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Thameslink/ Class 700 Progress

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spark001uk

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Tonight was a joke. 700106 had ALL 5 toilets locked out of use, many grumpy passengers onboard!
If you were on that Tuesday night, I was on that unit the day after you - Wednesday afternoon - and even then 4 out of the 5 were OOU, I tweeted TL and they said sorry and their explanation was that the place it was berthed at had busted water pipes which they were waiting to have fixed!
 
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K.o.R

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It bugs me slightly that the Thameslink units have light blue doors, when that is the colour of Great Northern. TL's colour is pink.
 

MikePJ

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Not sure if I'm late to the party on this, but the Brighton-Cambridge "preview" Thameslink service appears now to run twice daily in each direction, using two sets. There's an 1124 service from Cambridge, arr Brighton 1342, while a Brighton service starts at 1132, arriving Cambridge at 1414. The return services are 1432 from Brighton and 1424 from Cambridge.
 

physics34

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It bugs me slightly that the Thameslink units have light blue doors, when that is the colour of Great Northern. TL's colour is pink.

The livery doesnt make sense. Its still the wrong shade of blue compared to the 365s too. The 387s with green doors annoy me aswell. Some blue vinyl will basically be good enough to solve that issue.
 

dorsetdesiro

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Perhaps Thameslink & GN both share the same livery with the only differences are the logos?

As Thameslink is expanding rapidly, now going into Southern territory such as Littlehampton and further north into Cambridgeshire, that class 700s seem to be taking over the GN routes as well so it may be possible the GN brand may one day be phased out in favour of Thameslink?

This has got me thinking, the gov merged TL, GN and Southern into a new single franchise that they may have planned for this to become a single larger Thameslink franchise and killing off the Southern & GN brands?

GN seems to be a quite small franchise, if both TL and GN share the same trains and livery then it is possible this will be all Thameslink once the expansion programme is completed and the GN routes to and from Kings Cross & Moorgate could be rebranded as Thameslink.

If GN & TL are set to merge, then Southern & GX would be spared as the gov is said to be splitting up the TSGN franchise otherwise Southern could get rebranded as Thameslink south of London and northwards to Milton Keynes.
 

AM9

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Perhaps Thameslink & GN both share the same livery with the only differences are the logos?

As Thameslink is expanding rapidly, now going into Southern territory such as Littlehampton and further north into Cambridgeshire, that class 700s seem to be taking over the GN routes as well so it may be possible the GN brand may one day be phased out in favour of Thameslink?

This has got me thinking, the gov merged TL, GN and Southern into a new single franchise that they may have planned for this to become a single larger Thameslink franchise and killing off the Southern & GN brands?

GN seems to be a quite small franchise, if both TL and GN share the same trains and livery then it is possible this will be all Thameslink once the expansion programme is completed and the GN routes to and from Kings Cross & Moorgate could be rebranded as Thameslink.

If GN & TL are set to merge, then Southern & GX would be spared as the gov is said to be splitting up the TSGN franchise otherwise Southern could get rebranded as Thameslink south of London and northwards to Milton Keynes.

TL and GN are just GTR brands. GTR is the TOC. Since GTR won the TSGN superfranchise, services that run through the core have been branded 'Thameslink'*. Thameslink is also the official name for that route, (ignoring the daft claiming of it by GTR as ThamesLink). As the outer suburban services from the Cambridge and ECML are integrated into the existing Thameslink core service, it is sensible for them to assume the Thameslink brand as well.*
The colour scheme of the Thamelink class700s is white/grey with blue doors whether the trains go through the canal tunnels of up through Dock Junction. It seems probable that the GN brand will be irrelevant once the full TL timetable is in operation. The few class365s will spend their last days providing a few peak hour services whilst there is capacity at Kings Cross. The colour of their doors is irrelevant. The other brands of GTR, Southeren and Gatwick Express may well survive if and when the DfT decides to let them separately to Thamelink, although they might be mixed-up with some restructuring of SE and even the Downs Line IMO.
* Just as support services into London Bridge are also branded Thameslink, it would seem logical to include the ex-GN routes as well. Of course it is always possible that the Moorgate services end up TfL controlled. Note, The Thameslink route has always had that name since it was created, along with West Hampstead Thameslink and City Thameslink stations. First Capital Connect temporarily changed its name but the officieal Thameslink name was still used.
 
