Cambrian Improvements Press Release

[merlodlliw]

This will interest a few of you, in case you miss it elsewhere.


PRESS RELEASE Shrewsbury to Aberystwyth Rail Passenger Association

(SARPA).



Mobile: removed

E-mail: removed


11 October 2011

Rail User Group AGM hears about improvements in the pipeline.





Saturday 8th October saw representatives from Arriva Trains Wales (ATW) attend the Shrewsbury to Aberystwyth Rail Passenger Association’s (SARPA) Annual General meeting in the White Lion Hotel Machynlleth. ATW Stakeholder Relationship Manager Ben Davies and Michael Vaughan told members that much needed Customer Information Screen were due to be installed at Welshpool, Caersws and Dyfi Junction stations by the end of 2011, these would be paid for by ATW themselves however stations in Ceredigion and Gwynedd would have to wait on European funding being confirmed before they saw their turn.



Members were somewhat dismayed to hear that the delay in the refurbishment of Aberystwyth station was down to funding issues. Despite being announced sometime ago it transpires that despite agreeing in principle it appears that the Welsh European Funding Office then conducted a time consuming full appraisal before agreeing to release funds. Members were told that work was due to start at the end of March 2012.



Messrs Davies and Vaughan from ATW stuck to the line that the company had no inkling what the Welsh Government would prioritise or not in its revised national transport plan which is due out in November and realistically even if a green light was given it would be May 2012 at the earliest before any additional services ran on the Cambrian. On a more positive note growth in patronage on the line continued and the new signalling system had at last settled down and punctuality on the Cambrian was now better than on the East Coast Mainline out of London’s King Cross station.



Members resolved to keep up pressure on the Welsh Government to introduce extra services on the line and utilise the £13 million spent on infrastructure to allow this to happen that is already complete. SARPA will next meet in Aberystwyth on Tuesday November 1st at 1800 in the Cambria Building on Pier St.







(ends)

 

[The Informer]

This will interest a few of you, in case you miss it elsewhere.


PRESS RELEASE Shrewsbury to Aberystwyth Rail Passenger Association

(SARPA).



Mobile: removed

E-mail: removed


11 October 2011

Rail User Group AGM hears about improvements in the pipeline.





Saturday 8th October saw representatives from Arriva Trains Wales (ATW) attend the Shrewsbury to Aberystwyth Rail Passenger Association’s (SARPA) Annual General meeting in the White Lion Hotel Machynlleth. ATW Stakeholder Relationship Manager Ben Davies and Michael Vaughan told members that much needed Customer Information Screen were due to be installed at Welshpool, Caersws and Dyfi Junction stations by the end of 2011, these would be paid for by ATW themselves however stations in Ceredigion and Gwynedd would have to wait on European funding being confirmed before they saw their turn.



Members were somewhat dismayed to hear that the delay in the refurbishment of Aberystwyth station was down to funding issues. Despite being announced sometime ago it transpires that despite agreeing in principle it appears that the Welsh European Funding Office then conducted a time consuming full appraisal before agreeing to release funds. Members were told that work was due to start at the end of March 2012.



Messrs Davies and Vaughan from ATW stuck to the line that the company had no inkling what the Welsh Government would prioritise or not in its revised national transport plan which is due out in November and realistically even if a green light was given it would be May 2012 at the earliest before any additional services ran on the Cambrian. On a more positive note growth in patronage on the line continued and the new signalling system had at last settled down and punctuality on the Cambrian was now better than on the East Coast Mainline out of London’s King Cross station.



Members resolved to keep up pressure on the Welsh Government to introduce extra services on the line and utilise the £13 million spent on infrastructure to allow this to happen that is already complete. SARPA will next meet in Aberystwyth on Tuesday November 1st at 1800 in the Cambria Building on Pier St.







(ends)

No mention of NR's "Cambrian Campaign" kicking off in the new year in that. Or maybe they just holding that little cherry back!

 

[Gareth Marston]

No mention of NR's "Cambrian Campaign" kicking off in the new year in that. Or maybe they just holding that little cherry back!

What is that suppose to be anyway? The £13 million infrastructure works are complete and etcs has been operational for 6 months.

 

[The Informer]

What is that suppose to be anyway? The £13 million infrastructure works are complete and etcs has been operational for 6 months.

