Greater Anglia Rolling Stock Updates

[Railperf]

Not yet. Will be on AC south of Cambridge from the December TT change however.

Are you Naaarwich drivers taking them that south of Cambridge?

 

[dk1]

Are you Naaarwich drivers taking them that south of Cambridge?

Definitely not. Cambridge drivers would never permit it. Timetable sees leaving Norwich earlier/Cambridge later for more robust rostering changeovers. Guards however are working through as per manning agreements but do not suffer the strict union issue drivers do as no GA guards are based at Cambridge.

 

[Railperf]

Definitely not. Cambridge drivers would never permit it. Timetable sees leaving Norwich earlier/Cambridge later for more robust rostering changeovers. Guards however are working through as per manning agreements but do not suffer the strict union issue drivers do as no GA guards are based at Cambridge.

Have enough Cambridge drivers passed out on these now? Or could we see some 755 services terminated at Cambridge due to there not being a driver who signs them?

 

[trebor79]

Definitely not. Cambridge drivers would never permit it. Timetable sees leaving Norwich earlier/Cambridge later for more robust rostering changeovers.

Just a few minutes or significantly retimed? Even less time in bed on Tuesday and Wednesday nights for me then.

 

[dk1]

Just a few minutes or significantly retimed? Even less time in bed on Tuesday and Wednesday nights for me then.

It's all in Realtimetrains.

 

[dk1]

Have enough Cambridge drivers passed out on these now? Or could we see some 755 services terminated at Cambridge due to there not being a driver who signs them?

Training is ongoing but as with anything crew wise problems will always arise.

 

[trebor79]

It's all in Realtimetrains.

Ah yes, of course!

 

[MylesHSG]

Had a driver come up to my box the other day. Told me he will be bringing in Greater Anglia class 90's and also the 12 car 745's to Wembley for wheel turning in the Stonebridge Park Heavy Repair Depot when they go into service. Apparently during the day as well as the pendo's already take up the time at nights and weekends. So look out for some GA stock on the NLL heading for wheel turning.

 

[tofl]

I emailed GA the other day asking about plans for new trains on the Hertford East line. After some pressing they said they were aiming for December 2020, but declined to share details of whether they'd be extending platforms to accommodate longer trains or simply running shorter services.

 

[gingerheid]

Not yet. Will be on AC south of Cambridge from the December TT change however.

Not south of Ely?

 

[gingerheid]

Posters at Cambridge saying (without giving a reason) that some trains won't stop at Kennet, Elmswell or Dullingham from Monday. These will be 755 diagrams?

Journeys involved are 0654, 1320, 1620 & 1913 Ipswich to Cambridge services (won't call at Kennet), 0848, 1147, 1447, 1747 and 2047 Cambridge to Ipswich won't call at Elmswell, and the 1747 Cambridge to Ipswich also won't call at Dullingham.

 

[Railperf]

Posters at Cambridge saying (without giving a reason) that some trains won't stop at Kennet, Elmswell or Dullingham from Monday. These will be 755 diagrams?

Journeys involved are 0654, 1320, 1620 & 1913 Ipswich to Cambridge services (won't call at Kennet), 0848, 1147, 1447, 1747 and 2047 Cambridge to Ipswich won't call at Elmswell, and the 1747 Cambridge to Ipswich also won't call at Dullingham.

I understand they are planned to be 755's.

 

[dk1]

Not south of Ely?

Not yet.

 

[ttrmine123]

Greater Anglia are keeping very tight lipped about the new trains and contingency plans for the class90/MK3. I asked them

"Have you received permission to run the Class 90/MK3s beyond 31 Dec 2019?? If not then what are your plans for after this date (until the 755 FLIRTS come in to service)"

The response I got was "Thank you for your email regarding our contingency plans.

I can confirm that all details regarding the introduction of the new trains will be placed on the website once confirmed. Until then, this information will remain confidential.

Thank you

Yours Sincerely
K MG
Customer Relations
Greater Anglia

,"

 

[Meerkat]

Definitely not. Cambridge drivers would never permit it. Timetable sees leaving Norwich earlier/Cambridge later for more robust rostering changeovers.

Hang on, are you really saying that passengers have longer journeys than necessary so as to keep an unnecessary driver change, purely for union reasons?!

 

[Geswedey]

Try thinking logically please its not about ASLEF being difficult, if Norwich Drivers were to work through to Stansted they would a) need to route learn and b) there would need to be an increased Norwich depot establishment at the expense of Cambridge unless Cambridge drivers also signed the route from Ely to Norwich which would again require route learning time.

In my opinion however Cambridge drivers should sign to Norwich and Ipswich and there should be a Guards depot at Cambridge to allow a better service between Cambridge and Ipswich.

 

[dk1]

Hang on, are you really saying that passengers have longer journeys than necessary so as to keep an unnecessary driver change, purely for union reasons?!

