More nonsense from the incompetent GTR "Gatwick Express" staff.

[Bletchleyite]

FWIW, the gateline rejects through tickets past Victoria too, despite being fully valid.

 

[jacksonbang]

From looking online and on Twitter etc so many people do indeed seem to have problems at P13 and P14. It seems like the only tickets they want to accept are.

Any Permitted Single from Gatwick Airport to London Victoria
Any Permitted Return from Gatwick Airport to London Victoria
Any Permitted Single from London Victoria to Gatwick Airport
Any Permitted Return from London Victoria to Gatwick Airport

They dont seem to like to accept any other tickets (even if they are fully valid). I will certainly be very careful when using these platforms in the future to ensure that my tickets dont get ripped up again

Last week I attempted to pass the staff controlled barrier at Victoria (all automatic gates were set to entry).

Even with the massive overcrowding and passenger bunching my ticket and, no doubt, it's offending "Not Valid on HS1" was ripped out of my hand and I was told this was not valid. I was then handed back my ticket, told to "move out of the way" with some other offenders and made to wait until all other passengers had left. I was using the outward portion of a Rye to London Off Peak Return.

Then something quite strange happened. I was preparing myself for the questioning and, as I realised most of the others with ticketing issues seemed to be tourists, I jumped in first and asked what the problem was - I was told ticket was not valid and, quite surprisingly, "this time only"/directed through the gate. I asked why not valid and was told to "go". At no time was eye contact made with me.

No amount of red feather advertising is going to cover up the abysmal treatment of customers.

And another thing - it seems the typical situation to make the passengers pass through a single manual-checking gate on arrival at Victoria additionally removing another aspect of the "Express" service.

 

[Greenback]

It sound abysmal, and it sounds as though the culture there is completely wrong. Something needs to be done to change the suspicion, mistrust and downright incompetence with which these people are carrying out their duties.

 

[talldave]

A few videos posted online of the offenders would be a good start - makes it easier to know which staff to fire.

 

[jon0844]

Indeed, sometimes you do. For example, if In my organisation that would be accepted as a high level escalation. A case were someone's first contact was a letter to the CEO would not.

I'm not ashamed at going to the top when I was being threatened with prosecution for combining a Z1-3 and Z4-6 Travelcard, with the assumption being that I'd committed an offence every day since I got my season ticket(s).

It was sorted the same afternoon (as in I was assured the case would go no further) and asked to give information after to follow up on.

But for other issues, I go through customer services. In most cases, everything gets resolved fine, but on the railway I've probably had more unsatisfactory results than positive, always having to go back with a 'that's not what I said' and 'you missed the point'.

I guess that's what happens when you've outsourced customer services to the likes of Serco or Capita, and they have limited resources and just go for the drop down lists.

I rarely want compensation, just an assurance that my issue won't happen again. I suspect that if I ever wanted to get such assurances AND action (rather than vague 'we take xx very seriously' nonsense) I'd actually need to be emailing the CEO or press office ALL the time.

The fact that people doing that often get more favourable results is why more and more people feel compelled to 'jump the queue'. In many cases, they're not actually queue jumping, they've just given up on the regular channels.

Another recent example was a number of exchanges with a mobile phone operator. A new price/deal was agreed, which didn't happen - I was being charged double. Calls to customer service was fruitless and painful, and of course they couldn't locate the original recording that helped me.

That got escalated to an email higher up, with an email within hours, a phone call from the retentions team and - miraculously - them finding the recording all of a sudden (despite the claim before, when it suited them, to say that not all calls were recorded and mine was one of them).

Edit: My personal best, perhaps, was texting Elaine Holt late at night because the steps on the old bridge at Hatfield station hadn't been de-iced. She responded and got them done the same evening, no doubt being aware that there had been some nasty falls there before - also on ice.

 

[Bletchleyite]

What is needed is for some people who have the time and money to let GTR attempt a few prosecutions and have them laughed out of Court, hopefully with costs awarded against them. That might be enough of a kick for them to solve the problem.

 

[talltim]

That got escalated to an email higher up, with an email within hours, a phone call from the retentions team and - miraculously - them finding the recording all of a sudden (despite the claim before, when it suited them, to say that not all calls were recorded and mine was one of them).

Did they record the call where they said your call wasn't recorded?

 

[jon0844]

Twitter is a powerful tool to fight this, as is Tripadvisor etc, and long may they last.

I do agree, although there is a problem where people make things up to harm a company, or simply write things that they don't understand. This is very much true for companies where rivals have incentives to post unfounded complaints.

Of late, there are many complaints against TOCs because of late running and delays due to rail adhesion problems, where people simply don't accept or understand the very real problem.