The overall plan is to rid all the jointed sections on the route and replace with steel sleepers and CWR. The first area is between Forden and Montgomery old station starting straight after xmas. This will be done midweek nights doing approx 10 lengths per shift. They have also prepared hook-a-gate to sutton br and also work at westbury. I have the dates of all these projects plus others right through next year. This week also sees a full formation renewal at Sandilands near Tywyn. Pop in and say hello!

 

[Xenophon PCDGS]

The overall plan is to rid all the jointed sections on the route and replace with steel sleepers and CWR........ This week also sees a full formation renewal at Sandilands near Tywyn.

Once all this is completed, passengers should notice the difference.

 

[The Planner]

Means sod all unless they actually co-ordinate it all and get some speed increases out of it.

 

[YorkshireBear]

Can i ask about steel sleepers? Where are they used ihave never come across them ever?

 

[Gareth Marston]

Can i ask about steel sleepers? Where are they used ihave never come across them ever?

New DOWN loop between Welshpool and Fron and at Dyfi Jnc have them.
Welsh Highland Railway is entirely steel sleepers.
--- old post above --- --- new post below ---

Means sod all unless they actually co-ordinate it all and get some speed increases out of it.

Given the current record of actually utilising infrastructure improvements it is a big IF. Look at the dynamic loop at Welshpool and loop at Dyfi Jnc sitting rusting not seeing any use.

 

[Railsigns]

Welsh Highland Railway is entirely steel sleepers.

No it isn't. Plenty of timber sleepers are evident in the photos I've taken on that route.

 

[TDK]

The overall plan is to rid all the jointed sections on the route and replace with steel sleepers and CWR. The first area is between Forden and Montgomery old station starting straight after xmas. This will be done midweek nights doing approx 10 lengths per shift. They have also prepared hook-a-gate to sutton br and also work at westbury. I have the dates of all these projects plus others right through next year. This week also sees a full formation renewal at Sandilands near Tywyn. Pop in and say hello!

I didn't think that ERTMS worked very well with steel sleepers?

 

[Rhydgaled]

Members were somewhat dismayed to hear that the delay in the refurbishment of Aberystwyth station was down to funding issues. Despite being announced sometime ago it transpires that despite agreeing in principle it appears that the Welsh European Funding Office then conducted a time consuming full appraisal before agreeing to release funds. Members were told that work was due to start at the end of March 2012.

Any details of what the Aberystwyth station refurbishment would include beyond spoiling the front of the original building by hiding it behind huge, waste of money, steel lettering reading "HTYWTSYREBA", as illustrated on the nwrail website? That's Aberystwyth written backwards by the way, designed to be read from inside the station where it would face the right way. However, without demolishing the original building I very much doubt you would be able to see the whole word at once from that side.

In my opinion, having spent many hours waiting for buses there in the past year and a bit, all the station needs is a waiting room and cleaning and re-painting (in the current colour scheme not Arriva's vibrant turquoise) of the platform canopy.

 

[Gareth Marston]

No it isn't. Plenty of timber sleepers are evident in the photos I've taken on that route.

Apologies it was 5 years ago when I audited them and ploughed through letters of credit from India for the steel sleepers the bits completed recently must have been back to timber.
--- old post above --- --- new post below ---

Any details of what the Aberystwyth station refurbishment would include beyond spoiling the front of the original building by hiding it behind huge, waste of money, steel lettering reading "HTYWTSYREBA", as illustrated on the nwrail website? That's Aberystwyth written backwards by the way, designed to be read from inside the station where it would face the right way. However, without demolishing the original building I very much doubt you would be able to see the whole word at once from that side.

In my opinion, having spent many hours waiting for buses there in the past year and a bit, all the station needs is a waiting room and cleaning and re-painting (in the current colour scheme not Arriva's vibrant turquoise) of the platform canopy.

Extending the canopy is one thing if heard plus a general refurbishment of the buildings also heard the silly sign is now off the agenda.
--- old post above --- --- new post below ---

I didn't think that ERTMS worked very well with steel sleepers?

The current issue with ertms is wheelslip the software isnt programmed for it and shuts down the computer - there was an overnight storm in September and the 1st Up from Aber had huge problems on Talerddig. Having rhtt down as far a Mach every night.
--- old post above --- --- new post below ---
Running degraded this morning and trains over an hour late even though RHTT went down last night.

