3 carriages between Salisbury and Exeter !

[yorksrob]

Normally when I travel this route it is six carriages along all the way, which gives a bit of respite after Salisbury.

Today, however, they seem to have detached one of the units at Salisbury, causing an annoying level of crowding all the way to Honiton.

Is this a regular occurrence, and is it written anywhere which are 3 carriage services so they can be avoided ?

 

[iantherev]

The majority of M-F services west of Salisbury are 3 car these days. The 10:20 ex Waterloo is booked 5 car as the 158 runs through to Exeter to run the peak hour Honiton and Axminster workings.

 

[TEW]

But as it's only a 5-car out of Waterloo, the 1020 can be a bit cosy at that end of the route. Most of them have been 3-cars past Salisbury Monday-Fridays since the hourly timetable started.

 

[yorksrob]

In the past when I've got the return journey from Exeter it's usually been six carriages. Has the diagraming changed ?

 

[iantherev]

08:26 and 09:25 off Exeter are 6 car, 3 car thereafter.

 

[pompeyfan]

To be fair that route is struggling at the moment for capacity, there's not really that much more that can be done, short of stop hiring out a unit to GWR and not using one on the lymington they can't do much else.

Talking of 159s, saw one shunting through the carriage wash yesterday afternoon about 15:45 which is really rare to see at that date/time.
--- old post above --- --- new post below ---
Just found it now, it was a VSTP path, but still unusual.

http://www.realtimetrains.co.uk/train/O30046/2016/09/23/advanced

 

[yorksrob]

In previous years I have travelled on a Saturday, which might have had an effect.

Is the 14:20 off Waterloo generally six carriages all the way ?
--- old post above --- --- new post below ---

08:26 and 09:25 off Exeter are 6 car, 3 car thereafter.

To be fair that route is struggling at the moment for capacity, there's not really that much more that can be done, short of stop hiring out a unit to GWR and not using one on the lymington they can't do much else.

Talking of 159s, saw one shunting through the carriage wash yesterday afternoon about 15:45 which is really rare to see at that date/time.
--- old post above --- --- new post below ---
Just found it now, it was a VSTP path, but still unusual.

http://www.realtimetrains.co.uk/train/O30046/2016/09/23/advanced

Interesting. Before my time on the route, but in loco hauled says, wasn't it a rake of 8 or 9 carriages every two hours, so a single 159 every hour doesn't seem to represent a massive capacity increase since those days.

 

[BestWestern]

I wonder if we might see SWT poaching additional sets in the not too distant future. GWR are supposedly sending theirs to Exeter (which does seem a waste of quality long distance stock) and of course Northern have got new builds on order, though I presume no plans to release their 158s currently? Are Scotrail refurbing their ropey ones, or have they been left ropey for a reason? With SWT being a bit of a darling operator, it wouldn't surprise me to see plans being drawn up if indeed they are short of capacity.

 

[swt_passenger]

The SWT franchise ITT requires them to either transfer a unit permanently to GWR to replace the daily hire in unit, or continue hiring it at cost.

So effectively that 158 (although changing regularly) is no longer part of the fleet. I believe the other unit transferred to EMT is also a permanent transfer.

CWNs over the last few years show most weekday off-peak departures from Exteter are 3 car. There are no obvious recent reductions.

 

[embers25]

In previous years I have travelled on a Saturday, which might have had an effect.

Is the 14:20 off Waterloo generally six carriages all the way ?
--- old post above --- --- new post below ---

Interesting. Before my time on the route, but in loco hauled says, wasn't it a rake of 8 or 9 carriages every two hours, so a single 159 every hour doesn't seem to represent a massive capacity increase since those days.

On Saturday and Sunday most are 6 all the way but on Mon-Friday the 1120, 1220, 1320, 1420 and 1520 are all 3 after Salisbury but there is usually enough room and the front coach is the least busy, unless it's in reverse formation. The 1620 is 8 from London and usually 6 from Salisbury and so has plenty of room.

 

[yorksrob]

On Saturday and Sunday most are 6 all the way but on Mon-Friday the 1120, 1220, 1320, 1420 and 1520 are all 3 after Salisbury but there is usually enough room and the front coach is the least busy, unless it's in reverse formation. The 1620 is 8 from London and usually 6 from Salisbury and so has plenty of room.

Ah, that will explain it.

It's a nuisance travelling on a Friday but that's when they seem to do the holiday let's nowadays.

The route certainty seems due a step change in provision on week days as far as I can see.

 

[louis97]

On Saturday and Sunday most are 6 all the way but on Mon-Friday the 1120, 1220, 1320, 1420 and 1520 are all 3 after Salisbury but there is usually enough room and the front coach is the least busy, unless it's in reverse formation. The 1620 is 8 from London and usually 6 from Salisbury and so has plenty of room.

The 1420 from Waterloo is booked a 6-car all the way on a Friday. 1520 is a 6-car all the way all week too.

 

[yorksrob]

The 1420 from Waterloo is booked a 6-car all the way on a Friday. 1520 is a 6-car all the way all week too.

Thanks for that useful information. I shall bear it in mind for next year !

 

[Martin_1981]

I travelled on the 1220 Waterloo to Exeter service from Salisbury to Cranbrook (near Exeter) on Monday 15 August. It came in as a 9 car Class 159, with the rear unit detached, the middle unit going to Bristol and the front unit going to Exeter. The Exeter portion was full and standing when it rolled into the station, only to be joined by another 100 or so people from the other carriages, with the result that people were standing all the way along the aisles. Luckily I managed to get a seat at either Templecombe or Gillingham, but many were still standing when I got off at Cranbrook. It was a hot day, the aircon was off and I started to feel faint. I complained to SWT, but they fobbed me off with a load of crap as I expected.