As such, they are particularly nasty and scathing when the issue really is outside of the control of the train operator.

 

[jon0844]

It probably goes in the Victoria Gateline/GatEx priority pile...

I've seen where they end up.

 

[talltim]

I do agree, although there is a problem where people make things up to harm a company, or simply write things that they don't understand. This is very much true for companies where rivals have incentives to post unfounded complaints.

Of late, there are many complaints against TOCs because of late running and delays due to rail adhesion problems, where people simply don't accept or understand the very real problem.

As such, they are particularly nasty and scathing when the issue really is outside of the control of the train operator.

To a certain extent TOCs should be putting pressure on their suppliers to provide a leaf free rail head. It's not all within NR's control, but any leaves from trees on their property are. The customer isn't making a contract with NR, and the TOC's supply chain problems shouldn't really be their problem.

 

[AlterEgo]

What is needed is for some people who have the time and money to let GTR attempt a few prosecutions and have them laughed out of Court, hopefully with costs awarded against them. That might be enough of a kick for them to solve the problem.

Going to the media might be more fruitful and prompt quicker change. GTR are already very much on the PR back foot thanks to their dire handling of the industrial dispute.

 

[jon0844]

Did they record the call where they said your call wasn't recorded?

Haha, good question.

I suspect the call centre (in Mumbai) didn't have a way of getting the recording without escalation, and they weren't interested and just wanted rid of me.

I discovered from speaking to the UK retentions team that the initial level customer services team are extremely limited in their powers, even hinting that when they were given power to issue refunds/discounts and other goodwill gestures, it was being abused.

So now I'd realise that anything billing related is not likely to be resolved by going through the 'correct' channels.

That's totally and utterly wrong, and would explain why people get so upset and eventually won't even try to do things the right way in the first place.

I now have the correct bill, which has an ongoing discount applied, but this isn't ideal because if I wish to change plan - I fear the online system I can use to change plans myself will quite possibly knock off the discount, so I'd be back on the phone. As such, I'm sticking with my current plan until such time that I leave, which I am more likely to do as I am too scared to risk rocking the boat.
--- old post above --- --- new post below ---

Thanks for all your replies. I sent off an email to customer services on Friday evening so hopefully i will get a reply soon (although it will probably take about a month). I am expecting that i will probably just get their usual copy and paste response. It would definitely be nice to also get some compensation for all of my wasted time but i doubt they will do that.

Whenever i use a "Gatwick Express" branded train to or from London Victoria P13 and P14 i always check if the side gate near P15 to P19 or the side gate near P9 to P12 are left open as it saves a lot of hassle. Unfortunately on this occasion they were shut.

From looking online and on Twitter etc so many people do indeed seem to have problems at P13 and P14. It seems like the only tickets they want to accept are.

Any Permitted Single from Gatwick Airport to London Victoria
Any Permitted Return from Gatwick Airport to London Victoria
Any Permitted Single from London Victoria to Gatwick Airport
Any Permitted Return from London Victoria to Gatwick Airport

They dont seem to like to accept any other tickets (even if they are fully valid). I will certainly be very careful when using these platforms in the future to ensure that my tickets dont get ripped up again

Good luck. I wonder how many standardised responses you'll get along the lines of 'we take x seriously' and 'we invest £n in'?

On my one incident at the same gates, they had closed the bulk of gates (short staffed) and had the main one open for manual checking. The Oyster reader wasn't working properly and everyone was getting errors, but being waved through to keep the flow going.

I had to wonder how that was going to work out for people who didn't touch out properly - as instructed.

 

[rs101]

To a certain extent TOCs should be putting pressure on their suppliers to provide a leaf free rail head. It's not all within NR's control, but any leaves from trees on their property are. The customer isn't making a contract with NR, and the TOC's supply chain problems shouldn't really be their problem.

Indeed. It's no different to the situation with non-Virgin broadband services. 99% of the alternatives rely on BT Openreach to fix any problems, but the correct complaint procedure is via the ISP you actually have a contract with. It's up to them to pressure their suppliers to provide a decent service.

 

[Tackleberry]

It's not very often that I call for someone to be dismissed, but in this case I shall make an exception!

How charming!!!
Having been dismissed because of a bus passenger "complaint" I can tell it's not nice...

 

[jumble]

Haha, good question.

I suspect the call centre (in Mumbai) didn't have a way of getting the recording without escalation, and they weren't interested and just wanted rid of me.

I discovered from speaking to the UK retentions team that the initial level customer services team are extremely limited in their powers, even hinting that when they were given power to issue refunds/discounts and other goodwill gestures, it was being abused.

So now I'd realise that anything billing related is not likely to be resolved by going through the 'correct' channels.