 

[The Informer]

Means sod all unless they actually co-ordinate it all and get some speed increases out of it.

Means quite a lot to the maintenance engineers. If you actually went out and done a length walk you would realise how welcoming this work is.

 

[The Planner]

Maybe so, but has anyone gone away and thought "right, we can get the speed up on this section" and then gone and asked what benefits that has and so on.... Id bet a tenner no one has.

 

[tirphil]

The overall plan is to rid all the jointed sections on the route and replace with steel sleepers and CWR. The first area is between Forden and Montgomery old station starting straight after xmas. This will be done midweek nights doing approx 10 lengths per shift. They have also prepared hook-a-gate to sutton br and also work at westbury. I have the dates of all these projects plus others right through next year. This week also sees a full formation renewal at Sandilands near Tywyn. Pop in and say hello!

But there has been a drop of jointed rail ready for relaying in the Llandanwg - Clogwyn Harlech area. I was surprised to see it last week I must confess.

 

[The Informer]

But there has been a drop of jointed rail ready for relaying in the Llandanwg - Clogwyn Harlech area. I was surprised to see it last week I must confess.

Yes its getting done this week. The “overall” plan could literally take years and some re-railing sites will still more than likely go ahead as they have already been signed off and could give some areas a medium term life extension. There are some sections which will obviously get priority over others and the re-railing enables the worse areas to get the full renewal treatment first!

 

[tirphil]

Thanks for the info. Much appreciated.

 

[The Informer]

Just for the record... The renewal at Sandilands (Tywyn) this week is a full formation renewal with concrete EG47 fastclip. A little over engineered for the cambrian but with the sea defence next to it a little bit more robustness is a good choice.

 

[tirphil]

Is the plan for something similar at Llanaber - Caeddaniel stretch?

 

[Rhydgaled]

Given the current record of actually utilising infrastructure improvements it is a big IF. Look at the dynamic loop at Welshpool and loop at Dyfi Jnc sitting rusting not seeing any use.

Some pretty seriously poor service on the Cambrian this week. On Monday evening I think the 17:30 from Aberystwyth was canceled and replaced with a bus. The following train, 19:30, was reading as about 68mins late on one of the destonation displays (the other two still claimed the train was on time!), similar story at 13:30 today. Is ERTMS playing up again, or did they not raise Dovey Junction high enough to avoid the floods?

Either way, the fact that a few trains have been (apparently, didn't stay to see when they actually turned up) running an hour late perhaps means they have crossed inbound services using the new loops?

 

[Gareth Marston]

Some pretty seriously poor service on the Cambrian this week. On Monday evening I think the 17:30 from Aberystwyth was canceled and replaced with a bus. The following train, 19:30, was reading as about 68mins late on one of the destonation displays (the other two still claimed the train was on time!), similar story at 13:30 today. Is ERTMS playing up again, or did they not raise Dovey Junction high enough to avoid the floods?

Either way, the fact that a few trains have been (apparently, didn't stay to see when they actually turned up) running an hour late perhaps means they have crossed inbound services using the new loops?

The contractor at Tywyn stuck his digger through the ertms cable and shut the entire Cambrian down they managed to reboot it after an hour but ensuing chaos predictable as reported. Also problems in West Midlands with cable theft delaying inbound Cambrian trains and a driver stepping down onto track managed to break his leg with lengthy delays ensuing. Axle counters between Newtown and Mach had to be re set one day as well as they all decided to fail.

Welshpool did see some use I'm told but also heard that trains were held at Mach when Dyfi Jnc could have been used.

 

[507 001]

New DOWN loop between Welshpool and Fron and at Dyfi Jnc have them.
Welsh Highland Railway is entirely steel sleepers.
--- old post above --- --- new post below ---


Given the current record of actually utilising infrastructure improvements it is a big IF. Look at the dynamic loop at Welshpool and loop at Dyfi Jnc sitting rusting not seeing any use.

The WHR is mostly steel sleepered, the only section that isnt is phase 4 through the Aberglaslyn and onwards towards Port. It was done on the behest of the HRA (IIRC after a lot of it had already been layed with steel sleepers) for aesthetic reasons as people can walk pretty close to the line through the pass and in port itself.
The wooden sleepers start a little after Rhyd Ddu.



now this may seem like a stupid question (It does to me as I pride myself on being pretty clued up on these things) but what exactly is a dynamic loop?

