5x Class 153 conversion to bike and baggage vans for Scotrail

[61653 HTAFC]

And in this day and age are people really going to be happy leaving luggage unattended?

If someone sneaks off the train with your suitcase at Corrour, where will they go?

Though I'm being a bit facetious, my point is that I'd not expect the West Highland to be a baggage-theft hotspot.

Then again, I got caught in a crush boarding a Eurostar the other day because some woman insisted on locking her case to the rack with a heavy-duty cable bike lock... as if someone will pay for Eurostar even at the cheapest price, just so they can go robbing!

 

[hexagon789]

It is - for instance Fort Bill and Kyle both still have (relatively new) traditional left luggage lockers - not many of those left in the UK!

I think Thurso still has a set as well. A contender for the UK's most northerly left luggage lockers perhaps?

 

[Altnabreac]

I think Thurso still has a set as well. A contender for the UK's most northerly left luggage lockers perhaps?

https://www.lerwick-harbour.co.uk/ferries

 

[hexagon789]

https://www.lerwick-harbour.co.uk/ferries

My fault for not being specific enough - I meant in railway stations.

 

[Altnabreac]

My fault for not being specific enough - I meant in railway stations.

Well I think nominating the UK's most northerly railway station as being possibly the UK's most northerly railway station with a left luggage locker is a reasonably safe bet...

 

[43096]

Bit more detail on these in the current Modern Railways: plan is for two to be in service next summer on the West Highland, with three more conversions to follow. Eventual deployment stated as 2 x West Highland, 1 x Far North, 1 x Kyle, 1 x maintenance spare. So clearly they are not intended to be inserted into the middle of existing sets. Internal spec yet to be finalised.

 

[Bletchleyite]

Bit more detail on these in the current Modern Railways: plan is for two to be in service next summer on the West Highland, with three more conversions to follow. Eventual deployment stated as 2 x West Highland, 1 x Far North, 1 x Kyle, 1 x maintenance spare.

I don't believe anything in the above...

So clearly they are not intended to be inserted into the middle of existing sets.

...suggests that. (Class 15x have BSI couplers internally, so adding it and removing it in the middle is an easy depot job)

 

[43096]

I don't believe anything in the above...



...suggests that. (Class 15x have BSI couplers internally, so adding it and removing it in the middle is an easy depot job)

There's a raft of reasons why it is unlikely:
1. It's not as easy as you might think, as it needs adapter plates for insertion in the Class 158s on the Far North and Kyle of Minogue lines (and West Highland if the planned changeover happens). Not a five minute job.
2. It means sets with the 153 car inserted are then restricted to particular diagrams, which restricts fleet flexibility.
3. There is an ownership issue with inserting 153s into ScR 158s, as the 153s are Angel owned and 158s are Porterbrook owned.
4. If they are re-forming sets, why is a spare vehicle needed? Don't they really need spare (complete) sets?

 

[Bletchleyite]

So how do you think they will be used - coupled on the end? (No doubt with the #2 cab outwards )

 

[43096]

So how do you think they will be used - coupled on the end? (No doubt with the #2 cab outwards )

That's the way I'm reading it. Apparently some drivers prefer the #2 cab!

 

[Bletchleyite]

That's the way I'm reading it. Apparently some drivers prefer the #2 cab!

Yes, allegedly it actually has more legroom!

 

[hexagon789]

Well I think nominating the UK's most northerly railway station as being possibly the UK's most northerly railway station with a left luggage locker is a reasonably safe bet...

Well - only if it has them!

 

[HLE]

Just attach it on the end and use one of the driving cabs. Easier all round

 

[hexagon789]

I was under the impression the 153s were getting put in the middle of 156 sets?

 

[InOban]

That would be impossible, because if you consider the services in which they will operate they will need to be joined and separated every day.

One will need to be attached to the 10.37 ex QS, returning as the 14.41 ex Oban. It will then have to be detached as that 156 firms part of the 18.21 to both Oban and FW. The other will be added to the 08.57 ex Oban, detached at QS and then reattached to the 156 off the 15.30 arrival to form the 16.37.

 

[GusB]

I was under the impression the 153s were getting put in the middle of 156 sets?

I was under this impression too.

That would be impossible, because if you consider the services in which they will operate they will need to be joined and separated every day.

