LNER Azuma (Class 800/801)

[hexagon789]

Confirmed to staff today via engineering director that Aberdeen is served from Monday 25th November and to Inverness on Monday 9th December.

Thanks for the update. Presumably the timings are unchanged?

 

[ainsworth74]

Thanks for the update. Presumably the timings are unchanged?

As far as I'm aware there are no changes to any timings until the full roll out is completed and the ECML can go through a timetable recast on the basis of a new uniform fleet.

 

[800001]

Thanks for the update. Presumably the timings are unchanged?

Don't think so, if you search on lner website it will show you what services are Azuma with timings.

 

[jamieintercity]

How many 800s/801s are now built and let loose on the ECML (Whether they are in service/still in training)?

 

[hexagon789]

Don't think so, if you search on lner website it will show you what services are Azuma with timings.

Thanks, just curious if they were confident that the 800s on diesel could manage the existing timings north of Edinburgh.

 

[Railperf]

Thanks, just curious if they were confident that the 800s on diesel could manage the existing timings north of Edinburgh.

I don't think timings are currently an issue. Aberdeen to Edinburgh is not the most demanding section of track.

Thanks, just curious if they were confident that the 800s on diesel could manage the existing timings north of Edinburgh.

The route from Edinburgh to Dundee is hardly taxing for an IET, mainly 80mph wish and very few short stretches of 95 and 100mph. An IET will easily cope with that. Dundee to Aberdeen is a faster section, but even 90mph 158's can keep timings along there substituting 2+4 HST's and 170's. It too will be meat and drink to an IET.
Probably the most interesting stretch will be the highland main line - where there are some very long steep climbs - 16 miles northbound from Blair Atholl to Druimachdar summit! They will need all engines working or they will be down to 40-45mph on that climb. Similarly out of Inverness it is virtually a 13 mile climb of 1 in 60 to Moy and after 4 or 5 miles of slightly easier gradients- a further 3 miles of 1 in 60 to Slochd summit. They won't be powering up at 75mph like the Scotrail 2+4 HST's!

Mind you Scotrail 'classic 2+4 HST's are losing 2 to 3 mins dwell time per stop - so what they gain in performance is lost on extended dwells.
Also the long single track sections create a problem as trains have to wait for them to clear. Any delay in one directions has a knock on effect on the other.

 

[Railperf]

Issues with reservation on all Lner fleets over weekend.

Seemingly fixed this morning. My Edinburgh to London Azuma traffic lights working perfectly.

 

[hexagon789]

I don't think timings are currently an issue. Aberdeen to Edinburgh is not the most demanding section of track.

I suppose not, it's not as tightly timed as it was.

The route from Edinburgh to Dundee is hardly taxing for an IET, mainly 80mph wish and very few short stretches of 95 and 100mph. An IET will easily cope with that. Dundee to Aberdeen is a faster section, but even 90mph 158's can keep timings along there substituting 2+4 HST's and 170's. It too will be meat and drink to an IET.
Probably the most interesting stretch will be the highland main line - where there are some very long steep climbs - 16 miles northbound from Blair Atholl to Druimachdar summit! They will need all engines working or they will be down to 40-45mph on that climb. Similarly out of Inverness it is virtually a 13 mile climb of 1 in 60 to Moy and after 4 or 5 miles of slightly easier gradients- a further 3 miles of 1 in 60 to Slochd summit. They won't be powering up at 75mph like the Scotrail 2+4 HST's!

Mind you Scotrail 'classic 2+4 HST's are losing 2 to 3 mins dwell time per stop - so what they gain in performance is lost on extended dwells.
Also the long single track sections create a problem as trains have to wait for them to clear. Any delay in one directions has a knock on effect on the other.

Granted - the HML will be more of a test.

 

[Railperf]

I suppose not, it's not as tightly timed as it was.



Granted - the HML will be more of a test.

They will have done enough testing to know what to expect. And the distributed traction will at least help station starts. The HSTs are known to suffer slipping wheels in wet weather and leaf fall season.

 

[hexagon789]

They will have done enough testing to know what to expect. And the distributed traction will at least help station starts. The HSTs are known to suffer slipping wheels in wet weather and leaf fall season.

Certainly had a fair share of late running Chieftain's in autumn struggling south from Inverness.

That's one area the IETs will definitely improve on.

 

[Roger B]

I visited Finsbury Park between 16.30 and 18.15 yesterday, hoping to see some 801/1s on Leeds services, and perhaps the odd 800/2 or 801/2 if I got lucky. But I saw only 800/1s. And a few HSTs, and 91s as well - one of them with the 91 at south end - not seen that for quite a while.

Is there a revised date for getting the 801/1s onto the Leeds services?

 

[JonathanH]

Is there a revised date for getting the 801/1s onto the Leeds services?

They are on Leeds services - one pair diagrammed all day last week, three this and four next week - a 800/1 covered for one of the workings today however.

https://www.railforums.co.uk/threads/lner-azuma-class-800-801-diagrams.179677/page-10#post-4215111

 

[greyman42]

Does the Azuma that runs to Glasgow, go to Craigentinny or Polmadie overnight?