Not at all. How did you come to that assumption?

 

[306024]

Try thinking logically please its not just ASLEF being difficult, if Norwich Drivers were to work through to Stansted they would a) need to route learn and b) there would need to be an increased Norwich depot establishment at the expense of Cambridge unless Cambridge drivers also signed the route from Ely to Norwich which would again require route learning time.

In my opinion however Cambridge drivers should sign to Norwich and Ipswich and there should be a Guards depot at Cambridge to allow a better service between Cambridge and Ipswich.

Spot on. ASLEF are always open to discussion, and route / traction knowledge does change if timetables dictate. If it is all done properly there is rarely any major problem.

 

[dk1]

In my opinion however Cambridge drivers should sign to Norwich and Ipswich and there should be a Guards depot at Cambridge to allow a better service between Cambridge and Ipswich.

I used to roster Cambridge guards in Reggie Rail days. The service was always pretty hopeless across the Bury route. What was gained by closing Cambridge as a depot in preparation for Anglia was earlier trains eastbound & later westbound as everything had to return to Ipswich.

 

[delticdave]

Not at all. How did you come to that assumption?

After reading your post No. 3003 last Thursday, I made the same assumption..........

 

[dk1]

After reading your post No. 3003 last Thursday, I made the same assumption..........

No, the journey time is the same. It even provides better connections into the Liverpool St, Kings X (semi-fast) & the Brighton. Just saves a Norwich driver waiting at Cambridge for over an hour as 11min swapover is not enough. Drivers tend to do an IC to Liverpool St from Norwich as well so this would make many diagrams illegal by going over 10hrs. It was never going to be plain sailing allowing depots to encroach on each other's work & this is the next best solution. Even spreads the service spacing to/from Stansted with XC too.

 

[gingerheid]

Posters at Cambridge saying (without giving a reason) that some trains won't stop at Kennet, Elmswell or Dullingham from Monday. These will be 755 diagrams?

Journeys involved are 0654, 1320, 1620 & 1913 Ipswich to Cambridge services (won't call at Kennet), 0848, 1147, 1447, 1747 and 2047 Cambridge to Ipswich won't call at Elmswell, and the 1747 Cambridge to Ipswich also won't call at Dullingham.

According to the guard the trains will be making these stops today, and it has been put back until tomorrow.

 

[arb]

It's fairly well documented across several threads that from the upcoming timetable change, all of Greater Anglia's London to Cambridge services will terminate at Cambridge North, due to the new trains being too long for the bay platforms at Cambridge. But what will happen to the handful of services that Greater Anglia run to/from Ely and King's Lynn, particularly with regard to the short platforms at Littleport and Waterbeach? Are these being run by 720s like the London to Cambridge services? Are the platforms here long enough to accommodate 5-car class 720s before the platform lengthening work is complete?

In general, the trains calling at Littleport and Waterbeach stay the same in the new timetable (suggesting the 720s are fine to call there), but there are a couple of cases in the evening peak where trains which call at Waterbeach and terminate at Ely are no longer calling at Waterbeach, and instead the class 755s on the Stansted to Norwich route are gaining a Waterbeach call. Specifically the current 1730 call (on a train doing LST-ELY) and the 1830 call (on a CBG-ELY) are being replaced by a 1738 and 1839 (both doing SSD-NRW). These two changes considered in isolation would hint at 720s not being able to call at Waterbeach, but that can't be the case if all of Greater Anglia's other Ely/King's Lynn trains are continuing to call there.

 

[Aureol Colin]

It's fairly well documented across several threads that from the upcoming timetable change, all of Greater Anglia's London to Cambridge services will terminate at Cambridge North, due to the new trains being too long for the bay platforms at Cambridge. But what will happen to the handful of services that Greater Anglia run to/from Ely and King's Lynn, particularly with regard to the short platforms at Littleport and Waterbeach? Are these being run by 720s like the London to Cambridge services? Are the platforms here long enough to accommodate 5-car class 720s before the platform lengthening work is complete?

In general, the trains calling at Littleport and Waterbeach stay the same in the new timetable (suggesting the 720s are fine to call there), but there are a couple of cases in the evening peak where trains which call at Waterbeach and terminate at Ely are no longer calling at Waterbeach, and instead the class 755s on the Stansted to Norwich route are gaining a Waterbeach call. Specifically the current 1730 call (on a train doing LST-ELY) and the 1830 call (on a CBG-ELY) are being replaced by a 1738 and 1839 (both doing SSD-NRW). These two changes considered in isolation would hint at 720s not being able to call at Waterbeach, but that can't be the case if all of Greater Anglia's other Ely/King's Lynn trains are continuing to call there.

