Electrostar GTR cascade

[387star]

Understand southeastern taking 377/1s from southern which numbers?

I travelled on two 377/1s attached together this morning and was reminded how nice the original spec electrostar interior is compared to the /2 /4 and /5 and later /1 varients

Roomy airy and really comfy seats throughout the train

So given southeastern has such a great fleet of 375s with only the metro units being high density (375/9s) I am hopeful they take later series southern 377/1s and leave the first fifteen or so that have 2+2 seating throughout and thicker padding as well

 

[RichardKing]

Understand southeastern taking 377/1s from southern which numbers?

I travelled on two 377/1s attached together this morning and was reminded how nice the original spec electrostar interior is compared to the /2 /4 and /5 and later /1 varients

Roomy airy and really comfy seats throughout the train

So given southeastern has such a great fleet of 375s with only the metro units being high density (375/9s) I am hopeful they take later series southern 377/1s and leave the first fifteen or so that have 2+2 seating throughout and thicker padding as well

I've got no idea of the unit numbers Southeastern are taking, but I do know that 377 101-119 are the units with the comfortable 2+2 seating throughout and 120-139 have the occasional comfortable seats with a 3+2 layout.

 

[swt_passenger]

This has not been confirmed yet has it?

Unless you have some very new info, all that has ever been put into franchise agreements is that 100 vehicles (25 X 4 car 377s) are going to SE subject to future agreements.

There's been plenty of forum debate about which class or numbers they might be, but that's all.

 

[387star]

No information but always been talked about as /1s

 

[swt_passenger]

No information but always been talked about as /1s

So nothing's changed at all since the last 377 to Southeastern discussion.

 

[physics34]

yep no further info, infact SE may be getting 319s....

 

[RichardKing]

This has not been confirmed yet has it?

Unless you have some very new info, all that has ever been put into franchise agreements is that 100 vehicles (25 X 4 car 377s) are going to SE subject to future agreements.

There's been plenty of forum debate about which class or numbers they might be, but that's all.

I'm sure I heard from somewhere that due to the compatibility and interior of the 375s, it would definitely be 25 units between 377 101-139 that are sent to Southeastern.

 

[Class377/5]

yep no further info, infact SE may be getting 319s....

Word is they go for up to 25x 319 in advance of the 377s to give a capacity upgrade a year eariler than planned as switching the Victoria to Orpington service to all 319s requires no training needs as Orpington depot sign the stock.

Once the 700s release the 25x 377, the 319s will go off lease with the 377s on the Maidstone East to release the Networkers to be cascaded back to the Orpington services.

But its all rumours right now.

 

[swt_passenger]

It's been regularly posted here about the probable unit numbers ever since first mentioned in the TSGN ITT, but repetition doesn't make it any more factual.

 

[Class 466]

Reliably informed 377120-155 will be leaving SN for SE. The first 8-10 by December with No booked Networker working along the Maidstone East line at weekends from the December TT onwards. The Maidstone East & Chatham Main lines will see them first replacing any 465/9s working along these routes.

 

[ComUtoR]

switching the Victoria to Orpington service to all 319s requires no training needs as Orpington depot sign the stock.

A whole link of Drivers need to be trained.

 

[Class 466]

A whole link of Drivers need to be trained.

No 319s are coming to SE now.

 

[Class377/5]

Reliably informed 377120-155 will be leaving SN for SE. The first 8-10 by December with No booked Networker working along the Maidstone East line at weekends from the December TT onwards. The Maidstone East & Chatham Main lines will see them first replacing any 465/9s working along these routes.

Wow, not wasting any time then!

 

[ScotGG]

Can't afford to waste time. The cuts to services last month, plus lack of stock meaning short trains leaving Cannon Street, have caused massive overcrowding on Metro lines.

 

[Class 466]

Wow, not wasting any time then!

Indeed not! Currently the initial flow will stick to the current 377/5 diagrams SX, and will just berth in Bellingham Sidings rather than swap over there. 377 conversion courses are in full swing at Ramsgate & Dover!

 

[Mikey C]

Can't afford to waste time. The cuts to services last month, plus lack of stock meaning short trains leaving Cannon Street, have caused massive overcrowding on Metro lines.

Agreed, these additional trains were needed before the London Bridge works started

 

[physics34]

Indeed not! Currently the initial flow will stick to the current 377/5 diagrams SX, and will just berth in Bellingham Sidings rather than swap over there. 377 conversion courses are in full swing at Ramsgate & Dover!

Conversion course?! Not much difference to teach...

 

[ScotGG]

Indeed not! Currently the initial flow will stick to the current 377/5 diagrams SX, and will just berth in Bellingham Sidings rather than swap over there. 377 conversion courses are in full swing at Ramsgate & Dover!

So no improvement initially then in December? Just losing some 377/5s and replaced by 377/1s cascading no Networkers to Metro?

If not when will more 377/1s arrive to allow Networkers to be cascaded? SE are now sending 6 car peak trains to Cannon Street in the peaks, and that's on lines like Greenwich where peak time trains have also seen hefty reductions as path aren't available. Not much can be done about service reductions but to then put just 6 carriages on the remaining services is not working. Cannon Street services are packed and people cannot board now.