 

[merlodlliw]

now this may seem like a stupid question (It does to me as I pride myself on being pretty clued up on these things) but what exactly is a dynamic loop?[/QUOTE]

dynamic loops being double tracks.


We hopefully will be having two dynamic loops, between Saltney & Wrexham, one between Saltney & the underbridge then underbridge to Gresford Bank.
Both will be several miles long & allow trains to pass at speed,in place of the current practice of trains waiting at each end of the double track(Saltney & Wrexham Gerneral stn)
Current if the up train is ten minutes late onto the single track to Wrexham , the down will also be late into Chester, extra dwell time is used at both Stations to allow for late running
and only three trains an hour can be accommodated on the twelve mile length, making it ATWs worst bottleneck in Nth Wales.

 

[507 001]

now this may seem like a stupid question (It does to me as I pride myself on being pretty clued up on these things) but what exactly is a dynamic loop?

dynamic loops being double tracks.


We hopefully will be having two dynamic loops, between Saltney & Wrexham, one between Saltney & the underbridge then underbridge to Gresford Bank.
Both will be several miles long & allow trains to pass at speed,in place of the current practice of trains waiting at each end of the double track(Saltney & Wrexham Gerneral stn)
Current if the up train is ten minutes late onto the single track to Wrexham , the down will also be late into Chester, extra dwell time is used at both Stations to allow for late running
and only three trains an hour can be accommodated on the twelve mile length, making it ATWs worst bottleneck in Nth Wales.[/QUOTE]

Maybe I should rephrase my question, what is the difference between a dynamic loop and a normal passing loop?

 

[Rhydgaled]

Maybe I should rephrase my question, what is the difference between a dynamic loop and a normal passing loop?

I believe the difference is a dynamic one is much longer, allowing units to pass without stopping. eg. at the passing loop between Machynllyth and Newtown (Talgerddig or something like that) the first unit to arrive at the passing loop always (or nearly always) has to come to a stand. However, with a dynamic loop, I think the first unit could enter on one line and keep moving for some time. By the time it reached the end of the loop, the train coming the other way would have already entered the double-track section.

In other words, a dynamic loop is sort-of halfway between a normal passing loop on a single track railway and a double-track railway.

 

[merlodlliw]

I believe the difference is a dynamic one is much longer, allowing units to pass without stopping. eg. at the passing loop between Machynllyth and Newtown (Talgerddig or something like that) the first unit to arrive at the passing loop always (or nearly always) has to come to a stand. However, with a dynamic loop, I think the first unit could enter on one line and keep moving for some time. By the time it reached the end of the loop, the train coming the other way would have already entered the double-track section.

In other words, a dynamic loop is sort-of halfway between a normal passing loop on a single track railway and a double-track railway.

correct the idea is to pass without stopping, that's the reason dynamic loops are long in length as compared to passing loops,fail safe signalling is also key to its use, I presume the Saltney/Wrexham will become one of the busiest dynamic loops in Wales, if the go ahead to construct is given on the 3rd of November. The freight bottleneck would also be resolved
especially if the millions of tons of shale are to be removed by rail from Bersham tip.
Bob

 

[Rhydgaled]

Extending the canopy is one thing if heard plus a general refurbishment of the buildings also heard the silly sign is now off the agenda.

Why extend the canopy? It needs tidying up but is long enough I think, unless they are going to start running longer trains.

Anyway, I'm resurecting this old topic because I've just seen in the Aberystwyth University Courier newspaper that £2.3m is to be spent on the station area, and that plans are to pass their finally hurdle on December 8th. The artist's impression doesn't show that side of the station, but the BR logo at the end of HTYWTSYREBA does appear. I assume the rest of the sign is still there (the logo on it's own, without the glass canopy above it and the backwards word, could be alright I think). Perhaps there is something that can be done to stop the silly sign, you managed to get the seats on the refurbed 158s to line up with less window pillars and more windows.

I want to have my say on what I think of the sign (and also putting in a waiting room and a bus stand for TrawsCambria in front of the GWR building where a car park currently is, instead of having to cross the taxi road to reach the TrawsCambria stand) but I can't find the planning application on hte council's website to comment on it.

 

[anthony263]

The wales transport plan is supposed to being released today so it might have some interesting bits in it to read.

 

[merlodlliw]

see press comments on Wag Express thread.

Bob