First Group: General Discussion

[F1Ken]

It looks like at least one First Oldham Optare Solo is having a refurb, including newly painted handrails.

http://www.flickr.com/photos/46868364@N04/12056386114/
http://www.flickr.com/photos/46868364@N04/12056387984/

(these are not my pictures, I found them on another forum)

Do First have a new seat cover design? Because their are several different styles knocking around.

 

[Polo Mint]

Sorry I have no idea, I'll ask around.

 

[overthewater]

Some news from First Scotland East:

Scottish Borders, now has its own website: http://www.firstgroup.com/ukbus/scottish_borders/

A survey, has now appeared to obtain views on current tickets and routes for passengers.
http://www.firstgroup.com/ukbus/scotland_east/about_us/survey/ OR
https://www.surveymonkey.com/s/7PSPLJX

Musselburgh bus depot its seems now has a for sale sign on it, depending on who you talk to you will either getting the following responses:

First are moving to "Macmerry Industrial Estate"
First are closing up shop.

 

[eastcoast20]

Some news from First Scotland East:

Scottish Borders, now has its own website: http://www.firstgroup.com/ukbus/scottish_borders/

A survey, has now appeared to obtain views on current tickets and routes for passengers.
http://www.firstgroup.com/ukbus/scotland_east/about_us/survey/ OR
https://www.surveymonkey.com/s/7PSPLJX

Musselburgh bus depot its seems now has a for sale sign on it, depending on who you talk to you will either getting the following responses:

First are moving to "Macmerry Industrial Estate"
First are closing up shop.

Yep First seem to be up to something. Nothing has been released officially to say they are closing up shop but in all honesty it wouldn't surprise me, the depot is probably dragging the rest of FSE down. The X6/X8/X24 routes can't make much apart from the rush periods and the 108 is pointless imo. Cant comment on the 106 as its evening and sundays.

Then again they may move to Macmerry, don't really know what to make of that

Also interesting to note some have mentioned spotting Haddington, Dunbar and North Berwick on Lothian single deck destination screens, so will this mean lothian are poised to take over if first are calling it a day?

Interesting few weeks coming up!

 

[overthewater]

Yep First seem to be up to something. Nothing has been released officially to say they are closing up shop but in all honesty it wouldn't surprise me, the depot is probably dragging the rest of FSE down. The X6/X8/X24 routes can't make much apart from the rush periods and the 108 is pointless imo. Cant comment on the 106 as its evening and sundays.

Then again they may move to Macmerry, don't really know what to make of that. Also interesting to note some have mentioned spotting Haddington, Dunbar and North Berwick on Lothian single deck destination screens, so will this mean lothian are poised to take over if first are calling it a day?
Interesting few weeks coming up!

Lothian also have South Queensferry on many of the destinations screens for years.
I would be extremely surprised if muss was the depot causing the big loses compared to Livingston.

 

[Blindtraveler]

I wouldnt - 106 must hardly be viable and the X numbered runs are not much better. A lot have been running half empty for a while.↲

 

[overthewater]

I wouldnt - 106 must hardly be viable and the X numbered runs are not much better. A lot have been running half empty for a while.↲

Bit unlike Livingston nothing in Muss is "Controlled route" so first can scaled back unlike elsewhere.

 

[Blindtraveler]

not much left at Livi iether?

 

[overthewater]

not much left at Livi iether?

Every main route is controlled, 20, 21, 22, 27 and 28.
Its just 26, 651 and 800 which are not controlled.

 

[oldman]

Does anyone know if FSE are trying to dispose of the NB depot? If they are relocating from Musselburgh, it would be sensible to have one depot rather than two. I guess property values in NB are higher than in Macmerry.

By the way, Lothian used to have a picture of one of their buses with Peebles on the blind on their home page. No doubt a wee dig at the competition. They have had out of territory destinations on their blinds for years.

 

[bb21]

First Leicester is, reportedly, having some problems getting the E400s ready for service. They've missed their planned launch date despite drivers being type trained.

Robert

On the road now. Launched yesterday/today? I certainly didn't see any on Saturday.

Looks like all Leicester deserve are some London cascades despite returning a profit. 33559-33570 is the range observed today on the road - all 58 reg so 5 years old, mainly running on the 54.

 

[cainebj]

Buses of Somerset
Bus Passengers in The County Town will today notice a change of colour as The Buses of Somerset take to our streets. In thier distinct two tone green colour. The Buses of Somerset is the new name for all First Group services operated out of thier Taunton and Bridgwater depots. The Buses are not the only part of the company getting a make over. Taunton’s Bus Station has ondergone a revamp with more changes to come in the next few months. Bridgwater Bus Station will also get a revamp once the changes are complete in Taunton.

