Locked in at Blackburn Station

[221129]

You definitely have a gripe against the railway. But the guard seems to have acted impeccably and in a situation which wasn't great for them either. Kudos to the guard.

I strongly suspect the guard was probably more annoyed about it then the passengers!

 

[joke2711]

You definitely have a gripe against the railway. But the guard seems to have acted impeccably and in a situation which wasn't great for them either. Kudos to the guard.

I do have a gripe .. you would if you were locked in for 2 hours in the early hours!
I have been nothing but complimentary to the Guard, who was doing their paid job and perhaps kudos for the 4 passengers who remained calm, supportive and did not cause the Guard any concern during the 2 hour lockdown.

2 of the 4 passengers were young single ladies travelling alone. We (my partner and I) took one home after the event .. we then still had to drive 45 minutes ourselves.

 

[Bletchleyite]

Agreed, excellent actions by the guard, but gross negligence by whoever locked up without ensuring the last train had departed. Only exception would be if they perhaps left due to an emergency, and the train was meant to be cancelled with road transport from elsewhere, I suppose.

 

[daveo]

I do hope "THEY" will be claiming overtime for that

Why, was there more than one guard?

 

[joke2711]

Why, was there more than one guard?

No .. the Guard was Female so He'll won't be claiming overtime

 

[philthetube]

I do have a gripe .. you would if you were locked in for 2 hours in the early hours!
I have been nothing but complimentary to the Guard, who was doing their paid job and perhaps kudos for the 4 passengers who remained calm, supportive and did not cause the Guard any concern during the 2 hour lockdown.

2 of the 4 passengers were young single ladies travelling alone. We (my partner and I) took one home after the event .. we then still had to drive 45 minutes ourselves.

I would have thought that offering taxis home for the affected would have been a minimum first thing to do.

 

[Trackman]

Looking at RTT there was a service 10 minutes earlier so they must have been on their toes sharpish and ready to go, unless by chance no-one was on the previous terminator.

Agreed, excellent actions by the guard, but gross negligence by whoever locked up without ensuring the last train had departed. Only exception would be if they perhaps left due to an emergency, and the train was meant to be cancelled with road transport from elsewhere, I suppose.

There is no excuse as they have the tools to tell them when the last train is.
Let's say there was a personal emergency or illness or whatever I wouldn't dream of locking the station up, I would contact control or have someone else to advise of the situation.
Last thing you want is people roaming in the 4ft looking for a way out.

 

[skyhigh]

Looking at RTT there was a service 10 minutes earlier so they must have been on their toes sharpish and ready to go, unless by chance no-one was on the previous terminator.

If it was a Blackburn guard on the terminator, the depot is across the road rather than in the station buildings, so they must have managed to get out okay

 

[_toommm_]

Possibly, but considering the importance the railway places in times of disruption on discouraging passengers from self-evacuating onto the track, surely trapping passengers in a station such that they may feel the need to get down onto the track on a winter evening in the dark should be treated similarly?

I’ve seen passengers cross open tracks just to get to another platform. A Sunday morning at Stalybridge and someone hadn’t unlocked the station building, so passengers couldn’t get to platforms three and one (Manchester-bound platforms). As much as I strongly advised people not to, they crossed the tracks just to get access to the platforms. Naturally this delayed their train and my Huddersfield-bound train.

 

[robbeech]

It amazes me that the station was locked up for the night before the last service had called at the station.

It shouldn’t amaze you.

Surely there should be an emergency exit in case of fire or other catastrophe?

This will undoubtedly be locked, often during normal hours too.

Is there an help point or something else in the station . If the guard wasn't available could they have pushed the help point.

This does on the face of it seem like a serious health and safety failing

Help points are hit and miss. The one at Worksop hasn’t worked or over 7 years. I‘ve reported it dozens of times but it gets ignored. Anyone relying on a help point will come unstuck.

Hopefully they will be disciplined accordingly.

Should they be at fault. There’s often incorrect data with regards to service amendments and cancellations. It may be that their information was wrong and they left at the time they were told. The chances of staff just saying “sod it i’m going home” are slim.

I would have thought that offering taxis home for the affected would have been a minimum first thing to do.

It’s hit and miss whether you’ll get a taxi when they’re legally obliged to provide you one to your ticketed destination so I wouldn’t be holding my breath here.

At the end of the day, something has gone very wrong and you can rest assured that nothing will be learnt from it. Importantly everyone was safe.