One will need to be attached to the 10.37 ex QS, returning as the 14.41 ex Oban. It will then have to be detached as that 156 firms part of the 18.21 to both Oban and FW. The other will be added to the 08.57 ex Oban, detached at QS and then reattached to the 156 off the 15.30 arrival to form the 16.37.

Is there any reason why the 18.21 can't run as a five-car set? I'm not overly familiar with the West Highland - would platform lengths be a problem?

 

[hexagon789]

I was under this impression too.

Not just me then.

Is there any reason why the 18.21 can't run as a five-car set? I'm not overly familiar with the West Highland - would platform lengths be a problem?

Think some are six-car lengths max and usually the combined Oban/Mallaig trains are six coaches.

 

[dubscottie]

The 158s have bar couplers between cars now so not a quick job to stick a 153 in the middle.

https://www.flickr.com/photos/42318062@N07/28728465167/

(Pic not mine)

 

[JModulo]

The 158s have bar couplers between cars now so not a quick job to stick a 153 in the middle.

https://www.flickr.com/photos/42318062@N07/28728465167/

(Pic not mine)

As have quite alot of the 156s too.

 

[LOL The Irony]

As have quite alot of the 156s too.

The BSI was ripped out?

 

[JModulo]

The BSI was ripped out?

Yes. Bolted together. Not all of them though, yet.

 

[InOban]

Not just me then.



Think some are six-car lengths max and usually the combined Oban/Mallaig trains are six coaches.

That's the point. They can't run as a 7 car set. So the 153 can only be added to trains which only run to oban, and are only two coaches. I'm hearing that they they starting to plan a new timetable from summer 2020.

 

[GrimShady]

That's the point. They can't run as a 7 car set. So the 153 can only be added to trains which only run to oban, and are only two coaches. I'm hearing that they they starting to plan a new timetable from summer 2020.

My guess is they will seperate the trains again.

 

[43096]

The BSI was ripped out?

Yes. It is becoming an increasingly common mod, as there are savings to be had through reduced coupler maintenance.

 

[hexagon789]

That's the point. They can't run as a 7 car set. So the 153 can only be added to trains which only run to oban, and are only two coaches. I'm hearing that they they starting to plan a new timetable from summer 2020.

I appreciate that 7-car is awkward/difficult/impossible to run, but again I was sure I had read that was the plan, just as I had read about them being fitted with some seats.

Certainly, operationally retaining separability is more flexible and probably more sensible at that.

 

[scotraildriver]

That would be impossible, because if you consider the services in which they will operate they will need to be joined and separated every day.

One will need to be attached to the 10.37 ex QS, returning as the 14.41 ex Oban. It will then have to be detached as that 156 firms part of the 18.21 to both Oban and FW. The other will be added to the 08.57 ex Oban, detached at QS and then reattached to the 156 off the 15.30 arrival to form the 16.37.

That set doesn't return on the 18.21 it works the 17.56 to Anniesland then other local work so could easily run as a 3 car. Anyway there is a plan to run the trains separately but is still being formulated and the unit diagrams would just be changed to suit anyway.

 

[InOban]

That's a quick turnaround. Doesn't arrive until 17.47. I understand that after December the WHL and Anniesland fleet (the only 156 diagrams left in QS) will continue to interwork.

 

[scotraildriver]

That's a quick turnaround. Doesn't arrive until 17.47. I understand that after December the WHL and Anniesland fleet (the only 156 diagrams left in QS) will continue to interwork.

It's not ideal. The 17.57 gets cancelled quite regularly.

 

[HLE]

I cannot understand the logic of ‘inserting’ the 153 into the middle of a 156. If the dogbox fails, the whole unit is then a failure, whereas if it’s bolted on at one end it’s simply uncoupled and the service can still run as a 156 or a 153.

Any advantage doing this over coupling it on the end?

 

[JModulo]

I cannot understand the logic of ‘inserting’ the 153 into the middle of a 156. If the dogbox fails, the whole unit is then a failure, whereas if it’s bolted on at one end it’s simply uncoupled and the service can still run as a 156 or a 153.

Any advantage doing this over coupling it on the end?

You won't be able to do this soon anyway as the couplers have been removed from the 156s. Only way would be to bolt them in which is more hassle than its worth.