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Caledonian Sleeper discussion

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BRX

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It's true that the point of a strike is to cause disruption, disruption which will have a financial (and perhaps reputational) cost to the company the strikers are in dispute with. So, its part of the nature of industrial action that the "public" will suffer the consequences.

The issue here is perhaps the disproportionate affect it has on the sleeper services. The cancellation or part-bustitution of a sleeper service has a very large impact on the people intending to travel on it - in many cases entirely destroying the whole point of what it's supposed to be - ie, you're supposed to be asleep and in a comfortable berth, not being shoved into a coach at 4am. Generally people will have paid a lot for a sleeper journey; it might also be part of a holiday they have been looking forward to for some time, and it might be something they don't do very often. So for the passengers concerned, the disruption of a sleeper journey is a fairly major event in terms of hassle and discomfort, and in the case of someone who's not used it before, it would mean 100% of their sleeper journey experiences are negative. We all know that the Highland sleepers in particular are somewhat fragile; they don't make money and are often under threat of withdrawal (although hopefully safe for some years at present) so bad experiences (which will be relayed word-of-mouth to others thinking of trying it out) are very damaging.

Compare this with the effect of a cancelled daytime service - it might still be a hassle but in most cases ultimately it means a delayed journey, perhaps also a somewhat crowded or uncomfortable one, but probably not enough to make most people think "I will never travel by train again" because its a small fraction of all the journeys they make each year.

So, for the sleeper the effect on the passengers is very large, but for Scotrail fairly small I imagine. Passengers will associate the bad experience with CS instead. In theory of course, it can damage Scotrail's contractual relationship with CS, incentivising CS to make other arrangements in future but I don't imagine that losing whatever income they get from providing staff for the sleepers is exactly a big deal financially.

In comparison, for daytime Scotrail services the impact on the passenger is lower, but the cost to Scotrail higher.

So I can see there might be an argument for the RMT to make the decision to go easy on the sleeper impact, but others have explained above why it's not that straightforward.

Really it's CS who should take the blame here, rather than the RMT. It seems they have decided to manage their services such that they are highly reliant on staff from another company with a low incentive to make sure those staff are always available. The consequence of this is that when those staff aren't available - for reasons that are outwith CS's control - the impact is fairly catastrophic. Maybe they need to rethink their resilience to this kind of thing.
 
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gazr

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1S25 last night/this morning took a long detour through Kingmoor Yard due to wires being down @ Carlisle. Anyone with access to the exact routing, it would be appreciated :) 90044 on the front.

66733 + 73967 on the Inverness. 73969 + 73970 on FW.
 

221129

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How do you go about making reservations for the CS? Am I right in thinking it can be done at any ticket office? I already hold a valid rover ticket so just need to make reservations.
 

47271

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How do you go about making reservations for the CS? Am I right in thinking it can be done at any ticket office? I already hold a valid rover ticket so just need to make reservations.
You can certainly book at main Scotrail stations, or email them at [email protected]

I don't know if they can make rover reservations via email but they make other reservations like for Flexipass without a ticket sale. They're pretty helpful - it's a team based at their offices in Inverness so they know what they're doing.
 

gazr

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How do you go about making reservations for the CS? Ajm I right in thinking it can be done at any ticket office? I already hold a valid rover ticket so just need to make reservations.

If you want a birth, then it's best to reserve. The sleepers I've been on over the past few weeks have all had unreserved seats on them that anyone with a valid ticket can use. Wouldn't risk Friday/Sunday night services however.
 

PHILIPE

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If you want a birth, then it's best to reserve. The sleepers I've been on over the past few weeks have all had unreserved seats on them that anyone with a valid ticket can use. Wouldn't risk Friday/Sunday night services however.

Want a birth ? Is there a Maternity Unit on board :):)
 

robbeech

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I did 2 runs last week on a 1st class ALR.
I had a berth both times with the £75 supplement.

Reservations of a berth are mandatory i believe and they have been FULL both times. Sunday night Glasgow To Euston, Monday night, Euston to Aberdeen. I believe the remainder of the services were also full so don't leave it to chance.

For a berth just book online on their website using the "supplement" section, collect your tickets like you would any other and show them all bits of the ticket and reservations when you board.

On my second run from Euston to Aberdeen nobody asked me for my ticket once, I boarded and showed my supplement / berth reservation and they never asked for the ticket, similarly when alighting at Glasgow the chap at the gateline was interested in taking my reservation from me. Of course, i had my ALR so was covered but at no point was i asked to show it. Come to think of it i wasn't asked at Glasgow the previous night though i showed it to the gateline staff to get onto the platform as i was walking through the open gate.

Just bear in mind the disruption and how late in the day it could change. When i booked my Euston to Aberdeen service it was the only one running all the way, the Inverness and FW portion were moving onto alternative transport at Edinburgh. By the time i boarded at least my part and the Inverness were running all the way, perhaps even the FW section too so it really can change.
 

Hadders

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If travelling on an ALR you need a reservation to use the sleeper. Either a berth supplement (fee payable) or a seat reservation (which is free). You can take your chances and turn up on the night but if it's full then you won't be able to travel.

