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Once Soham station has opened, what improvements could be made to service provision on the line?

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dk1

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The exile

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But perhaps the Murphy bit added later - shouldn't the verb be "have worked" since there are two subjects?
No - "along with" is not the same as "and". (Think of the sentence "I am going into town with my friends" as opposed to "My friends and I are going into town") "Network Rail" is still the Subject - it's just the word order of the sentence that confuses matters. Not sure about "their" contractor though - as a corporate body, NR is surely an "it"?
 

Maltazer

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As has been said previously, the natural destination for most travellers from Soham is surely Cambridge.

And the choice is via Ely, with an 18 minute connection, or Bury St Edmunds where the Cambridge train leaves a couple of minutes before the one from Soham arrives, meaning a 57 minute wait for the next one (in the reverse direction you'll have a minute to cross platforms if you're lucky!)

The demand for the curve to Newmarket to be reinstated is going to come pretty quickly.
 

70014IronDuke

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And the choice is via Ely, with an 18 minute connection, or Bury St Edmunds where the Cambridge train leaves a couple of minutes before the one from Soham arrives, meaning a 57 minute wait for the next one (in the reverse direction you'll have a minute to cross platforms if you're lucky!)

The demand for the curve to Newmarket to be reinstated is going to come pretty quickly.
I suppose that would mean the connection could be made if the Soham trains also stopped at Kennett? Won't happen, I'm sure, because of the extra running time needed - would mess up pathing at the key junctions
 

Class 170101

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I suppose that would mean the connection could be made if the Soham trains also stopped at Kennett? Won't happen, I'm sure, because of the extra running time needed - would mess up pathing at the key junctions
Wrong hour for the connections, according to Real Time Trains, unfortunately for Soham to Cambridge. About 20 or so minutes from Cambridge to Soham.
 

Tobbes

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The West-to-North curve at Newmarket plus double tracking through Soham to Ely and Cambridge to Newmarket seems inevitable with RAF Mildenhall becoming a new town, but when?
 

70014IronDuke

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Yes it certainly is. Doubt passenger numbers will really take off until an hourly service is provided. Will just have to tick along until then.
Perhaps its most valuable market with the current service will be long distance pax for Peterborough, then onward travel?
 

Ianno87

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Perhaps its most valuable market with the current service will be long distance pax for Peterborough, then onward travel?

My hunch would be some local trips to Ely etc, perhaps with some "railheading" as a connection for Peterborough, like you suggest.

Gut feel is that the Cambridge/London market won't grow, as passengers will be reluctant to rely on miss-it-and-wait 2 hours connections at Ely.
 

Class 170101

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My hunch would be some local trips to Ely etc, perhaps with some "railheading" as a connection for Peterborough, like you suggest.

Gut feel is that the Cambridge/London market won't grow, as passengers will be reluctant to rely on miss-it-and-wait 2 hours connections at Ely.
I would tend to agree with you, this market won't grow unless it gets an hourly service (at least), but thats at least most of this decade away sadly.
 

dk1

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I would tend to agree with you, this market won't grow unless it gets an hourly service (at least), but thats at least most of this decade away sadly.
Unless as hinted a bi-hourly Ipswich-Ely service can be brought in sooner.
 

Maltazer

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Unless as hinted a bi-hourly Ipswich-Ely service can be brought in sooner.
Are there recommended margins in timetables for turn around times?

Currently it looks too tight - 56 minutes Ely to Ipswich (and an hour for the return).

The Flirts can clearly do it more quickly since they often sit outside Ely for a few minutes waiting for the Kings Cross train to depart, but can they do it quickly enough, or would there need to be line speed improvements too?
 

dk1

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Are there recommended margins in timetables for turn around times?

Currently it looks too tight - 56 minutes Ely to Ipswich (and an hour for the return).

The Flirts can clearly do it more quickly since they often sit outside Ely for a few minutes waiting for the Kings Cross train to depart, but can they do it quickly enough, or would there need to be line speed improvements too?
If its overlayed with the current Peterborough service the turnaround at Ely will be around 95 minutes.

Minimum to change ends is 4 minutes although 3.5 is given at Cromer.
 

arb

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If its overlayed with the current Peterborough service the turnaround at Ely will be around 95 minutes.
95 minutes? Could something useful be done with that time ... say reverse and head into Cambridge? 5 minutes to reverse, 20 minutes to get to Cambridge, multiply by two to get back, and you've still got 45 minutes left for a turnaround at Cambridge. This would give you a direct service from Soham to Cambridge with no connections to worry about, that was being discussed upthread as a key driver for new passengers.
 

dk1

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95 minutes? Could something useful be done with that time ... say reverse and head into Cambridge? 5 minutes to reverse, 20 minutes to get to Cambridge, multiply by two to get back, and you've still got 45 minutes left for a turnaround at Cambridge. This would give you a direct service from Soham to Cambridge with no connections to worry about, that was being discussed upthread as a key driver for new passengers.
I wondered that but Ipswich & Colchester traincrew that are the only ones that work the Haughley to Ely route do not sign Cambridge to Ely. I would imagine it would just scoot off to the sidings then back later.
 

HowardGWR

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I wondered that but Ipswich & Colchester traincrew that are the only ones that work the Haughley to Ely route do not sign Cambridge to Ely. I would imagine it would just scoot off to the sidings then back later.
This underwrites one of the reasons why rail is so inflexible (and I understand the reasons that you explain). If one started a bus service, you would just say to the driver (as typically on a rail replacement bus) 'drive to X' please.
 

