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I would assume that the reason for requiring the onboard Wi-Fi is that without it, the catering team can not connect to it to receive the orders? Therefore if Wi-Fi is not available, neither is the catering.
This would ensure continuity of service and avoid the ‘I sent my order through 20 minutes ago. Where is it?’ issue.
I would assume that the reason for requiring the onboard Wi-Fi is that without it, the catering team can not connect to it to receive the orders? Therefore if Wi-Fi is not available, neither is the catering.
This would ensure continuity of service and avoid the ‘I sent my order through 20 minutes ago. Where is it?’ issue.
I’m ordering my breakfast today off my 5G in the British Airways Lounge at Heathrow. There’s no need for me to be connected to wifi for that, so why would there be for a train?
Posters always seem to fall into one of two two camps when the subject of on train catering is brought up, one stating that on board catering must be provided especially on long journeys and the other stating that is not needed any more due to "superior" shops at stations. Either way the TOCs can't seem to win on this topic!
I’m ordering my breakfast today off my 5G in the British Airways Lounge at Heathrow. There’s no need for me to be connected to wifi for that, so why would there be for a train?
That would be an ideal solution, if the order could actually get from the customer to the catering team.
As many have said it is odd how one operator has managed to implement this yet another is failing. In this modern age of constant connectivity it’s madness that something couldn’t be designed to make the process work.
Seems to me that there is a move to eradicate all standard class food and drink.
Only first class will be able to obtain food on-board in future.
Hull Trains, much hailed open access operator abandoned all STD class refreshments on all 14 of their daily trains over a year ago. No food or drink for over two hrs. People board at Retford and Grantham and there is nothing to eat or drink on the train. This is on the premier ECML!
According to a recent reply from Hull Trains on twitter, there are plans for some sort of catering in standard is again.
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Greater Anglia now close the cafe bar on 745/0 services for a period of time if there is only 1 catering member so they can take the trolley through standard class before reopening again.
It’s a relatively simple way of tying orders to the correct train. With LNER you either need the QR code or to enter your train details. If you bookmarked the LNER page you’d be ordering for the wrong train, whereas the Avanti system just recognises the WiFi network you’re coming from.
The main downside of it on Avanti that isn't the case on LNER is that on Avanti you have to connect to their wifi to use it, whereas on LNER you can use it from your data. The former would be OK but for that you have to create an account and sign your life away first.
As usual, FirstGroup had a fairly good idea and implemented it badly.
A trolley definitely wouldn't be better on an 11 car unit, you'd never see it. GWR is bad enough on their 9s and 10s. Plus the "shop" does proper bean coffee, not instant rubbish.
Though on the latter point, I'm much more of a cold beer guy than a coffee fan! Something else which is far better from a shop than a trolley, of course. That said, I was once on a lightly loaded GWR service out of Paddington on a warm day. Two staff came down with the trolley, which seemed extremely poorly stocked drinks wise, especially given we'd just left Paddington. I questioned it and was told that they'd done it deliberately as the drinks were in the fridge in the galley, as they sold them, one of the staff was going back and getting more. So where there's a will, there's a way!
It’s a relatively simple way of tying orders to the correct train. With LNER you either need the QR code or to enter your train details. If you bookmarked the LNER page you’d be ordering for the wrong train, whereas the Avanti system just recognises the WiFi network you’re coming from.
Posters always seem to fall into one of two two camps when the subject of on train catering is brought up, one stating that on board catering must be provided especially on long journeys and the other stating that is not needed any more due to "superior" shops at stations. Either way the TOCs can't seem to win on this topic!
The main downside of it on Avanti that isn't the case on LNER is that on Avanti you have to connect to their wifi to use it, whereas on LNER you can use it from your data.
Re trolleys on 11 coach Pendolinos, presumably they could have two trolleys, each serving a different part of the train, if they would sell enough to make it worthwhile?
I think the problem is a vicious circle - passengers think catering provision is uncertain, so they bring their own refreshments on board, so they don't use the buffet or trolley even if they are available, so catering loses money and is reduced or withdrawn. I'm travelling on Avanti next week and I certainly won't be relying on there being catering on board.
It’s a relatively simple way of tying orders to the correct train. With LNER you either need the QR code or to enter your train details. If you bookmarked the LNER page you’d be ordering for the wrong train, whereas the Avanti system just recognises the WiFi network you’re coming from.
I can never get the Avanti Wifi to work and when it does it work, I often get a message saying the wifi is insecure, which tends to put me off from using it. So for these reasons I would have not ordered using their at seat service.
