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Ember: Electric coach service

ClydeCoaster

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Does anyone know anything further about the planned electric coach service between Dundee and Edinburgh? Bus & Coach Buyer reported on it a couple of weeks back but it's the only report I can find on it, the internet is bringing up a dead search. Planned to start in April 2020 with a Yutong TCe12.

https://www.busandcoachbuyer.com/ember-to-trailblaze-electric-coaches/
A long-distance inter-city electric coach service is set to go into operation for the first time in the UK.

The operation, entitled Ember, is to operate electric Yutong TCe12s on a route between Dundee and Edinburgh. The company was formed by Pierce Glennie and Keith Bradbury, who previously worked for iwoca, a company involved in developing technology to aid the financial services sector. They have left their previous roles to pursue the pioneering coach operation.

Pierce said: “We were very keen to do something that aided sustainability. It’s an important challenge. I see ourselves as a technology company and I see a huge role for technology to play in making transport work better.

“We focus on long-distance bus services. We wanted to cover routes of 100km to 200km, where there is a lot of demand from commuters and the day trip market. We had not seen any company apply electric coaches to that before. Most of the electric operations are in cities.”

The first of Ember’s Yutong TCe12 electric coaches are due to be delivered in March 2020, with the second expected to be delivered in July of that year. The operation’s first route is planned to be launched in the beginning of April next year. Pierce said: “Pelican Bus and Coach have been very helpful. I have a lot of confidence in them.”

Pierce and Keith are going through the process of operator licensing at the time of writing. They are also hiring people to take care of the technology side of the operation.

The long-term plan for Ember is to expand the electric coach network across the rest of the UK and eventually Europe.

Pierce said: “We researched the sectors before we formed Ember and I felt this sector has the technology to do this. The Yutong coaches really work. They have a big presence in China. At the same time, we didn’t see any of the big operators do this. Our view is to make this work you have to have a different approach. You have to schedule in the charging infrastructure; and if you are one of the big guys, this is a painful experience to go through.

“We have been working on our first charging point, a 120kW fast charger. We have been working with Dundee City Council, who have been very supportive in working through the utilities process. This is why we are launching in Scotland, because the regulatory process is ahead of England.”

The project has been funded through a mixture of finance on the vehicles themselves, along with Keith and Pierce’s savings.

Ember’s headquarters are in Edinburgh, with coach storage for the company set to be in Dundee.

As the service comes nearer to fruition, what is it like setting up this operation? “It’s a mixture of nerves and excitement,” said Pierce.
 
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ClydeCoaster

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Agreed. Terrible name. I’m hoping it’s just a company name, like Comlaw 313 was GCT. It’s a noble and innovative idea, but competitive? Far from it I would think.
 

borage

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There's a website etc now: https://www.ember.to/ (Tongan domain name)
Edinburgh to Dundee for £7.50
The UK's first 100% electric coach service with comfy seats, live tracking and free wifi. Launching summer 2020. Subscribe for updates and a free ticket.
 

MotCO

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Launching 1 October, timetables: https://bustimes.org/operators/ember. Unusually, Dundee→Edinburgh and Edinburgh→Dundee are registered as separate services.

It seems to be a two-coach operation. I'm not sure about some of the timings - what is the purpose of the 00.30 Dundee departure and 02.19 Edinburgh departure? Also, the early morning coaches into Edinburgh do not seem to be attractive for commuters, arriving at 07.11 and 09.53 and leaving at 15.32 and 18.45 in the evening. The coaches into Dundee in the morning and leaving in the afternoon again are not timed for commuters, so what is the intended market? Is it targetting students?
 

route101

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A new electric coach service has started between Edinburgh and Dundee , goes via Perth Broxden ( ive noticed only the Stagecoach services go via A92 and Tay Bridge). Wonder how this will do? £7.50 one way.
 

Jordan Adam

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The Stagecoach X58 isn't really comparable as it's not a direct route and takes almost 3 hours. The most comparable routes are the Citylink M90 & M92/G92.

I want Ember to be a success but i can't see it working out. Edinburgh - Dundee is already well served and they've possibly picked the worst time possible to launch a long distance coach service.
 

route101

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The Stagecoach X58 isn't really comparable as it's not a direct route and takes almost 3 hours. The most comparable routes are the Citylink M90 & M92/G92.