Alex Carter, Regional Director for First Group said “These changes reflect our commitment to our passengers in the Taunton and Bridgwater area” He went on to say “We have worked very hard to develop a new brand and a package of new products to help us properly and comprehensively market and publicise our services.”
A new website www.busesofsomerset.co.uk has gone live today along with a new information and timetable book. The booklets are on the buses from today and are avaliable from Taunton Bus Station.

http://www.applefm.co.uk/local-news/buses-of-somerset/2014/01/27

Certainly a bit different! The livery looks too much like Stagecoach's Park & Ride/Bio Bus though...

 

[TheGrandWazoo]

http://www.applefm.co.uk/local-news/buses-of-somerset/2014/01/27

Certainly a bit different! The livery looks too much like Stagecoach's Park & Ride/Bio Bus though...

Website still hasn't gone live - looking forward to having a prowl round it! Given it's a BI scheme in green, reminds me of Southern Vectis!

 

[swifty]

It's live, just have to put www. in front or else it still leads to the coming soon landing page. Facebook and Twitter are also up and running, as is a flickr account.

 

[freetoview33]

Looks good to me, big improvement and good maps ect.

 

[Blindtraveler]

On the road now. Launched yesterday/today? I certainly didn't see any on Saturday.

Looks like all Leicester deserve are some London cascades despite returning a profit. 33559-33570 is the range observed today on the road - all 58 reg so 5 years old, mainly running on the 54.

As my family have now left the area and when they were there they were served by Centrebus, I dont know what First are up against in that area anymore. Are they trying to win custom from the above, ariva ne and the same now anyway) plus independants or are they just coasting along with no real innovation and making a few quid to prop up the businesses less successfull parts in the process?↲

 

[cainebj]

And further news for First today, the OFT has cleared the takeover of Finglands. Full text will be available shortly.
http://www.oft.gov.uk/OFTwork/mergers/decisions/2014/first-manchester#.UuZxANLFIdA

 

[bb21]

As my family have now left the area and when they were there they were served by Centrebus, I dont know what First are up against in that area anymore. Are they trying to win custom from the above, ariva ne and the same now anyway) plus independants or are they just coasting along with no real innovation and making a few quid to prop up the businesses less successfull parts in the process?↲

They have scaled back by quite a fair bit compared to a few years back, but are now seemingly returning a profit, according to some forum members. The only routes with any service after around 2100 are now the 14/A, 25/26, 38/A-88/A super-route as I call it, and the 54. Evening journeys on the 22 were surrendered to Centrebus. The 21A now cover Hamilton, 18/70 now combined into a circular route 18/19 via Hinckley Road, Cort Crescent and Narborough Road, but apart from that there has not been any real development in the last few years.

Yes, they still face competition from Centrebus on the Beaumont Leys route, on which Centrebus also offers a 10-minute headway, with one each hour extending to Loughborough via Woodhouse Eaves covering for the old 123 on contract.

 

[Qwerty133]

On the road now. Launched yesterday/today? I certainly didn't see any on Saturday.

Looks like all Leicester deserve are some London cascades despite returning a profit. 33559-33570 is the range observed today on the road - all 58 reg so 5 years old, mainly running on the 54.

Still much better than the even older ones they're replacing, and most of the junk Arriva/Centrebus operate in the area.

 

[Mr Manager]

Worst bus in Suffolk to my mind are the one teetering on the edge. the service and the Buses in general have been updated too late.

public confidence in them is low. and the way they keep introducing routes then withdrawing them is alarming to say the least. and keep an eye on notice and proceedings shortly for what i think will be the killer blow by Ipswich buses. the new 53 route of Worst must be losing a fortune at the moment and to pull off the Bixley estate was a terrible decision by the management of worst Suffolk in my opinion.

 

[Blindtraveler]

They have scaled back by quite a fair bit compared to a few years back, but are now seemingly returning a profit, according to some forum members. The only routes with any service after around 2100 are now the 14/A, 25/26, 38/A-88/A super-route as I call it, and the 54. Evening journeys on the 22 were surrendered to Centrebus. The 21A now cover Hamilton, 18/70 now combined into a circular route 18/19 via Hinckley Road, Cort Crescent and Narborough Road, but apart from that there has not been any real development in the last few years.

Yes, they still face competition from Centrebus on the Beaumont Leys route, on which Centrebus also offers a 10-minute headway, with one each hour extending to Loughborough via Woodhouse Eaves covering for the old 123 on contract.

Interesting - I knew they had scaled back but didnt know to what extent. Sounds to me as if there happy to let it continue that way indefinately to me. Cant fault Ariva and centrebus for trying to push and innovate - its not as if theres a huge local rail network or anything and somebody needs to be offering something, junk buses or not!↲

 

[Robertj21a]

Still much better than the even older ones they're replacing, and most of the junk Arriva/Centrebus operate in the area.

