ---

Well, I don‘t agree with everything Mr McLoughlin says, but he certainly seems to be an improvement on Mr McNulty

In what way? McNulty was a hired-in overpaid apparatchik and Mcloughlin is an MP who, as a working class miner, decided that he could get where he wanted to be by standing as a Conservative.

I don't see the connection. Both gents may have admirable qualities for all I know.

 

[yorksrob]

Apparently the inspiration for the original lines came from Dorset. Being local, I know the actual field next to where Wordsworth (what an appropriate surname for a poet, like Mr Bun the Baker) lodged.
--- old post above --- --- new post below ---


In what way? McNulty was a hired-in overpaid apparatchik and Mcloughlin is an MP who, as a working class miner, decided that he could get where he wanted to be by standing as a Conservative.

I don't see the connection. Both gents may have admirable qualities for all I know.

Mr McNulty concluded that the only future for local railways was to be hived off into tramways (or worse) to be sustainable. He even used the Windemere branch as one who's costs had been increased unreasonably by running mainline through services on it. At least Mr McLoughlin seems to be thinking of the regional railway as part of a wider national network (for the timebeing at any rate !).

 

[Ships]

And now Oxenholme-Windermere has been added to the NW list for 2016...
http://www.railforums.co.uk/showthread.php?t=88053

The speed with which this was mooted/confirmed suggests this was on the agenda all along.
Maybe it was a simple equation about the cost of DMU workings from Preston that would otherwise have been needed.

A friend of mine did the business case for the civils work required 9 months or so ago. Some strange things like using lower stock to get round clearence issues where mooted but thankfully not carried through!

 

[DynamicSpirit]

Definitely good news. I do hope though that, even if they don't provide a passing loop at this point, they do the electrification in a manner that allows for one to be added in the future to increase frequencies. The line could certainly sustain more than an hourly service in the summer, especially if electrification brings about the usual increase in passenger numbers.

The 5mph section by Burneside could definitely do with being sorted out, and Kendal station could usefully be improved - it would be good if that could be done at the same time, but I guess that's hoping too much.
--- old post above --- --- new post below ---

60 mph, mainly, with a few bits of 50 and 40 around stations and level crossings.

If you travel on a through service heading South, it is very noticeable and remarkable how much faster the train starts travelling shortly after leaving Oxenholme.

 

[ainsworth74]

Mr McNulty concluded that the only future for local railways was to be hived off into tramways (or worse) to be sustainable. He even used the Windemere branch as one who's costs had been increased unreasonably by running mainline through services on it. At least Mr McLoughlin seems to be thinking of the regional railway as part of a wider national network (for the timebeing at any rate !).

I still think it would have been interesting to see the report that McNulty actually wrote in comparison with the report the DfT mandarins 'edited' and was published.

Anyway, this is good news indeed and as others have said should have been in the program from day one as it's not a particularly complex piece of wiring I'd have thought. Now for First Group/NR/DfT to stick Hull on to the list!

 

[The Planner]

I think Burneside is a sighting issue, either expensive to fix or you close it.

 

[DynamicSpirit]

I don't think it's that. I believe its a level crossing with a country lane that has no barriers. So I would guess the solution is to put some barriers on the level crossing.

 

[The Planner]

Will ask the signalling asset manager on Monday if I remember and find out, but no barriers wouldn't preclude a higher speed. There are plenty of AOCL crossings about with higher speeds, Sandscale on the Cumbrian coast line is 40mph in one direction, 10mph the other, which suggests sighting again.

 

[yorksrob]

I still think it would have been interesting to see the report that McNulty actually wrote in comparison with the report the DfT mandarins 'edited' and was published.

Anyway, this is good news indeed and as others have said should have been in the program from day one as it's not a particularly complex piece of wiring I'd have thought. Now for First Group/NR/DfT to stick Hull on to the list!

Indeed. If history shows McNulty to be pro regional rail,, then I will review my position.

 

[Lampshade]

What? Common sense on the railways? How?

 

[DynamicSpirit]

Will ask the signalling asset manager on Monday if I remember and find out, but no barriers wouldn't preclude a higher speed. There are plenty of AOCL crossings about with higher speeds, Sandscale on the Cumbrian coast line is 40mph in one direction, 10mph the other, which suggests sighting again.

Thanks, that would be interesting to know.

 

[edwin_m]

Also frees up a DMU for routes somewhere else that aren't going to be electrified soon if at all.

Probably more than one DMU, as any through working involves the unit off the branch running under the wires all the way to Manchester and being replaced by another one which has come from Manchester in the meantime. Electrifying the branch allows the Manchester trains to be replaced by EMUs too.

 

[Eagle]

Well it only frees up one DMU relative to the other (less palatable) option of making the branch completely self-contained :P

 

[callum112233]

Probably is something to do with sighting. I took some screencaps in Google Earth to show the visibility. Bare in mind, your viewpoint in a car would be lower than this camera angle.

Then coming from the other side:

Also take into consideration that not everyone driving a car over the crossing would be cautious, hence why they put in a 5mph limit.

Just my thoughts and guesses.

 

[Class377/5]

How many units are we expecting this new electrification to require?

 

[Xenophon PCDGS]

Is Sharps Lane the only available route to the settlement areas on the higher ground ?

 

[Tomnick]

Sighting isn't anything to do with what you can see from a car - that's what the red lights are for. Obviously the train needs to approach the crossing at a speed from which it can stop if the driver observes that the crossing's obstructed (or not working) though. Do Down trains strike in before calling at Burneside?

 

[PhilipW]

Spend the money and build a bridge. Be done with the problem. Worth it in the long term.

 

[Kettledrum]

Spend the money and build a bridge. Be done with the problem. Worth it in the long term.

If trains are having to slow right down at this point, is there anywhere suitable for a passing loop here. At least this would add capacity and possibly improve safety too.

 

[Xenophon PCDGS]

Spend the money and build a bridge. Be done with the problem. Worth it in the long term.

Sharps Lane has quite a hill to climb once it passes over the railway line so the bridgeworks would be quite a task to design, when the height of the overhead wiring would also have to be taken into account.

Another point that concerns me is even without a bridge in that situation, is the type of agricultural traffic, both the type of vehicle and also the type of possible high loads thus carried, that will have to be allowed for once the overhead wiring is in situ at Sharps Lane level crossing.

 

[PhilipW]

With the track electrified, I suspect that the line could experience quite a boom in passengers in the coming years. I suspect also that the demand will be there to run practically every train onto Preston, Manchester or whereever.

Somehow, to have a 5mph restriction for the next 100 years over a lightly used country line, does not seem right.

Take the plunge, be bold. Build a bridge. Where there's a will, there's a way.

 

[Tomnick]

I doubt that it could ever cost more to sort the crossing out (even 20mph would probably suffice?) than it would to build a bridge there. It's never going to be a fast or particularly busy bit of railway, so I can't see why an AOCL would be considered unsuitable.

 

[swt_passenger]

I wondered lonely as a cloud
That floats on high o'er vales and hills
When all at once I saw a crowd
Of....Network Rail catenaries.....

I wondered...

why you didn't use 'wandered' as in the original