I think the problem is a vicious circle - passengers think catering provision is uncertain, so they bring their own refreshments on board, so they don't use the buffet or trolley even if they are available, so catering loses money and is reduced or withdrawn. I'm travelling on Avanti next week and I certainly won't be relying on there being catering on board.
Tangential but…. Whilst I agree that it’s rare to see the trolley in a train that’s over 200m long, we keep having people moan about the 5+5 IET in place of a single nine coach train because “This incurs the extra cost of a second trolley”
IMHO there’s no way that a single trolley is sufficient on a train that length, just like a single Conductor/ Guard is going to struggle to deal with everything going on a train of that length
Either provide sufficient trolleys or don’t bother, but I’d rather know in advance that there won’t be one (so I can plan ahead) rather than hoping to eventually spot the single trolley on an extra long train
It doesn't really - unless you're very quick to bookmark, I am fairly sure it goes from a GET to a POST which removes the train details from the URL, so if you do bookmark it you just get a page telling you to scan the QR code, if I recall.
With regard to the staff end being active to receive orders, knowing that it is active and online isn't exactly hard. They aren't just sending emails!
The LNER system works well, and avoids shutting out people who don't want to connect to the Wifi for whatever reason, or who aren't allowed to because e.g. their company prohibits it. There's no reason to go into "but X doesn't work" as so often happens, because X *does* work on LNER's superior system.
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It's actually nearly zero risk because it's HTTPS encrypted and thus not actually insecure, but it's about perception (and overparanoid corporate security bods) - if people won't use it it won't be successful.
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Some people do it deliberately for a laugh, but knowing how that app works I don't know how you could unless you had location services turned off, which falls into the bracket of "getting your comeuppance for not using the tech properly", but isn't unusual among the paranoid.
I'm often startled at just how poor mobile data coverage is in when travelling around the UK by train; often within seconds of leaving a major station the signal drops off to nothing, even with a 5G enabled device on a decent network (Vodafone). On-train wifi suffers just the same of course, and that will always place limitations on how well any on board service relying on data or wifi is able to work. I wonder if LNER are just fortunate that their routes enjoy a broadly decent degree of coverage compared to Avanti? GWR will see similar hurdles no doubt in the west country in particular.
I'm often startled at just how poor mobile data coverage is in when travelling around the UK by train; often within seconds of leaving a major station the signal drops off to nothing, even with a 5G enabled device on a decent network (Vodafone). On-train wifi suffers just the same of course, and that will always place limitations on how well any on board service relying on data or wifi is able to work. I wonder if LNER are just fortunate that their routes enjoy a broadly decent degree of coverage compared to Avanti? GWR will see similar hurdles no doubt in the west country in particular.
I can get an EE signal pretty much all the way from MK to Edinburgh via Birmingham, so perhaps you need a better phone or a better network. Voda isn't terrible but does have quite a lot of gaps.
I believe at least some on-train wifi uses EE for that exact reason. Plus an aerial on the roof will give a better signal than one inside.
I can get an EE signal pretty much all the way from MK to Edinburgh via Birmingham, so perhaps you need a better phone or a better network. Voda isn't terrible but does have quite a lot of gaps.
I believe at least some on-train wifi uses EE for that exact reason. Plus an aerial on the roof will give a better signal than one inside.
Probably helps save on staffing costs as not needing 2 members of staff for the shop (unless the shop area was left unattended when the member of staff took an overpriced bottle of lager to coach U). Probably failed due to some lazy catering staff not wanting to walk to deliver the goods.
Back to the shop Vs proper trolley service arguments
I'm not sure calling the staff lazy is a fair judgement. Avanti didn't have enough staff to implement it properly. At the beginning, someone was diagrammed to do it however it quickly became apparent that there weren't sufficient numbers of staff to maintain it and work shop/1st class, leading to it only being available on certain routes.
The fact Avanti are roughly 200 catering staff less than when Virgin ran the franchise speaks volumes due to not backfilling vacancies.
I think it's fair to say anyone who ever attempted to enter the "Coach K messroom" before Standard Premium knew full well that the staff weren't innocent either.
I think it's fair to say anyone who ever attempted to enter the "Coach K messroom" before Standard Premium knew full well that the staff weren't innocent either.
It demonstrated that there certainly was a culture of laziness among some Virgin/Avanti on-board stewards, because they'd rather sit there chatting than be in the passenger accommodation doing their job. It was noticeable how much better the service on the East Coast, where that culture had not developed, was.
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