I want Ember to be a success but i can't see it working out. Edinburgh - Dundee is already well served and they've possibly picked the worst time possible to launch a long distance coach service.

Might give it a try next week, probably sooner rather than later. At £7.50 flat price if booked online , it's good value compared to train and citylink.
 
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GusB

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Discussion of unserved markets has been moved here:
 

overthewater

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A new electric coach service has started between Edinburgh and Dundee , goes via Perth Broxden ( ive noticed only the Stagecoach services go via A92 and Tay Bridge). Wonder how this will do? £7.50 one way.

It does not go via Broxden its stops at Walnut grove.
###

The trouble with the service is it needs 1 hour charge in Dundee, so if they could get another charge point in Edinburgh you could have a faster turn around at Dundee.
 

GusB

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I'm not familiar with bus services in Perth - is Walnut Grove easy enough to get to by bus? It's a fair hike from the centre on foot.
 

RomeoCharlie71

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I'm not familiar with bus services in Perth - is Walnut Grove easy enough to get to by bus? It's a fair hike from the centre on foot.
No. You'd need to catch the once-daily (twice-daily on Tuesday/Thursday) 51, or the hourly 16 to "Branklyn Gardens" and walk the rest which is still a fair distance.

I can't really think of any other potential places it could stop, as they obviously want the route to be as direct as possible.
 

overthewater

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No, The stop in question is only in place to get 15 mile fuel rebate. The stop during the daytime only get buses going into perth a Stagecoach No16. Evening service which is paid for by the council makes the no16B going to Dundee also operate the loop. Yes its a fair good hike from anywhere.

Here is a map of the bus stop in question
 

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GusB

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Only in the UK would an electric coach service have an additional stop in order to claim fuel rebate! :rolleyes:
 

Stan Drews

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Only in the UK would an electric coach service have an additional stop in order to claim fuel rebate! :rolleyes:
It hasn’t been Fuel Duty Rebate since 2002. Adding the stops such as Walnut Grove will allow the operator to claim BSOG (Bus Service Operators Grant), which is paid per live kilometre. The electric buses will qualify for an enhanced rate. Full details of the (Scottish) scheme can be found here. https://www.transport.gov.scot/media/44451/bsog-guidance-march-2019.pdf
 

Deerfold

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This looks interesting, but I can't see any logic to any of the arrival or departure times (I realise the layover times need to include charging time so that has a minimum).
They don't seem geared towards commuters or daytrippers in either direction.
 

Stan Drews

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I noticed on social media a post from someone who went to make a late night/early morning return trip, to try it out, but they had to cancel the journeys as the coach wouldn’t charge at Dundee.
 

Jordan Adam

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I noticed on social media a post from someone who went to make a late night/early morning return trip, to try it out, but they had to cancel the journeys as the coach wouldn’t charge at Dundee.

The other coach was also in Dundee but the journey still didn't run so presumably an issue with the charger rather coaches. Does raise the question of what happens when the charger is out of action.
 

RomeoCharlie71

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The other coach was also in Dundee but the journey still didn't run so presumably an issue with the charger rather coaches. Does raise the question of what happens when the charger is out of action.
I was told it was an issue with the batteries and they were replaced on warranty... But don't take my word for it!
 

185

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Not sure about the name "Ember"... coaches sometimes catch fire.

Now visiting English getting on the bus at Dundee can ask for the destination and sound like a local by just saying the company name ;)
 

Jordan Adam

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I was told it was an issue with the batteries and they were replaced on warranty... But don't take my word for it!

If that was the case then i wonder why the other coach wasn't used. Granted the service not running wasn't anyone's loss as it's unlikely any real passengers would've used it, however the fact still remains that the service failed to operate.
 

Jordan Adam

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It would appear the 00:30 from Dundee has been cancelled for the second night in a row.
 

RomeoCharlie71

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I noticed on social media a post from someone who went to make a late night/early morning return trip, to try it out, but they had to cancel the journeys as the coach wouldn’t charge at Dundee.
I've just had a look at Ember's website and it appears the early morning trips have been cancelled today (03/10) and tomorrow (04/10) as well. Next week, they have also been cancelled on 06/10.

Not the best start!
 

Observer

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They really should have invested in a spare coach. Plenty PSVAR compliant vehicles available on the market.

Obviously wouldn't be electric but when they're using two coaches for this they need a third for spare.
 

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