That's totally and utterly wrong, and would explain why people get so upset and eventually won't even try to do things the right way in the first place.

I have to say that I have had great success complaining to CEOs in various companies .

I have a few rules
I make a single complaint to customer services and wait for their response before escalating
I do not waste the time of the CEO on first world problems or if it is out of the companies control
I keep it short and sweet and make it easy to resolve
I believe that mostly even if a complaint is passed back down by someone in executive office the person resolving will try a bit harder to reach a satisfactory outcome on the second occasion as they now have to answer to the CEO and not just me.



A few recent examples
Our postcode mismatches the addess on some databases and is imported wrongly if the web programmers have not done their job properly

Issue with Childs discounted travel pass
Sent to wrong address and then Customer services dont want to pay for interim travel ( having told me they would!)
They also suggested that I must have given them my address in the wrong form
Emailed CEO and issue sorted quickly

Had an issue with VTEC Member over changing an advance ticket

Promised a credit but when I chased it up No one had ever heard of "Ryan " who had done nothing
On this occasion it was escalated back to CS and someone from Atos sorted a refund

VTEC still have not fixed the Issue on their website
Maybe time to contact the CEO's office !
---------------------------------------------------------------------------
Old version
I want to travel on a different date/time
You can make changes to the date or time of your Advance ticket on this website up to two hours before your original departure time, in My Account.

You can change to another Advance ticket of equal or greater value or to another ticket type. You’ll need to pay any difference in ticket cost, and a £10 charge per ticket changed.
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
New Version
Switching your Advance ticket to one of equal or greater value, or to another ticket type, is nice and straightforward. But there is a rail industry standard £10 charge per ticket and you do need to pay any difference in ticket cost. Also note that you will not be refunded the difference if the new ticket is cheaper.
----------------------------------------------------------------------------------

Can anyone work out what is wrong with the above that caused our family to lose the value of an advance ?

Reagrds Jumble

 

[Bletchleyite]

There are other issues on the VTWC website, such as their continuing denial that the correct way to alter the route of a non-TOC-specific walk-up ticket is a change of route excess, not a refund (against admin fee) and reissue.

 

[yorkie]

Then something quite strange happened. I was preparing myself for the questioning and, as I realised most of the others with ticketing issues seemed to be tourists, I jumped in first and asked what the problem was - I was told ticket was not valid and, quite surprisingly, "this time only"/directed through the gate. I asked why not valid and was told to "go". At no time was eye contact made with me. .

Yep, seen that sort of thing for myself. I have sometimes stood with the people who are being delayed, waiting to be talked down to by the staff. I have listened, and offered to help people who held valid tickets. This made the staff very, VERY angry.

They probably told you to "go" because they were concerned that you may stick up for unsuspecting tourists who were going to be asked to pay one of their ludicrous "supplements".

They prey on people who are passive and do NOT like it one bit when people are assertive.

Oh, and they lie a lot, in a way that is absolutely staggering, and they're also good at making false allegations.

It's a major culture problem and I've not seen anything like it anywhere else (except, to a lesser degree, at St Pancras Southeastern high speed in the first year or so of operation)

If anyone has not seen it for yourself, it's hard to believe the scale of the problem.

If any journalists are reading this, please feel free to contact me, as this could be a big news story.

 

[matt_world2004]

Some of the CSA's at Gatwick Airport Rail station are tfl staff to help mitigate the crowding for underground tickets at Victoria. that means customers are being advised to buy outboundary travelcards by tfl and then getting told they are wrong by Gat Ex.


https://www.whatdotheyknow.com/requ...sts&utm_medium=link&utm_source=whatdotheyknow

 

[jon0844]

I wonder if there's special training for people who wish to work at the GatEx barriers or the SET platforms at St Pancras (or indeed, Stratford International)?

Sort of like a higher level of training, where people are welcomed to a special club and then told to forget everything they've been taught so far and to listen very carefully...

 

[jacksonbang]

I wonder if there's special training for people who wish to work at the GatEx barriers or the SET platforms at St Pancras (or indeed, Stratford International)?

.

I've never had an issue with ending or breaking at Stratford, the staff appear to be friendly and helpful.The St Pancras International Southeastern bloc makes me feel like I am either trying to gain access to some exclusive club or cross a national border. However, at least they haven't lied to me that "Not Gatwick Express" tickets also mean not HS1.

 

[jon0844]

Perhaps the people at St Pancras SET platforms look over at Eurostar and want to feel like they're part of the whole international, 'jetset', lifestyle. Maybe they'll ask people for passports next? Or when you arrive, they'll ask where you've been and what is in your bag?

The big problem for me is that my tickets are often not accepted, which means queuing up at the manned wide gate which usually lets people in and out, and so it can mean potentially missing a train leaving StP or getting out of the station late and missing an (admittedly tight) connection.