The exile

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This underwrites one of the reasons why rail is so inflexible (and I understand the reasons that you explain). If one started a bus service, you would just say to the driver (as typically on a rail replacement bus) 'drive to X' please.
Which is of course why double-deckers turn into open-top buses under bridges....
 

camflyer

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The West-to-North curve at Newmarket plus double tracking through Soham to Ely and Cambridge to Newmarket seems inevitable with RAF Mildenhall becoming a new town, but when?

The Newmarket curve does look like no-brainer for the cost of a short piece of track and a couple of junctions as it would open up so many new service possibilities. Maybe even a station at Fordham.

The redoubling of Newmarket to Cambridge is more complex and expensive but surely will need to be done at least in some sections
 

Maltazer

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The West-to-North curve at Newmarket plus double tracking through Soham to Ely and Cambridge to Newmarket seems inevitable with RAF Mildenhall becoming a new town, but when?

The Newmarket curve does look like no-brainer for the cost of a short piece of track and a couple of junctions as it would open up so many new service possibilities. Maybe even a station at Fordham.

The redoubling of Newmarket to Cambridge is more complex and expensive but surely will need to be done at least in some sections

A loop (and probably station) about halfway between Newmarket and Cambridge (Fulbourn?) at the very least. I suspect that's been done to death in other threads.

Or how about full-crayon and a new line from Thetford via Mildenhall to Soham (approaching from the south) and then on to Ely. EMR could use that for the Norwich-Liverpools and solve the Ely North bottleneck at the same time :p
 

William3000

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A loop (and probably station) about halfway between Newmarket and Cambridge (Fulbourn?) at the very least. I suspect that's been done to death in other threads.

Or how about full-crayon and a new line from Thetford via Mildenhall to Soham (approaching from the south) and then on to Ely. EMR could use that for the Norwich-Liverpools and solve the Ely North bottleneck at the same time :p
There is a loop at Dullingham - about 1.5km long, and a siding just west of Fulbourn station that could provide a second loop.
 

Taunton

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This underwrites one of the reasons why rail is so inflexible (and I understand the reasons that you explain). If one started a bus service, you would just say to the driver (as typically on a rail replacement bus) 'drive to X' please.
It's not only the bus driver. Aircraft crews do not need to train and "sign" for every airport they use, whose arrangements are far more varied than the standard signalling and layout on the railway. And of course the train driver is quite happy to drive their car at end of shift down roads they have not used before, absolutely without issue. Even driving their family on holiday to the South of France.
 

70014IronDuke

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The Newmarket curve does look like no-brainer for the cost of a short piece of track and a couple of junctions as it would open up so many new service possibilities. Maybe even a station at Fordham.

The redoubling of Newmarket to Cambridge is more complex and expensive but surely will need to be done at least in some sections

The length of running line might be short (700 metres or so?), but the cost of planning and installing the junctions, replete with signalling .... surely would be substantial? Nonethless - I hope, one day, it will happen, just wouldn't want to be so gung-ho on the justification regarding costs.
 

dk1

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It's not only the bus driver. Aircraft crews do not need to train and "sign" for every airport they use, whose arrangements are far more varied than the standard signalling and layout on the railway. And of course the train driver is quite happy to drive their car at end of shift down roads they have not used before, absolutely without issue. Even driving their family on holiday to the South of France.
I’m a train driver & i am never happy to drive my car. I only use it for work & Sainsbury's going the same way every time that it could almost drive itself. It would send shivers down my spine to drive to the English Riviera in Devon let alone the French one. Train every time almost everywhere for me.
 

Bald Rick

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The length of running line might be short (700 metres or so?), but the cost of planning and installing the junctions, replete with signalling .... surely would be substantial?

Would be £20m+, and would need a Transport and Works Act Order, having a very ‘well connected’ land owner who would no doubt have something to say (the Jockey Club).

And, frankly, little benefit. I’d love to know what all the new markets being spoken about are.
 

camflyer

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Would be £20m+, and would need a Transport and Works Act Order, having a very ‘well connected’ land owner who would no doubt have something to say (the Jockey Club).

And, frankly, little benefit. I’d love to know what all the new markets being spoken about are.

"New markets" to Newmarket. I like the sound of that slogan.

Cambridge to Soham. Seems pointless to have a Soham station without a direct service to Cambridge.
Newmarket to Ely and onwards to Peterborough
Maybe even a direct service to London from Newmarket
Extra route possibilities with the arrival or EWR.
Adds a useful diversion route.

Newmarket is a similar sized town to Stowmarket but the latter gets a much better rail service.
 

Bald Rick

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Cambridge to Soham. Seems pointless to have a Soham station without a direct service to Cambridge.
Newmarket to Ely and onwards to Peterborough

They are both new direct routes; what the chord would do is reduce journey time. There would have to be work on the Newmarket line, at Cambridge, and in the Soham line itself to accommodate the extra services. It gets very expensive, very quickly.

Maybe even a direct service to London from Newmarket

That could be done now, without spending £20m+ on a chord.
Extra route possibilities with the arrival or EWR.

What would they be?


I think the chord is very, very unlikely. Indeed I can’t see an hourly service at Soham anytime soon.
 

Neen Sollars

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What is a likely cost of the referred-to chord and all its associated infrastructure that will be required? I see a figure of £20 million being mentioned.
There is a thread somewhere, and a very interesting one. So yes it has been done to death. Unsure as to whether potential costs were discussed. But there were diagrams of a very elaborate in and out two train one platform system for Newmarket station.
 
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