What 'junk' is it that Arriva operate in Leicester ?

Robert

 

[overthewater]

I just dont understand First. Sommerset get a whole brand new look, manchester get fare cuts.

Its believe Somerset does not have the worlds best profits margins, but why is the area getting more money spent on it than say First Scotland East? Leicester? or Stoke-on-Trent?

 

[Robertj21a]

I just dont understand First. Sommerset get a whole brand new look, manchester get fare cuts.

Its believe Somerset does not have the worlds best profits margins, but why is the area getting more money spent on it than say First Scotland East? Leicester? or Stoke-on-Trent?

The new Somerset 'green' is widely believed to be a 'last chance' to see if a bit of paint can save it from the more likely scenario. There's little real cash being injected.

Robert

 

[overthewater]

The new Somerset 'green' is widely believed to be a 'last chance' to see if a bit of paint can save it from the more likely scenario. There's little real cash being injected.

Robert

Someone has spend money since Ray best impressions, has come up with the design, unlike First bluebird,

 

[TheGrandWazoo]

I just dont understand First. Sommerset get a whole brand new look, manchester get fare cuts.

Its believe Somerset does not have the worlds best profits margins, but why is the area getting more money spent on it than say First Scotland East? Leicester? or Stoke-on-Trent?

Leicester has just got 35 x 58 e400s whilst Somerset gets 6 x 53 plate Tridents. That's older than what Leicester is losing and is likely to head to Potteries. The cost of the rebrand is probably what FSE lost in a week!

First can't win. Do nothing. Same old First.

Invest in trying to get a noted industry figure to do something different. People question why they're bothering!

 

[overthewater]

Leicester has just got 35 x 58 e400s whilst Somerset gets 6 x 53 plate Tridents. That's older than what Leicester is losing and is likely to head to Potteries. The cost of the rebrand is probably what FSE lost in a week!

First can't win. Do nothing. Same old First.

Invest in trying to get a noted industry figure to do something different. People question why they're bothering!

No, I have asked this question before " Why isn't all areas moving forward together, and your reply was first should start with areas with the best returns can be made.

Yet First are now spending on an area where the returns are not the best, while other areas with chances of higher returns are not getting the same treatment. To be fair your right about Leicester, but still its taken this long to pull something out of the hat and its a token.

 

[tbtc]

No, I have asked this question before " Why isn't all areas moving forward together, and your reply was first should start with areas with the best returns can be made.

Yet First are now spending on an area where the returns are not the best, while other areas with chances of higher returns are not getting the same treatment. To be fair your right about Leicester, but still its taken this long to pull something out of the hat and its a token.

There's a difference between "Areas currently making a good return" and "Areas where spending a few quid on an upgrade would make the biggest difference" though.

Some of the most profitable areas are the mature/developed markets where you can't achieve much more (in the short term, at least).

Also, its much easier/ cheaper to rebrand all of the vehicles in Taunton than rebrand all of the vehicles in Glasgow.

 

[TheGrandWazoo]

No, I have asked this question before " Why isn't all areas moving forward together, and your reply was first should start with areas with the best returns can be made.

Yet First are now spending on an area where the returns are not the best, while other areas with chances of higher returns are not getting the same treatment. To be fair your right about Leicester, but still its taken this long to pull something out of the hat and its a token.

The real investment has been in new vehicles and the vast majority of these have gone to those places that DO give the best returns such as Glasgow, Aberdeen, Manchester, West Yorkshire, South Yorkshire, Hampshire and Bristol/Bath. Only a few others (6 to 10 apiece) have gone to Plymouth, Gala and Weymouth plus the X1 in FEC in 2 years.

Those places have also seen a lot of repaints, network and fare revisions.

 

[bb21]

What 'junk' is it that Arriva operate in Leicester ?

Robert

In fairness, the Enviro400s do look quite decent from the outside having gone through refurbs. They don't yet have local names applied, just in a generic First Bus livery. With no prospect of any new bus, they are not a bad compromise I would imagine. Many of the B7TLs have been struggling for a while so it is still a positive step nevertheless.

Arriva's recent London cascades (DAF/ALX400 and B7TL) are actually older than the majority of the DAF/Lowlanders already in the fleet (and have been since new) which are of a similar age to First's B7TL's which are presumably the ones being withdrawn (especially the few W-reg ones). I can't say how they are mechanically, but the interiors leave a lot to be desired. Some of them have recently been refurbished for the 84/85/86/87 so look better, but they are still 12-year old buses (at least). As with First's B7TLs, the Lowlanders are also starting to show their age.