I know I could never claim for missing a connection just 5-6 minutes after arriving at St Pancras and crossing over to King's Cross, but if you can exit without fuss then there's no other reason you can't make it.

 

[jacksonbang]

It does make me laugh that trying to leave at St. Pancras Southeastern High Speed or Victoria Gatwick Express gates may be the slowest barrier exits on the network.

 

[jon0844]

It does make me laugh that trying to leave at St. Pancras Southeastern High Speed or Victoria Gatwick Express gates may be the slowest barrier exits on the network.

Maybe enough to eradicate any little saving (when there actually is one) by using GatEx over a normal Southern service to Victoria.

 

[swt class 450]

I saw the same man working at the P13 and P14 ticket barriers yesterday. The look on his face when he saw me approaching the barriers was hilarious. He definitely remembered me. I said to him as i walked past "i hope you havent ripped up any valid tickets today".

 

[jon0844]

I saw the same man working at the P13 and P14 ticket barriers yesterday. The look on his face when he saw me approaching the barriers was hilarious. He definitely remembered me. I said to him as i walked past "i hope you havent ripped up any valid tickets today".

Be a bit careful if this person might decide to do anything else silly to try and get back at you.

When I once got a totally invalid PF from someone who I, politely, argued with when saying it was invalid throughout - I said that when I won my appeal, I'd ask for an apology.

And sure enough, when I won, I asked him for an apology. He refused and then later would go on to hold me for 3-4 hours trying to prosecute me for combining two season tickets.

So, maybe just smiling at him is all you need to do to avoid him trying to set you up in some way, or simply harass you by getting BTP on you for some made up accusation.

 

[yorkie]

Be a bit careful if this person might decide to do anything else silly to try and get back at you.

When I once got a totally invalid PF from someone who I, politely, argued with when saying it was invalid throughout - I said that when I won my appeal, I'd ask for an apology.

And sure enough, when I won, I asked him for an apology. He refused and then later would go on to hold me for 3-4 hours trying to prosecute me for combining two season tickets.

So, maybe just smiling at him is all you need to do to avoid him trying to set you up in some way, or simply harass you by getting BTP on you for some made up accusation.

i was thinking the same thing!

There were a few days when I was using the service regularly and some of them started recognising me as someone who advised people of the company's cheapest/quickest trains/fares and they started making stuff up and threatening me.

And, as I said before, BTP may well believe their lies, and they have a lot of power. So be careful!

 

[swt class 450]

I try not to really worry too much about what these people will try to do. There was another member of staff quite a few months ago who would always lie to passengers (especially foreign tourists) about tickets and about three or four times i told the tourists that what he said wasnt true. He certainly wasnt happy with me! Someone has to remind these incompetent people of the basic ticketing rules! But i will be careful.

 

[sarahj]

Perhaps in the end, it all evens out. Today, when checking tickets on my 8.35 GTW to Vic stopper, i saw so many any permitted tickets to vic, plus a gatex ticket that had been bought on a plane, and a few gatex tickets that they sell at the exchange buro's and other places round gatwick (they are square and red and say Gatwick Express on them), but here they were on my stopper, journey time Gtw to Vic 50 mins.

Note: also a LOT of agency staff around these days. Hearing some advice, I cringe.:roll:

 

[infobleep]

Perhaps in the end, it all evens out. Today, when checking tickets on my 8.35 GTW to Vic stopper, i saw so many any permitted tickets to vic, plus a gatex ticket that had been bought on a plane, and a few gatex tickets that they sell at the exchange buro's and other places round gatwick (they are square and red and say Gatwick Express on them), but here they were on my stopper, journey time Gtw to Vic 50 mins.

Note: also a LOT of agency staff around these days. Hearing some advice, I cringe.:roll:

Are Gatwick Express tickets permitted on Southern services or is it just that the tickets have on a Gatwick Express Barnsley stock, rather than being valid solely valid on Gatwick Express.

Sent from my SM-G925F using Tapatalk

 

[sarahj]

Are Gatwick Express tickets permitted on Southern services or is it just that the tickets have on a Gatwick Express Barnsley stock, rather than being valid solely valid on Gatwick Express.

Sent from my SM-G925F using Tapatalk

Many moons ago when Gatex was a separate co, we had to do gatwick exchanges, ie swap the ticket for a Southern one. there was no extra cost, or refund for the punter, it was purely an admin thing. But these days, we accept anything, as long as it's valid for the route. the only ones we are supposed to reject are TL only tickets. On that issue I'm saying nothing. So, at the most I might say, 'you should have caught the express', but mainly it's just 'thanks' or 'cheers'.