 

[yorksrob]

If they can run six carriages on Saturdays, perhaps they can run them on other days ?

 

[godfreycomplex]

The line is crying out for additional stock; I've been down there a few times on Saturday afternoons, 3 beyond Salisbury and it was all along the aisles; children sitting in luggage racks; pushchairs in the back cab; the whole shebang (and with Salisbury traffic becoming beyond parody at anything resembling peak time it's only going to get worse) However Salisbury depot must be close to capacity.

 

[SpacePhoenix]

Have HSTs ever been used on Waterloo-Exter St Davids services?

 

[Kentish Paul]

Have HSTs ever been used on Waterloo-Exter St Davids services?

As far as I know, No.

 

[Monty]

Have HSTs ever been used on Waterloo-Exter St Davids services?

They wouldn't be suitable in any case, while the Exeter services are fairly quick to Salisbury there is a lot of stopping and starting west of Salisbury and a HST just wouldn't keep to the timings.

 

[yorksrob]

It would be nice if, through the various cascades, the route could get some additional 158's.

 

[pompeyfan]

It's where these 158s come from though. I've said time and time before that if a deal could be done the displaced 22 185s go as doubled up 6 coaches, bang in some ASDO beacons along with the TMS software and put them on GWR freeing up their 158s for SWT.

 

[yorksrob]

It's where these 158s come from though. I've said time and time before that if a deal could be done the displaced 22 185s go as doubled up 6 coaches, bang in some ASDO beacons along with the TMS software and put them on GWR freeing up their 158s for SWT.

We're losing those 185's from up here anyway, so I would suggest GW land is as good a place as any for them to go.

 

[swt_passenger]

It would be nice if, through the various cascades, the route could get some additional 158's.

They could always use the few 158s and 159s still used in the SWT third rail area, there's less about than there were, but still the odd peak extras, and of course the Mon - Fri Lymington shuttle.

 

[iantherev]

Unfortunately there's this little, insignificant place called London at the other end of the line......

 

[pompeyfan]

When the 707s come online it should in turn increase the numbers of 158/159s but I wouldn't imagine there's many units to be gained that way. 1 from the Lymington and possibly 2 in each peak, maybe 3 at a push. There can't be many diesel diagrams left that only play 3rd rail all day?

 

[embers25]

If they can run six carriages on Saturdays, perhaps they can run them on other days ?

They used to but the introduction of the half hourly services to Yeovil means that there are no spare trains. What's more frustrating is that now the Exeter ones are full and standing whilst the pointless extra Yeovils just carry air.

On the earlier point. The 1520 I use a lot and it is booked as 6 but regularly ends up being 3 beyond Salisbury. I have also used the 1420 on Fridays this summer and it was also 3 beyond Salisbury on several occasions.

 

[ac6000cw]

I wonder if we might see SWT poaching additional sets in the not too distant future. GWR are supposedly sending theirs to Exeter (which does seem a waste of quality long distance stock)

Exeter to Penzance isn't 'short distance', especially in journey time - some of those long runs are currently done by 150s... (memories last year of a Newton Abbot - Truro run in a hot, packed 150 with 3+2 seating). 158s, or even better 185s, would be a big improvement.

 

[swt_passenger]

When the 707s come online it should in turn increase the numbers of 158/159s but I wouldn't imagine there's many units to be gained that way. 1 from the Lymington and possibly 2 in each peak, maybe 3 at a push. There can't be many diesel diagrams left that only play 3rd rail all day?

Agree. I think one fly in the ointment will be that Winchester to Totton service in the afternoon peak, I've been before told that has to remain a DMU because it reverses in Totton Yard, but surely they could eventually use an EMU and reverse further down the line, e.g. at Brockenhurst?

Does a pair of 159s still sit effectively spare at Basingstoke between the peaks?

 

[pompeyfan]

Agree. I think one fly in the ointment will be that Winchester to Totton service in the afternoon peak, I've been before told that has to remain a DMU because it reverses in Totton Yard, but surely they could eventually use an EMU and reverse further down the line, e.g. at Brockenhurst?

Does a pair of 159s still sit effectively spare at Basingstoke between the peaks?

Yeah I know the diagram you're on about, it runs up from Salisbury, reverses at Basingstoke, sits in wallers ash and then as you say works down to totton, but like you say in the future with the 707s there's no reason that couldn't continue to brockenhurst or similar providing it's in the correct place for its return working.

There's no longer 159s sat in Basingstoke during the day unless something's gone wrong, it's usually a 450 now which works the 2Txx 1626 from basingrad (which surprisingly doesn't stop at Hilsea, but that's not important)

 

[yorksrob]

They used to but the introduction of the half hourly services to Yeovil means that there are no spare trains. What's more frustrating is that now the Exeter ones are full and standing whilst the pointless extra Yeovils just carry air.

On the earlier point. The 1520 I use a lot and it is booked as 6 but regularly ends up being 3 beyond Salisbury. I have also used the 1420 on Fridays this summer and it was also 3 beyond Salisbury on several occasions.

Perhaps they need to extend the half hourly Yeovil to Exeter, but I suppose that would need more stock. I presume this runs from Waterloo ?