 

[3270]

Does the Azuma that runs to Glasgow, go to Craigentinny or Polmadie overnight?

Polmadie.

 

[Voyager lad]

Does the Azuma that runs to Glasgow, go to Craigentinny or Polmadie overnight?

Polmadie, and due to the ECML works at the moment it stays there from Friday night until Monday morning. I passed it twice yesterday, around 6.40am and 9.25pm and both times it had external destination/ coach/ stop displays and internal lights switched on. Is there any particular reason for it? Seems like a high wastage of electricity

 

[MikeWM]

On my first one now, Peterborough to Doncaster.

Arrived in formation (I think) KJHGFABCDE, which completely confused everyone (especially as PBO platform is marked with zones that have A at the front). I’m in B so had to walk most of the length of the train. I’ll bet many people are stuck in the wrong half.

Also I’m delighted that my ‘window’ seat has a great view of a wall. Are we ever going to be able to build trains again where you can actually look out of the window?

So not a great first experience.

 

[Seehof]

I still have not been on an Azuma! I asked a conductor on an HST today what they thought of the Azumas. The conductor replied, without hesitation. “Terrible. Alright for commuters but they are narrow and have hardly any space for luggage. A total nightmare at certain times”.
Is this true? What do others think?

 

[Failed Unit]

I still have not been on an Azuma! I asked a conductor on an HST today what they thought of the Azumas. The conductor replied, without hesitation. “Terrible. Alright for commuters but they are narrow and have hardly any space for luggage. A total nightmare at certain times”.
Is this true? What do others think?

The platform staff are not happy about the bike space either. Apparently struggles to get 2 bikes on.

Will be very interested to see how the cope with lots of baggage. At least the mk4s had the DVT during the peak flows which was often well utilised.

Interesting about the 2x 5 car formations. I wonder if they will get turned a lot in service or if it was just bad luck.

 

[800001]

The platform staff are not happy about the bike space either. Apparently struggles to get 2 bikes on.

Will be very interested to see how the cope with lots of baggage. At least the mk4s had the DVT during the peak flows which was often well utilised.

Interesting about the 2x 5 car formations. I wonder if they will get turned a lot in service or if it was just bad luck.

There is 1 x 5 car which is in reverse (either 801110 or 801112) and Hitachi are instructed to turn it ASAP.

As for luggage, plenty of discussions are currently underway between Lner, DFT and Hitachi. Lner certainly not happy about luggage.

 

[hexagon789]

As for luggage, plenty of discussions are currently underway between Lner, DFT and Hitachi. Lner certainly not happy about luggage.

Is there much that could be done to resolve that, save replacing some seats with luggage stacks?

 

[43094]

It’s 801112 which is currently in reverse.

 

[Failed Unit]

It’s 801112 which is currently in reverse.

How can they reverse it? Normally in Newcastle the use the high level bridge but they don’t go up there. Into Leeds via Hambleton and out via Wakefield. I know we probably have a few turning triangles such as near Lincoln. But set facing the wrong way isn’t something you come across on LNER.

 

[43094]

The only option (given it’s an Electric unit with only 1 donkey engine) is High Level Bridge.

 

[ainsworth74]

The only option (given it’s an Electric unit with only 1 donkey engine) is High Level Bridge.

Strap it on the back of a 9-car bi-mode and run it around Hambleton and then run the 9-car back around again to keep it the right way round?

 

[JonathanH]

The only option (given it’s an Electric unit with only 1 donkey engine) is High Level Bridge.

I guess they don't fit around the third side of the triangle at Shipley. Perhaps they will be able to sort it when the 800/2s are available.

 

[800001]

How can they reverse it? Normally in Newcastle the use the high level bridge but they don’t go up there. Into Leeds via Hambleton and out via Wakefield. I know we probably have a few turning triangles such as near Lincoln. But set facing the wrong way isn’t something you come across on LNER.

Easiest way, use its diesel engine and turn it at Doncaster, using the Hexthorpe triangle.

 

[Bn2020]

The only option (given it’s an Electric unit with only 1 donkey engine) is High Level Bridge.

How did it end up in reverse in the first place?

 

[800001]

How did it end up in reverse in the first place?

The 5 cars have been involved in testing between Edinburgh/Glasgow/Carstairs/Carlisle.
Also on Aire Valley lines to Skipton and Bradford.
Depending on route they have taken, that could of turned the train, ie train went Edinburgh to Glasgow then Carlisle, but returned via Carstairs (missing out Glasgow) then train could of been turned.

 

[800001]

The only option (given it’s an Electric unit with only 1 donkey engine) is High Level Bridge.

When you say 1 donkey engine, it is actually a full size normal diesel engine.
They use this to get from Hitachis Aycliffe factory to Darlington, so turning it at Doncaster on the Hexthorpe triangle in diesel mode is perfectly and easily acheiveable

 

[Failed Unit]

When you say 1 donkey engine, it is actually a full size normal diesel engine.
They use this to get from Hitachis Aycliffe factory to Darlington, so turning it at Doncaster on the Hexthorpe triangle in diesel mode is perfectly and easily acheiveable

As Lincoln - Newark isn’t that far or fast. Can they be used on that route or does it need the bi-modes?