 

[Scotrail314209]

That’s absolutely abhorrent. Isn’t it common sense for the station staff to remain on the station until the last train has successfully terminated?

I sympathise with the OP as that must have not have been a good situation to be in, especially at that time of night.

The guard acted the best she could, and I take my hat off to her.

 

[3rd rail land]

Should they be at fault. There’s often incorrect data with regards to service amendments and cancellations. It may be that their information was wrong and they left at the time they were told. The chances of staff just saying “sod it i’m going home” are slim.

Absolutely. Nobody working on a railway station is going to say "Sod it, I'm going home" when they know the last train of the night hasn't called yet unless of course they are trying to get fired. I'd put good money on station staff being given incorrect information causing them to lock up after they thought the last train had called.

The guard acted the best he could, and I take my hat off to him.

The OP has said the guard was female.

 

[Scotrail314209]

Absolutely. Nobody working on a railway station is going to say "Sod it, I'm going home" when they know the last train of the night hasn't called yet unless of course they are trying to get fired. I'd put good money on station staff being given incorrect information causing them to lock up after they thought the last train had called.


The OP has said the guard was female.

Corrected! (It’s been a long night)

 

[duncanp]

I have been in a similar situation during a tube strike in London some years ago.

Due to the strike Blackhorse Road station was closed, and London Overground services were not meant to stop.

However the service I was on, going towards Barking, did stop, but when we went upstairs the gate leading into the London Underground part of the station, and thus the exit, was locked.

Therefore I, and several other people, were trapped on the London Overground platforms with no legal means of escape.

Fortunately another train back towards South Tottenham was due, and it stopped to pick everyone up, and those who wanted to alight at Blackhorse Road were warned not to.

Had there been no means of escaping by train, I would have dialled 999.

Needless to say, my complaint to London Underground was met with the standard reply of "..nothing to do with us Guv, it's London Overground's fault..", and nothing ever came of the incident.

The incident at Blackburn needs to be investigated thoroughly as it is surely a serious breach of Health & Safety legislation to leave passengers locked inside a station with no means of escape. What if there had been a medical emergency or a fire? (Although presumably in these circumstances the fire brigade would have broken down the door or smashed a window.

 

[221129]

That’s absolutely abhorrent. Isn’t it common sense for the station staff to remain on the station until the last train has successfully terminated?

And if they were told that the last one had been cancelled?

Not applicable in this case, however if the last train is late and past their book off time, that's not their problem either. It may shock some on here but people do have lives outside of work.

 

[Haywain]

Needless to say, my complaint to London Underground was met with the standard reply of "..nothing to do with us Guv, it's London Overground's fault..", and nothing ever came of the incident.

If the station was closed and services were not supposed to be stopping, it seems fair to say that blame should lie with the operator of the service that stopped and allowed passengers to alight.

 

[LSWR Cavalier]

I speculate that this happens occasionally with no consequences, at many stations one can get out easily. But I would not fancy trying that in the dark, even if I knew the place.

If the last train is late, surely the staff should wait for it, but what if that puts their hours over the limit? What if the last train is 30 or more minutes late?

As for being stranded in a tube station, as described above: that could be very scary.

 

[221129]

If the last train is late, surely the staff should wait for it

Why should they? If it's past their booking off time then why should they wait?

 

[Class800]

Safety

 

[Bletchleyite]

Why should they? If it's past their booking off time then why should they wait?

For the same reason as a bus driver can't just get out of the seat and walk off when it ticks back their official booking off time - because it is a matter of public safety not to lock them into buildings.

If you want a job where you can just walk off when the clock chimes, and you're station staff at a station with no access to the platforms other than through the buildings, you're in the wrong job.

Not only that, but if doing the job competently they'd have noticed that there was a train booked to call after they locked up, and that they needed to make calls etc to resolve that, either someone else being found to cover or the train being cancelled.

"Not my job guv" doesn't wash. If you notice a problem, it is your responsibility to bring it to the attention of people who can solve it, in any job.

 

[duncanp]

As for being stranded in a tube station, as described above: that could be very scary.

The London Overground platforms at Blackhorse Road are in the open air, but to exit the station you have to use the stairs or a lift up on to a bridge which leads to the London Underground ticket hall and the exit.

There is a concertina gate at the entrance to the London Underground ticket hall, and it was this gate that was locked.

