I thought the proposal was power generation cars with electric motors in the intermediate coaches, rather than locomotive powercars with unpowered trailers.Could have rather slow acceleration and since there are many stops on the Cross Country route quite close, that could be a bit...
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Perfect CrossCountry train
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J-2739
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Yeah, I think that was in the proposal and in my opinion, what they should be doing. Locos don't have much of a place in a busy intercity railway like the Cross Country to be honest.
SpacePhoenix
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Is that compressor that's missing from the end coaches just to do with the tilt system or to do with something else? If it's purely for the tilt mechanism then would they be allowed to run with the tilt mechanism permanently disabled or removed (and whatever bits locked permantly into place)? I think it was mentioned somewhere that the speed limit difference between tilt and non-tilt isn't too much. My gut feeling is that none of the Voyagers and maybe non of Virgin's Pendolinios will ever reach 140mph in service before retirement
The compressor that's in the 603 luggage compartment is for the brakes, the compressors usually on the train are in the intermediate coaches which are currently in 142 & 143. The tilt computer is in the 608 car, without that, the train cannot tilt. There's no speed limit difference between units with tilt and without tilt, it's just some line speeds (WCML) allows higher speeds with tilt enabled trains (to a maximum of 125).
SpacePhoenix
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Do 222s also only have the compressors for the brakes in the intermediate coaches only?
I'm not entirely sure, but being as they're basically a 220 I'd say so yes.
I agree with you about the Voyagers as they are 125mph units (I used to think they they were 140 as well), but I'm not so sure about the Pendolinos.
sprinterguy
Established Member
Definitely booked to run as an 8-car formation, that one (the 13:07 Edinburgh - Plymouth), but has been known to run "longformed" when Voyager diagrams are out of kilter.
hulabaloo
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Could have rather slow acceleration and since there are many stops on the Cross Country route quite close, that could be a bit...
The Railjet in Austria doesn't seem to suffer with this. Now that's a comfortable journey.
Tetchytyke
Veteran Member
The 1125 Plymouth-Dundee relatively often chucks up a 221+220 between Bristol and Newcastle, because of where the trains have been earlier in the diagram. And that's one of the only doubled-up trains XC routinely run.
I didn't have many issues with the Voyagers before Arriva started arsing about with them. There just wasn't enough of them to run sufficient numbers as doubles through the core. The only way of sorting that now would be to buy new trains to strengthen the fleet. But there's nothing inherently wrong with the 220/221s (although putting the buffet counter back in would be a start).
Bletchleyite
Veteran Member
Not with those awful First Class seats that flop back when you lean into them.
Standard is OK, though, having the same seats as GWR HSTs.
sprinterguy
Established Member
Also booked for a pair of 4-car units, but you're right that that working does seem to produce a 220+221 formation fairly regularly.
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