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MML

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Travelled on 3 x 700's recently where the PIS has been the new version and the audio of 'we'll sort it' appears crackled and broken. If someone has sabotaged it, well done that man. Either that or the ceiling speakers are on the way out.
 

GW43125

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Are the 1Wxx/2Wxx (well, 1Txx or 2Txx via the Bridge) running via London Bridge on Saturdays yet?
 

FlippyFF

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Travelled on 3 x 700's recently where the PIS has been the new version and the audio of 'we'll sort it' appears crackled and broken. If someone has sabotaged it, well done that man. Either that or the ceiling speakers are on the way out.

I've travelled on quite a few with the new PIS software that havent been able to display the route / destination - showing 'Check station screeens' on the outside and 'Please lusten to announcements' on the inside instead so hardly an improvement.

Simon
 

MML

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Is the loud and frequent banging noise which sounds like a cupboard door slamming an intentional feature ? It seems to be coming from the pantograph throughout the journey. Forsprung durch tecknik as the say in Germany
 

Bald Rick

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Is the loud and frequent banging noise which sounds like a cupboard door slamming an intentional feature ? It seems to be coming from the pantograph throughout the journey. Forsprung durch tecknik as the say in Germany

It’s the main circuit breaker opening when the train passes through OLE neutral sections. It’s a feature common to all Trains that run off the AC.
 

AM9

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Travelled on 3 x 700's recently where the PIS has been the new version and the audio of 'we'll sort it' appears crackled and broken. If someone has sabotaged it, well done that man. Either that or the ceiling speakers are on the way out.

Do you really approve of sabotage?

I've travelled on quite a few with the new PIS software that havent been able to display the route / destination - showing 'Check station screeens' on the outside and 'Please lusten to announcements' on the inside instead so hardly an improvement.

Simon

So there were spelling mistakes on the PIS?

Is the loud and frequent banging noise which sounds like a cupboard door slamming an intentional feature ? It seems to be coming from the pantograph throughout the journey. Forsprung durch tecknik as the say in Germany

I have done many journeys on the '700s (quite a few of them in the PTSO's) and not heard any untoward 'frequent banging noise which sounds like a cupboard door slamming'. Of course the VCB's (Vacuum Circuit Breakers) operate when passing through the neutral sections as with all OLE powered stock but the Desiros, both UK and City types have VCBs that are almost silent compared with the Electrostars - (good old 'British quality engineering').
 

physics34

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Do you really approve of sabotage?



So there were spelling mistakes on the PIS?



I have done many journeys on the '700s (quite a few of them in the PTSO's) and not heard any untoward 'frequent banging noise which sounds like a cupboard door slamming'. Of course the VCB's (Vacuum Circuit Breakers) operate when passing through the neutral sections as with all OLE powered stock but the Desiros, both UK and City types have VCBs that are almost silent compared with the Electrostars - (good old 'British quality engineering').

I have noticed it in the rear first class. Sounds like something falling over!
 

theironroad

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Do you really approve of sabotage?



So there were spelling mistakes on the PIS?



I have done many journeys on the '700s (quite a few of them in the PTSO's) and not heard any untoward 'frequent banging noise which sounds like a cupboard door slamming'. Of course the VCB's (Vacuum Circuit Breakers) operate when passing through the neutral sections as with all OLE powered stock but the Desiros, both UK and City types have VCBs that are almost silent compared with the Electrostars - (good old 'British quality engineering').

The banging noise is pretty evident and loud on the desiros that work out of Liverpool Street
 

K.o.R

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Perhaps Thameslink & GN both share the same livery with the only differences are the logos?

Before the "T-slash" logo, Thameslink and Great Northern's logos were literally identical, but with the little blue triangle of GN replaced with a pink triangle on TL.
 

Billy A

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Is the loud and frequent banging noise which sounds like a cupboard door slamming an intentional feature ? It seems to be coming from the pantograph throughout the journey. Forsprung durch tecknik as the say in Germany

Or even "vorsprung durch technik"!
 

swt_passenger

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* Just as support services into London Bridge are also branded Thameslink, it would seem logical to include the ex-GN routes as well.
That's purely temporary, as is running some future Thameslink services into Kings Cross. Eventually there will be no timetabled Thameslink trains in the London Bridge bays, or at Kings Cross, outside perturbations or possibly engineering work.