 

[Class377/5]

Conversion course?! Not much difference to teach...

True, but still must be done.

Indeed not! Currently the initial flow will stick to the current 377/5 diagrams SX, and will just berth in Bellingham Sidings rather than swap over there. 377 conversion courses are in full swing at Ramsgate & Dover!

Ah interesting, only a few hours in there then. Would be good to see some along the Medway.

 

[387star]

Reliably informed 377120-155 will be leaving SN for SE. The first 8-10 by December with No booked Networker working along the Maidstone East line at weekends from the December TT onwards. The Maidstone East & Chatham Main lines will see them first replacing any 465/9s working along these routes.

excellent news that 377101-119 are remaining as these have the best interior in the fleet

perhaps there was pressure to keep those doesn't seem accidental

377120-139 have mostly 3+2 seating so will be akin to 375/9s although they do have 2+2 in the ends of each coach. I wonder if southeastern will tweak the interior and add these additional units to the refurb

the remaining /1s they are getting have the standard southern interior however without the later first class modifications ie no sliding door or plug points and no privacy screen in the standard class part of the end coaches

 

[MrB]

What is the difference to drivers between 375s and 377? Will the 2 classes work in multiple with each other?

 

[DasLunatic]

I must ask, what's the difference between a 377/1 and a 375? They were built at near enough the same time, have identical motors, identical body shapes...

 

[jopsuk]

It used to be that they had different couplers- the primary modification from 375/3 to 377/3 was to change the Tightlocks to Delners. But since then the 375 fleet have had their couplers all changed. And 375s aren't fitted with bodyside cameras. Given they were fitted to 377/s, it would hardly be a trial to convert the fleet. If needed. I imagine they're on different software versions

 

[Class 466]

excellent news that 377101-119 are remaining as these have the best interior in the fleet

perhaps there was pressure to keep those doesn't seem accidental

377120-139 have mostly 3+2 seating so will be akin to 375/9s although they do have 2+2 in the ends of each coach. I wonder if southeastern will tweak the interior and add these additional units to the refurb

the remaining /1s they are getting have the standard southern interior however without the later first class modifications ie no sliding door or plug points and no privacy screen in the standard class part of the end coaches

There was no pressure at all, the job of these 377/1s is to replace 465/9s. The low density interior of 377101-119 isn't suitable. They will be wrapped in all over blue to match the refurbished 375s. Whether there's scope to add these 36 units to the 375 midlife refresh project remains to be seen.

The 377s will run on their own diagrams, with no plans to run them in booked service with 375s. obviously if one or the other fails, they can rescue one another.

 

[ScotGG]

I asked before but no answer. Are the intial batch just going to run the 377/5 diagrams which then leave for Southern? A like-for-like swap?

If so then when does SE see a net increase which can improve things for Metro passengers with Networker cascades? May 2017 timetable perhaps? Thanks

 

[Class 466]

I asked before but no answer. Are the intial batch just going to run the 377/5 diagrams which then leave for Southern? A like-for-like swap?

If so then when does SE see a net increase which can improve things for Metro passengers with Networker cascades? May 2017 timetable perhaps? Thanks

Apologies for missing that!

Indeed they are, and then at weekends they will work between Victoria & Ashford/Canterbury W.

The next 12 months will be an incredibly fluid period as 377s arrive in dribs and drabs. but the initial plan is to strengthen all VIC - DFD/ORPs to 8 coaches (The maximum length they can run at without SDO) , which will free up 2 cars to go elsewhere. 377s will (In time) also replace 375/465s on the Hastings Line.

 

[physics34]

The 377s will run on their own diagrams, with no plans to run them in booked service with 375s. obviously if one or the other fails, they can rescue one another.

wonder why because as far as im aware apart from the in cab monitors, exterior cameras and the software (easy fix i presume), there is not much difference....unless they are set to work DOO services.

 

[Class377/5]

wonder why because as far as im aware apart from the in cab monitors, exterior cameras and the software (easy fix i presume), there is not much difference....unless they are set to work DOO services.

They need to run a separate batch of diagrams as SE isn't doing the maintenance on them so it's not a good idea to cross work the fleets.

 

[physics34]

They need to run a separate batch of diagrams as SE isn't doing the maintenance on them so it's not a good idea to cross work the fleets.

who is then? Southern?

EDIT:.......ah, its clicked....... no wonder SouthEastern drivers are learning Selhurst depot!!

 

[MrB]

Apologies for missing that!

Indeed they are, and then at weekends they will work between Victoria & Ashford/Canterbury W.

The next 12 months will be an incredibly fluid period as 377s arrive in dribs and drabs. but the initial plan is to strengthen all VIC - DFD/ORPs to 8 coaches (The maximum length they can run at without SDO) , which will free up 2 cars to go elsewhere. 377s will (In time) also replace 375/465s on the Hastings Line.

Why are the 375s on the Hastings line being replaced?! We don't want any more high density units thanks!