QueensCurve
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It is about time NATO woke up to the fact the its member states are under attack from Russia. How they respond may be a difficult question. We live in very dangerous times.
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Deliberate arson attacks on SNCF's network
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It is about time NATO woke up to the fact the its member states are under attack from Russia. How they respond may be a difficult question. We live in very dangerous times.
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D6130
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If I recall correctly, we reversed in the LGV platforms.
Having a friend who is a naval intelligence officer, I can assure you that NATO is fully aware of what the Russians are up to. It's down to the politicians of the member states to agree a strategy on how to react....which is no easy task given that some member states - particularly Greece and Turkey - disagree on almost everything as a matter of principle.
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The BBC reports that an attack was also planned for the LGV Sud-Est, but was foiled
Belperpete
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Must admit that I was surprised at just how many cables seemed to be in that bit of troughing. And almost all quite thin cables too, not the kind of large multicores that we get in the UK.
The fibre optic cables will take some time to repair, jointing them is not a quick job. Particularly if they have to splice in a new bit of cable, so joints at both ends. Not sure if they were lucky in targeting the fibre cables, but it does have more than a whiff of an inside job, of someone who knew what they were doing.
Howardh
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I'm surprised the French authorities haven't kept those details to themselves, now everyone considering an "attack" knows how to brig the rail to a standstill quite easily it seems? As for who are behind these attacks, I keep hearing "Russia"; do they have any athletes at the games entered under the Olympic Flag - as we did in Moscow in 1980??
signed
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Yes, 14 or 18
I don't think it's that of a mystery, you can bring out the any major piece of public infrastructure quite easily when you have access to the premises themselves (or most often even no access).
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It's not exactly rocket science to work out methods of crippling various pieces of infrastructure surely?
Giugiaro
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Knowing how to disrupt a railway line is quite easy and many people outside the railway industry (including railway enthusiasts) know what and where the core functions of the railway are.
I'm pretty sure our militaries know very well how to attack an enemy railway line and how to defend their own. It was common for the Engineering Corps to have sections or individual people knowledgeable on railway infrastructure and operation, to be able to use or attack it effectively during a war.
This is very obviously a deliberate coordinated attack, limited in that it's not intended to be a terrorist attack (i.e. injuring and killing passengers and staff) but disruptive enough to cause an enormous headache to the target.
I'm pretty sure our militaries know very well how to attack an enemy railway line and how to defend their own. It was common for the Engineering Corps to have sections or individual people knowledgeable on railway infrastructure and operation, to be able to use or attack it effectively during a war.
This is very obviously a deliberate coordinated attack, limited in that it's not intended to be a terrorist attack (i.e. injuring and killing passengers and staff) but disruptive enough to cause an enormous headache to the target.
After saying that here, are you confident that he is not now having "tea with no biscuits" with his boss?
LNW-GW Joint
Veteran Member
Is this not a "climate change" stunt (like Just Stop Oil?)?
What connects the action to "Russia" or anti-NATO?
What connects the action to "Russia" or anti-NATO?
Well, that's a new take on it! It will be interesting to see what the considered opinion of the "experts" is in the medium to longer term...
deltic
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Any idea what Eurostar services may be cancelled on Sunday? News reports suggest services will be disrupted on Saturday and Sunday but Eurostar are selling tickets on all trains still. Have family travelling to Paris on Sunday.
MadCommuter
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I think attacking a green form of transport would go against what JSO are trying to achieve? And they always make themselves known and claim responsibility so they can raise awareness of their cause.
We're being asked not to speculate, so here goes ... my guess is
50% likely that it's the usual suspects then
5% the organic farmers - recently blocaded the bulk terminal at Le Havre port so this would be an escalation
10% chance it's people who want a new government
10% it's people who don't want *that* new government
few% that it's a protest about the amount spent on the Olympics, or SNCF bosses' pay or ... add your own protest
The french rail unions issued a joint statement condemning the sabotage. I.e. 'although we want our pensions back we wouldn't stoop this low'.
Every french teenager has now seen on television how to identify cable channels on the railway and know how to gain notoriety.
50% likely that it's the usual suspects then
5% the organic farmers - recently blocaded the bulk terminal at Le Havre port so this would be an escalation
10% chance it's people who want a new government
10% it's people who don't want *that* new government
few% that it's a protest about the amount spent on the Olympics, or SNCF bosses' pay or ... add your own protest
The french rail unions issued a joint statement condemning the sabotage. I.e. 'although we want our pensions back we wouldn't stoop this low'.
Every french teenager has now seen on television how to identify cable channels on the railway and know how to gain notoriety.
Why are we acting like it was some sort of top secret thing until today? A quick internet search tells you how to identify it very easily.
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Agree that obfuscation is not security.
That it is in the news all day long and the disruption so massive makes a copy cat attack more likely is my guess, hope I'm wrong.
My sympathy is particularly with all the fibre technicians who got phone calls this morning telling them their weekend or holiday was off and who are working around the clock on the repairs. And the testing specialists after that.
There have been 2 cancellations I think today (both this evening) plus a lot of delays in the 1-2 hour category.
I think it may be reasonable to suppose that posts on RailUKforums are unlikely to be required reading for naval intelligence officers and their bosses.
The signalling on LGV Nord is 30 years old. Back then the French had not joined us innovative, thrusting Brits and still directly wired everything into local interlockings. The Germans still did until very recently. Hence the huge amount of cables, as every track circuit, and every set of points, will be cabled directly to the local interlocking.
norbitonflyer
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Family member travelling via Lille to Marseille (with an onward connection to make there) on Sunday. Do direct Lille-Marseille trains pass through the damaged site at Croisilles?
At least Eurostar can use the classic route in France. If HS1 were to go down no trains would be able to run. It ought to be possible to despatch security & immigration staff to Ashford but on past performance what would appear to be rather difficult.
If the 373s still had their third rail shoes kept and route knowledge maintained, then at least going via the pre-CTRL route would be preferable to a suspended service.
That seems an extreme considering the amount of times that this has been needed in the past. White elephant springs to mind.
Dren Ahmeti
Member
And god knows how many PTI issues have been caused by platform upgrades etc since they stopped running to Waterloo!
HS1 has bi-directional running, and uses it quite often for overtakes.
I've been trying to find out more, seems they are not saying much about the incident - and to be honest rightly so.
Where is the evidence of these 'fires'?
Just watched BBC verify on this, seems all very sketchy - seems to be HV sabotage, dont know what they have in troughs in France and the BBC could have been using stock footage.
Where is the evidence of these 'fires'?
Just watched BBC verify on this, seems all very sketchy - seems to be HV sabotage, dont know what they have in troughs in France and the BBC could have been using stock footage.
clearly they havent.
It's reported, reading Le Monde, some of the damage was from fire, some from cutting.
There is a criminal investigation into the damage and various other possible offences, attack on the national interest, data infrastructure and so on. Wider investigations coordinated by their anti-terrorism people.
Their structure is that their equivalent of our CPS ('parquet' and magistrates) runs the investigation from the start as well as the prosecution, although the legwork is done by the police forces (gendarmerie, police nationale plus police judicaire branch). The national organised crime prosecutors are in charge. My impression is that the parquet say little until they have a complete case, equivalent of charging here. Reported that 50 investigators are working already.
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