As there are no 720s delivered (let alone ready for service) any changes because of them would seem premature

 

[arb]

As there are no 720s delivered (let alone ready for service) any changes because of them would seem premature

Surely though the timetable change would have been planned well in advance under an assumption that the new trains would be running as originally planned from the end of this year? Otherwise by the same logic there's no need for them to make all of the timetable alterations related to the Cambridge/Cambridge North stopping patterns in this timetable change.

 

[47421]

I emailed GA the other day asking about plans for new trains on the Hertford East line. After some pressing they said they were aiming for December 2020, but declined to share details of whether they'd be extending platforms to accommodate longer trains or simply running shorter services.

Yes like so many of the promises made in 2016 GA have gone very quiet on plans to actually implement what they said they would. in relation to Hertford East they committed per Franchise Agreement Schedule 6.2 para 105 by 1 Sept 18 to extend platforms at Hertford East, Wickford, Manningtree, Kings Lynn, Elsenham, Ware, St Margarets and Enfield Lock. All being locations where SDO does work either because of location of points/signals or because SDO would result in overhanging crossings. No work done at any of these locations AFAIK.

In relation to Hertford East NR made a planning application last year to do the work, including moving the derelict signal box to a heritage railway. The local civic association or whoever objected and the application was denied. I see a new one has been made a few weeks ago. Generally it is hard to feel too much sympathy for NR/GA, but what a fafh having to deal with these objections.

Anyway at least they seem to be progressing the scheme. I had expected running 10 car Aventras to HE to be abandoned, given the need also to do work at Ware and St Margarets.

https://publicaccess.eastherts.gov....152_LBC-COVERING_LETTER-_21.10.19-1446942.pdf

https://publicaccess.eastherts.gov....ils.do?keyVal=PZRVZ1GLLM300&activeTab=summary

https://publicaccess.eastherts.gov....19_2152_LBC-CONSERVATION_20_11_19-1459178.pdf

 

[47421]

It's fairly well documented across several threads that from the upcoming timetable change, all of Greater Anglia's London to Cambridge services will terminate at Cambridge North, due to the new trains being too long for the bay platforms at Cambridge. But what will happen to the handful of services that Greater Anglia run to/from Ely and King's Lynn, particularly with regard to the short platforms at Littleport and Waterbeach? Are these being run by 720s like the London to Cambridge services? Are the platforms here long enough to accommodate 5-car class 720s before the platform lengthening work is complete?

In general, the trains calling at Littleport and Waterbeach stay the same in the new timetable (suggesting the 720s are fine to call there), but there are a couple of cases in the evening peak where trains which call at Waterbeach and terminate at Ely are no longer calling at Waterbeach, and instead the class 755s on the Stansted to Norwich route are gaining a Waterbeach call. Specifically the current 1730 call (on a train doing LST-ELY) and the 1830 call (on a CBG-ELY) are being replaced by a 1738 and 1839 (both doing SSD-NRW). These two changes considered in isolation would hint at 720s not being able to call at Waterbeach, but that can't be the case if all of Greater Anglia's other Ely/King's Lynn trains are continuing to call there.

The Franchise Agreement per below says that Kings Lynn platform should be extended to accommodate 10 car Aventras. But all the recent NR publicity about the work being done to accommodate 8 car Great Northern services on the Kings Lynn line says nothing about Aventras. I assume 10 car Aventras will never run to Kings Lynn. No sure where 5 car ones will be able to stop. But as others have noted given the delays to the 720 build, over a year late already and apparently still not permitted to run on Network Rail normal track (they have run on Old Dalby test track but were moved there by road), it is not a live question for the moment and is not likely to be before the May 2020 timetable change.

"105.2 Pursuant to paragraph 105.1 such changes to the infrastructure shall include such infrastructure works at each of Hertford East, Wickford, Manningtree, Kings Lynn, Elsenham, Ware, St Margarets and Enfield Lock Stations as are necessary to enable any Passenger Services comprised of 10 rolling stock vehicles to call at such Stations by no later than 1 September 2018."

 

[ashkeba]

The Franchise Agreement per below says that Kings Lynn platform should be extended to accommodate 10 car Aventras. But all the recent NR publicity about the work being done to accommodate 8 car Great Northern services on the Kings Lynn line says nothing about Aventras. I assume 10 car Aventras will never run to Kings Lynn. No sure where 5 car ones will be able to stop. [...]

Probably at all stations where the 8 car GN services can? I suspect that the likely problem is Waterbeach yet again. Putting the platforms after the crossing must have seemed like a clever idea to someone years ago but it causes problems so often now. Better to have them before like at Watlington.

I share scepticism that there will be 10 car Aventras to Kings Lynn. Is there anywhere to store them overnight there?

 

[Alfie1014]

Especially as a 10 car GA Aventra at 240m is equivalent to 12 car 317/379/387. So I too doubt it’ll be more than 5 cars north of Camb or Ely, and to be fair I doubt it would need it capacity wise.

 

[MylesHSG]

90012 arrived at Wembley ICD today. Looking rather tatty I must say.