Any ticket office that does reservations should be able to sell you a berth supplement or do a seat reservation for you. Alternatively you can book a berth supplement on-line.
 

reb0118

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Want a birth ? Is there a Maternity Unit on board :):)
Not yet. Maybe when the new trains roll out. TBF there's been a fair few conceptions on the sleeper - must be something to do with rough shunting at the Waverley.

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221129

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Thanks All,

I should have been a bit clearer, I will be using a Scotland Travelpass and I'll be travelling seated from Glasgow - Bridge of Orchy and Crianlarich to Fort William on 2 different trips.

Do I need reservations for this part of the journey and if so can I get them from any staffed station?

Thanks, Ollie
 

reb0118

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I've not been able to make seat reservations for the internal Scottish portions that run as "day" services since Sevco took over.

That said you can still board the FTW portion without a reservation and stand if required.



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Hadders

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Thanks All,

I should have been a bit clearer, I will be using a Scotland Travelpass and I'll be travelling seated from Glasgow - Bridge of Orchy and Crianlarich to Fort William on 2 different trips.

Do I need reservations for this part of the journey and if so can I get them from any staffed station?

Thanks, Ollie

Technically you still need a reservation but you can't get them from anywhere - the useless Serco have told me that they don't (and never have) existed!

It won't be a problem if you just board - the seated portion between Fort William and Edinburgh is never full in my experience.

Do check that the train is running and hasn't been replaced by a coach. I did FTW-GLQ on the seats a couple of weeks ago and it was a coach with seemingly no arrangements for people boarding/alighting at intermediate stations. The only advantage of the train being cancelled is the coach is over an hour quicker.
 

BRX

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When it was Scotrail, it was compulsory - in theory at least - to have a reservation to travel as a "day" passenger in the seated coach, I think. Didn't know that's no longer the case but it's useful to know.
 

Hadders

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When it was Scotrail, it was compulsory - in theory at least - to have a reservation to travel as a "day" passenger in the seated coach, I think. Didn't know that's no longer the case but it's useful to know.

Indeed - the GB timetable still shows it as 'Reservations Compulsory'. I have several seat reservations for the seated sleeper between FTW and Glasgow/Edinburgh from the National Express and Scotrail eras.

The useless Serco tell me that these reservations weren't possible and are a figment of my imagination.
 

BRX

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I've actually asked them if there's an option to stay (asleep) on the train at edinburgh and continue north by rail later in the day.

For the record - CS failed to give me an answer to this.

Their reply simply stated that we'd be at Edinburgh "very early in the morning" and that we could either use the coach or make our own way later in the day.
 

Blindtraveler

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Nowhere near enough to a Pacer :(
I have in the past had an FTW>EDB seated reservation made no problem by the very helpful scotrail booking office at Oban who wernt in the least bit phased by my wanting one for that same day

it wouldnt have mattered if I didnt have one however as was v quiet.
 

Hadders

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I have in the past had an FTW>EDB seated reservation made no problem by the very helpful scotrail booking office at Oban who wernt in the least bit phased by my wanting one for that same day

it wouldnt have mattered if I didnt have one however as was v quiet.

Out of interest when did you get that reservation? Was it after Serco took over. Earlier this year I tried at Stevenage (usually excellent), Peterborough and Waverley and was unable to get one.

Agree that it won't matter if you haven't got a reservation. I've never known more than 6 passengers on that portion. Sometimes there are a few locals going one or two stations who buy tickets on board with no problems.
 

221129

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Out of interest, I looked at local fares on the CS website last night and it offered reservations for the sleeper!
 

Blindtraveler

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Nowhere near enough to a Pacer :(
My journey was last September so well into the Serco days. In all my bashing marithons iv never I dont think done such a trip, itinarry was Edinburgh>Glasgow>Oban, bus Oban to FortBill then FortBill>Mallaig>FortBill>Edinburgh all in a day, the tough bit being the slow nature of much of it and IMO the unsuitability of the 156s. Glad I was of the luxury of seated sleaper for the run home.
--- old post above --- --- new post below ---
IMO Edinburgh are seamingly reluctant to sell or do anything unusual these days, to the extent they wouldnt sell me a totally valid simple split ticket for the same day meaning I had to do it at Crewe instead
 
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Bletchleyite

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I hope you complained - ticket offices are required to sell you the requested tickets, if you request a specific ticket or combination thereof. To refuse, unless they believe they are not valid for what you propose to do with them, is a breach of the impartial retailing regulations.
 

najaB

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Passed through Inverness today and there was a Class 73 and a Class 66 on the front of the sleeper. Has there been a double 73 to Inverness as yet?
 

BRX

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IMO Edinburgh are seamingly reluctant to sell or do anything unusual these days, to the extent they wouldnt sell me a totally valid simple split ticket for the same day meaning I had to do it at Crewe instead

Complain. They are not supposed to do this.

I've complained a couple of times in the past about this (once Glasgow, once Guildford) and each time they had to admit they were in the wrong and apologise. If people don't complain then they will continue to get away with it and people who don't know the system will be paying more than they should.
 

Haig paxton

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Without wanting to drag this off topic I did, as a matter of fact I have a number of long term issues with EDB in terms of ticketing and other aspects of the service offered to the station and the city by VTEC
Don't you have a blind pass? I thought the blind travelled free?
 

cambsy

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Saw a double headed 73'9 on front of Inverness-Euston Sleeper on 15th June, arrived on Highland Chieftain from Kings Cross.
 
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