Interesting to see where the 458s goSame here, but they're on the way...
Obviously given they are some of the oldest post privatisation stock they are more comfortable
Many things are worsening as the years pass!
Interesting to see where the 458s goSame here, but they're on the way...
Two wrongs don’t make a right. Just because one service gets a downgrade doesn’t mean it’s OK to do likewise everywhere. The continual drip drip drip of decreased service and comfort makes the railway less and less attractive and the car ever more the go to choice.I don’t think you’ve got it that bad really when you consider the people of Maidenhead etc are also being downgraded to Aventras but from the rather nice 387s with tables and armrests
The cab design has been an issue for a while, it's probably about a year since ASLEF first raised issues with the design. I understood that it had been redesigned to address ASLEF's concerns, but it sounds like there may have been further developments since. It's not just that the cab was cramped, but also had a very poor layout of the controls.Whatever the rights and wrongs of the situation, it's crazy for this to become a Union issue when the trains are on the verge of introduction.
It'll be even worse in the WMT ones then, because they've got the same basic cab design with a gangway grafted onThe cab design has been an issue for a while, it's probably about a year since ASLEF first raised issues with the design. I understood that it had been redesigned to address ASLEF's concerns, but it sounds like there may have been further developments since. It's not just that the cab was cramped, but also had a very poor layout of the controls.
Two wrongs don’t make a right. Just because one service gets a downgrade doesn’t mean it’s OK to do likewise everywhere. The continual drip drip drip of decreased service and comfort makes the railway less and less attractive and the car ever more the go to choice.
The Aventras are a big upgrade from the 165/166s that Maidenhead commuters had to put up with until very recently.
The order was placed very quickly upon winning the franchise, with an equally quick delivery schedule so I imagine the design was locked down early with no prospect of change. Ironing boards for us!Why aren't they getting the same seats as greater anglia given the backlash to ironing board seats?
Or will they be the 'improved ' version as seen in scotrail and northern ?
Would Greater Anglia Aventras be more expensive then ?The order was placed very quickly upon winning the franchise, with an equally quick delivery schedule so I imagine the design was locked down early with no prospect of change. Ironing boards for us!
GA conducted a lengthy consultation with stakeholders and passengers on the interior design. SWR didn't..Would Greater Anglia Aventras be more expensive then ?
Seems weird they could specify better seats than everyone else
Will LNWR Aventras have them ?
Would Greater Anglia Aventras be more expensive then ?
Seems weird they could specify better seats than everyone else
Southeastern 376a have an early form of ironing boards I've not tried
They are more comfortable than the 700s (and what the 701s will have) seats because theres generous spacing between the seats and between the window seat and the wall. They're also softer I find. They do look a bit odd but I would've preferred those.
Definitely a matter of opinion. Personally I find classic Fainsa “ironing boards” such as on 387/700 far more comfortable than the awful 376s, especially due to that freakish hard plastic bit in the head bit on the 376 seats.They are more comfortable than the 700s (and what the 701s will have) seats because theres generous spacing between the seats and between the window seat and the wall. They're also softer I find. They do look a bit odd but I would've preferred those.
Either way, at least services out of Waterloo aren't operated by TFL (yet) because longitudinal seating on aventuras really is another level of discomfort. They're worse than 700s in terms of you can't even call the seats 'firm', they're simply granite that TFL put a nice looking pattern over, but I guess they do have some spacing because of armrests so it becomes a matter of preference.
Shame SWR really aren't bothered about making things better for their passengers like Greater Anglia SEEM to be.
I quite like the ones in the GWR and Southern Electrostars - with armrests and good spacing they are better than a certain other type of seat. Indeed, overall, the GWR Electrostar interior is markedly better than the Class 800 interior - what's that, a suburban EMU better than an allegedly InterCity train?
Recently making numerous trips from a 345 then on a 700 changing at Farringdon, it does change your perspective. If I stand on the tube and don't have the softer S7/S8 seats as a point of reference, the seating on the 700 does genuinely feel soft versus that on the 345. Even the transverse seats.They are more comfortable than the 700s (and what the 701s will have) seats because theres generous spacing between the seats and between the window seat and the wall. They're also softer I find. They do look a bit odd but I would've preferred those.
Either way, at least services out of Waterloo aren't operated by TFL (yet) because longitudinal seating on aventuras really is another level of discomfort. They're worse than 700s in terms of you can't even call the seats 'firm', they're simply granite that TFL put a nice looking pattern over, but I guess they do have some spacing because of armrests so it becomes a matter of preference.
Shame SWR really aren't bothered about making things better for their passengers like Greater Anglia SEEM to be.
... Either way, at least services out of Waterloo aren't operated by TFL (yet) because longitudinal seating on aventuras really is another level of discomfort. They're worse than 700s in terms of you can't even call the seats 'firm', they're simply granite that TFL put a nice looking pattern over, but I guess they do have some spacing because of armrests so it becomes a matter of preference...
It’s not really surprising: WorstGroup have never given an f-in-circle about their customers.GA conducted a lengthy consultation with stakeholders and passengers on the interior design. SWR didn't..
Agreed. I really do like GWRs electorstars. I think the interior colour scheme is one of my if not my favourite train interior scheme. When Fainsa's are spaced out with armrests with adequate legroom too, you don't really notice the fact that they're firm since they're still comfortable. Carpet in a train is also nice. Doesn't have to be a seemingly relatively thick carpet that SWR have put in their refurbished Desiros but one like on southerns older electrostars (very thin, and not even that clean) just help stop the train from feeling bare, scarce and clinical imo
That's probably a bit generalised...It’s not really surprising: WorstGroup have never given an f-in-circle about their customers.
Yes, indications are that the seats will be crammed against the side walls, dictated by the DfT's stipulation of a minimum gangway width.I've just been reading the Stakeholder Annual report 2018/19 and it states that these units will have underfloor heating which I thought was only on the 720s for Greater Anglia. This might've already been recognised, apologies if it has. Although it's the Desiro City range of trains that has the problem with intrusive heating, at least it can be confirmed there won't be any intrusive heating on these units which is helpful since the seats will no doubt be cramped against the wall.
I didn’t think Desiro City was significantly different to earlier Desiros. 350, 450, 444 etc all have skirting heaters of similar size don’t they?I've just been reading the Stakeholder Annual report 2018/19 and it states that these units will have underfloor heating which I thought was only on the 720s for Greater Anglia. This might've already been recognised, apologies if it has. Although it's the Desiro City range of trains that has the problem with intrusive heating, at least it can be confirmed there won't be any intrusive heating on these units which is helpful since the seats will no doubt be cramped against the wall.
I didn’t think Desiro City was significantly different to earlier Desiros. 350, 450, 444 etc all have skirting heaters of similar size don’t they?