I suspect in my case is was miscommuncation of human error that caused the problem. Did the driver of the train simply forget that the station was closed and that he shouldn't have stopped, or did no-one tell him that the station was closed.

Often in tube strikes a LUL station can be open for part of the day and then subsequently close when the person who should have turned up fails to do so because they are on strike. The message that the station is now closed needs to get through to all relevant parties, and I guess sometimes this does not happen.

I suspect some kind of miscommunication caused the incident at Blackburn.

I cannot believe that station staff would deliberately walk off and close the station before the arrival of the last train, so was there a last minute alteration to the timetable that the station staff were not aware of.

 

[robbeech]

Why should they? If it's past their booking off time then why should they wait?

The argument for them waiting is because the result is 4 people and a guard locked inside a station for an indefinite amount of time. Without the guard there with some contacts this could have been even more serious.

 

[Bletchleyite]

The argument for them waiting is because the result is 4 people and a guard locked inside a station for an indefinite amount of time. Without the guard there with some contacts this could have been even more serious.

Possibly only because of natural reticence to call 999 (or pull passcoms*) - it would be reasonable, once established that one was trapped, to call 999 immediately. This would likely result in fairly quick action, even if it was the fire service showing up to open the door in a more unconventional manner.

That said, for someone able bodied (much more likely that able bodied people would be travelling late at night, generally) at most stations it would just be a case of jumping the fence to the car park - Blackburn is a bit of an exception because of being island platforms. So this might well happen more often than reported. That said most stations do have side accesses, meaning if the building is locked you can still get out. It could theoretically be an issue at Bletchley due to the layout (I can't think of an easily jumpable fence) but the building is left open all night unstaffed anyway as the overnight gap in service is quite short.

* The Eschede collision was arguably as bad as it was because someone went to chat to the guard about a piece of wheel coming through the floor rather than immediately pulling the handle.

 

[duncanp]

Why should they? If it's past their booking off time then why should they wait?

For safety reasons.

I would have thought that the normal booking off time for station staff should be some time after the scheduled arrival of the last train.

Station staff should have access to information about whether the last train is running late, and there should be a procedure in place for staff to follow if the late running of the last train will cause them to go past their scheduled booking off time.

If staff have to wait past their scheduled booking off time, they should of course be paid overtime, and transport home (eg. a taxi) should be arranged if required.

 

[LSWR Cavalier]

I am able-bodied, of average height, but I should not risk trying to jump/climb over the fence. Might be a real need to call 999 if that went wrong.

 

[najaB]

Why should they? If it's past their booking off time then why should they wait?

I hope this was sarcasm?

 

[Bletchleyite]

I am able-bodied, of average height, but I should not risk trying to jump/climb over the fence. Might be a real need to call 999 if that went wrong.

You should not be required to do so (so calling 999 is reasonable), but I suspect most able-bodied people (males in particular, young males more so, and drunk young males even more so, those demographics tending to be those occupying late night trains) probably would do it.

This being the case this may well go unreported.

 

[Class800]

Possibly only because of natural reticence to call 999 (or pull passcoms*) - it would be reasonable, once established that one was trapped, to call 999 immediately. This would likely result in fairly quick action, even if it was the fire service showing up to open the door in a more unconventional manner.

That said, for someone able bodied (much more likely that able bodied people would be travelling late at night, generally) at most stations it would just be a case of jumping the fence to the car park - Blackburn is a bit of an exception because of being island platforms. So this might well happen more often than reported. That said most stations do have side accesses, meaning if the building is locked you can still get out. It could theoretically be an issue at Bletchley due to the layout (I can't think of an easily jumpable fence) but the building is left open all night unstaffed anyway as the overnight gap in service is quite short.

* The Eschede collision was arguably as bad as it was because someone went to chat to the guard about a piece of wheel coming through the floor rather than immediately pulling the handle.

Not sure the blue light services would help - i've been trapped into places (unnecessarily) by them but never have they helped me get out of anywhere!

 

[Bletchleyite]

Not sure the blue light services would help - i've been trapped into places (unnecessarily) by them but never have they helped me get out of anywhere!

False imprisonment is a criminal offence so I'd expect they would, yes.

 

[Class800]

False imprisonment is a criminal offence so I'd expect they would, yes.

They should help - but my only experience of them in such a situation was negative - police allowing an ambulance to block a car park exit trapping people in, when the casualty wasn't unconscious and the ambulance could have easily parked just inside the carpark. So, personally I wouldn't trust them to help me.