What is the point of the Class 800/801 on the East Coast Mainline?

[najaB]

Sorry what is Digswell? (feel free to redirect to another thread if this has been discussed elsewhere)

Digswell Viaduct - a listed, two track viaduct on a four track railway.
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A Flickr photo (not mine):

 

[ainsworth74]

Ah otherwise know as the Welwyn Viaduct? Never knew it had another name to be honest!

 

[headshot119]

Ah otherwise know as the Welwyn Viaduct? Never knew it hand another name to be honest!

I've always known it as Welwyn too. With Digswell being the junction the Welwyn Garden City side of it.

 

[jopsuk]

it will also enable three pantographs to operate in a formation at upto 110mph, which will enable 3 x 4 car EMUs to couple together and run in service.

Are the 377/5s suitable for 110mph upgrade? Currently 3x365, 321 or 321 at up to 100 mph is certainly permitted, it's a key part of the GN operation!

 

[leomartin125]

I believe that it is only 800's on the ECML. the 800s are pure electric trains, so no engines under the floor (801's are for the semi electrified Great western main line, along with the at300) wifi is down to data connections like your mobile, so will depend on the infrastructure of 02, EE ect. I think the main thing is age, with the hst's being rather old. they are capable of higher speeds, however track side infrastructure, and in cab signalling would be required if I have read a few things correctly.

That's incorrect. The 801's are pure electric, 800 is a bi mode train and the 802 is the long haul bi mode train which is meant for services which predominantly use diesel power.

 

[sprinterguy]

Once it was confirmed that Class 91s would not be running at 140 mph the sets were lengthened to 9 cars.

The Intercity 225s were designed to be able to run at 140mph with a maximum of eleven intermediate carriages. The trains were ordered and delivered with nine carriages, due to a drop off in passenger demand, at a time when future enhancements to allow 140mph running were still intended, hence the experimental introduction of flashing green aspects on the southern ECML.

 

[Philip Phlopp]

Are the 377/5s suitable for 110mph upgrade? Currently 3x365, 321 or 321 at up to 100 mph is certainly permitted, it's a key part of the GN operation!

I've absolutely no idea, never actually asked what the differences are which allow 110mph running with Class 387 units, just know lots of people (NR and TOCs) want 110mph paths rather than 100mph paths, and want more Class 350, Class 360 and Class 387 units to be 110mph cleared.

If memory serves, the current Mark 3 OLE on the ECML is only cleared for 3 BR/BW High Speed pantographs at 100mph, anything else (Stone Faiveley AMBR) is limited to 2 in multiple, or should be.

Three pantographs on the existing OLE is pretty damn brutal on both the OLE and the third pantograph, lots of oscillation and pan bounce, which really needs the aerofoils that the BR/BW pans have to aide stabilisation and uplift.

 

[jopsuk]

Thankyou for that answer- I guess for the time being the capability of three pantograph/110mph will mainly be a theoretical benefit

 

[RichmondCommu]

Will the ECML class 800's / 801's be maintained at Bounds Green or will all the maintenance work be done at the North Pole site?

 

[ainsworth74]

Will the ECML class 800's / 801's be maintained at Bounds Green or will all the maintenance work be done at the North Pole site?

Doncaster as that's where they're building a depot. Though I'd imagine that Bounds Green, Craigentinny and Heaton will still have some involvement.

 

[Townsend Hook]

Are the 377/5s suitable for 110mph upgrade? Currently 3x365, 321 or 321 at up to 100 mph is certainly permitted, it's a key part of the GN operation!

The London Midland 350/1s, which were originally designed for 100mph operation, were modified and recertified to operate at 110mph a few years back. The 377/5s are of a similar vintage and concept, so I would be surprised if a 110mph upgrade wasn't possible.

 

[swt_passenger]

The London Midland 350/1s, which were originally designed for 100mph operation, were modified and recertified to operate at 110mph a few years back. The 377/5s are of a similar vintage and concept, so I would be surprised if a 110mph upgrade wasn't possible.

The devil will be in the detail. The TAA for the LM project 110 gave a little info on what was done, and in terms of running gear it involved modifications to the rotor end plates within the motors to deal with increased rotational forces.

There is a possibility that a different manufacturer's motors may not be as easily modded, and would therefore have to be replaced; that could make the costs significantly different.

 

[jopsuk]

it also depends whether it is really worth it- much less distance involved- there's not huge amounts of over 100mph south of Hitchin for the Cambridge Express services (which will be the 377/5s) to take advantage of