Moreover, DfT have mentioned somewhere that they intend to split GTR back into its constituent parts, so it is just as likely that a separate GN mini franchise will re-appear in a few years.
 

dorsetdesiro

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Before the inclusion of Southern & GX, it was just the Thameslink & GN franchise then I predict this happening : a separate South Central & GX franchise resurrected and an enlarged Thameslink franchise absorbing the GN routes also seeing the GN brand axed in favour for Thameslink.

The GN logo seems temporary to me which Southern & Thameslink already have their own. When GTR started up, the "triangle" logos were introduced for TL and GN and I believe there was a green triangle made for Southern which never got adopted in the end. The Southern roundel was kept and the shade of green became lighter.

It was decided it was best for Southern & TL's brands to remain distinctive, then the TL dash logo was brought in however nothing at all for GN. As GN is a really small franchise, it seems like an afterthought which they could have had their own brand which the triangle logo was not designed specifically for GN but part of a unifying scheme for GTR which this seems to be abandoned.

The new 700s running on GN routes, as well as the incoming 717s, have the same livery so it is quite possible this will eventually be all Thameslink as the GN triangle logos can be easily swapped for TL dash ones.
 

D365

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Thameslink = anything operated by Class 700
Southern, GX, Great Northern = anything not operated by Class 700

Simple enough?
 

samuelmorris

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I've travelled on quite a few with the new PIS software that havent been able to display the route / destination - showing 'Check station screeens' on the outside and 'Please lusten to announcements' on the inside instead so hardly an improvement.

Simon
Only ridden one 700 with the update so far and yes that was happening there too, horrid noise pollution tought admittedly not as bad as the screaming on 345s :D
 

aleggatta

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It's the oft-discussed "someone dropping a tennis ball on the roof" sound and AFAIK we have never got to the bottom of it.
from knowledge of general air handling plant and other types of train HVAC, I would guestimate that it is a finely balanced air damper, which is so finely balanced allowances might not have been made for the start-stop forces of the train acting on it, the fact that it is only in the DMOS's suggests to me that it is a damper linked with the cab HVAC system, whether it is a seperate unit or just syphoned off from the main HVAC I do not know.
 

AM9

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from knowledge of general air handling plant and other types of train HVAC, I would guestimate that it is a finely balanced air damper, which is so finely balanced allowances might not have been made for the start-stop forces of the train acting on it, the fact that it is only in the DMOS's suggests to me that it is a damper linked with the cab HVAC system, whether it is a seperate unit or just syphoned off from the main HVAC I do not know.

... exept that there isn't a pantograph on the DMOS and MML said "It seems to be coming from the pantograph throughout the journey" which means that he would need to be at that end of the PTSO, i.e. at least 20m from any part of the DMOS.
 

aleggatta

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... exept that there isn't a pantograph on the DMOS and MML said "It seems to be coming from the pantograph throughout the journey" which means that he would need to be at that end of the PTSO, i.e. at least 20m from any part of the DMOS.
maybe should have multi-quote that one! I think there might be confusion between two differing sounds, but I was talking about the thumping in the rear first class as mentioned in this:
I have noticed it in the rear first class. Sounds like something falling over!
 

Skimpot flyer

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So GTR have all these extra 700s available now, with at leat 8 carriages, and yet the first down train to call at Finsbury Park after the midweek football ends, and fans start arriving there, the 22:04 from Kings Cross, is still formed of a 4-car Class 387.
Are GTR not able to realise this is woefully insufficient?
 
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Bald Rick

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So GTR have all these extra 700s available now, with at leat 8 carriages, and yet the first down train to call at Finsbury Park after the midweek football ends, and fans start arriving there, the 22:04 from Kings Cross, is still formed of a 4-car Class 387.
Are GTR not able to realise this is woefully insufficient?

I think they’d assumed that on Arsenal’s current form the rush would have happened about half an hour before the end. Plenty of 8 cars out then.
 
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