Darklord8899
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Now, that's interesting.... I don't recall ever hitting my head on the lower deck of a Gemini, but I do remember doing so on the Scanias, more than once! (I'm 6'1")
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Lothian Buses and ECB Discussion
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Now, that's interesting.... I don't recall ever hitting my head on the lower deck of a Gemini, but I do remember doing so on the Scanias, more than once! (I'm 6'1")
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ScotRail158725
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Gemini 3 lower deck is fine its the upper deck that has no headroom
Jordan Adam
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I wouldn't go on the upper deck of the Gemini 3's anyway! Floors are bouncy enough as it is.
ScotRail158725
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Lol, up until the 26s its good build quality but since the Skylinks its all deteriorated
Jordan Adam
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I went on the 18 plates when new and the build quality even then was awful, the whole upper deck flooring was bending and flexing as people walked along it (you could even see it on the lower deck), while nearly ever panel was rattling or squeaking. Some of the plastic trim on the interior felt more like polystyrene!
OmniCity999
Established Member
/sigh/
SpeedbirdA350
Member
I assume this (quality of Wrightbus on 18 plates) was one of the reasons Lothian spoke with ADL. I am quite pleased with the quality of the B8L, apart from the little bits that stick out at the back of the bus of course.
Darklord8899
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This is possibly why I've never felt the urge to go upstairs on a Gemini and yes, I've seen that as well Jordan, several times I've felt like someone was gonna come through the floor!
90019
Established Member
Wrightbus build quality fell off a cliff in 2017.
The 18 plate Gemini 3s are awful, they felt like they were falling to bits as soon as they were delivered, especially on Edinburgh's roads.
The 18 plate Gemini 3s are awful, they felt like they were falling to bits as soon as they were delivered, especially on Edinburgh's roads.
Wrightbus used to be really good, the old cadet and commanders seemed to go on for ages and still do, you only have to look at the Streetlite to see how far they have fallen, to be honest I'd rather have a journey on a Solo or dare I say it Alero rather than a Streetlite.
There was a one-off Leyland Leopard new in the early sixties that wasn't retired until the late eighties.
Some Mid seventies Atlanteans too that carried on as driver trainers until 2002.
OmniCity999
Established Member
These sticky out bits, are they black and do they light up? These are markers to ensure the driver can see the rear of their vehicle, especially at night. They are very handy and i believe after a certain length they are a legal requirement.
The coaches and B8L's have them fitted. They are relatively flexible so if it were to hit a car or a person, it wouldnt cause damage.
They might not be liked but they are incredibly valuable.
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Darklord8899
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I saw them on a B8L the other day..... thought to myself "Well, they ain't gonna last long" (didn't realise that they were flexible)
OmniCity999
Established Member
More commonly seen on trucks, but becoming more common on longer buses as they are helpful aids to the driver.
SpeedbirdA350
Member
Yes, that's them. I thought they were made with strong hard plastic and would cause issue with damage but I am pleased they are flexible. I assume similar to a silicone based substance?
OmniCity999
Established Member
Strong enough to not bend in the breeze but flexible enough to fold in half.
I always go upstairs on a decker , never feels right to sit downstairs on one
Jordan Adam
Established Member
The decline in build quality at Wrightbus started in around 2009/10, however it was around 2014/15 that it really started to go downhill and show more clearly. They've still not sorted out the leaking issues on Streetlites and Streetdecks/Gemini 3s! Sit upstairs at the front of one on a rainy day and you'll get soaked... The Streetlite is by far their worst creation to date, however the rest of the range is pretty poor, the fact bits of trim inside the Eclipse 3 are over 20 years old makes me laugh.
Thing is, unless you import from the likes of Scania (if they still do the omnicity) your only real choices for deckers are Wrightbus or ADL, Optare at a push but the Metrodecker hasn't set the bus world alight for double deckers unless I have forgotten somebody.
Jordan Adam
Established Member
"Awaits comments about Reading Buses buying Metrodeckers..." To summarise there's more Hydrogen Powered Vanhool A330s in service in the UK than Optare Metrodeckers! Not to mention the Metrodecker is a little outdated compared to the other options.
The E400MMC is a good enough product. The Cummins engine is dependable enough too, one of the issues Volvos of late have had is the engines going "kaput".
ScotRail158725
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In late 2017/early 2018 everyone turned away from Wrightbus. Lothian, Metroline, First Bristol/Leicester
As with anything, you have to adapt to be able to compete, ADL seem to be the only ones that are, it is just a shame that their only competition is from Optare (who I don't really think wanted to offer a double deck solution and were happy with their mini/midibus market) and Wrightbus who as stated earlier wants to put a bus on the road with 20 year old parts and market it as new, I am shocked at how much they are falling apart.
I seriously doubt Wrightbus are putting out buses with parts that are 20 years old. It might be a 20 year old design but not 20 year old parts.
Jordan Adam
Established Member
I think you got what i was saying wrong, the parts are 20 year old in that they were first used on the original Eclipse design 20 years ago, however the physical parts on new buses are brand new.
It's sort of like how a Optare Solo SR built today would physically be brand new, however it's a 11 year old design as the concept was first introduced in 2008.
Indeed.
Scania disappeared from the making bodies for buses after the introduction of the Citywide if my recollection serves me correctly, instead letting ADL, Wrightbus etc pick up the work.
Sam
Gingerbus1991
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Despite the older parts used, if it ain't broken don't change it, I think optare still build a decent bus
Jordan Adam
Established Member
With Optare it really varies on specification. Mercedes/Alison's Solo SR's are great, but the Cummins/Voith ones are nearly on par with being as awful as a Streetlite.
Interesting you say that, I used to detest the old 01/02 plate Solo's that First Manchester had. Always felt like they were struggling to move anywhere and were incredibly noisy, the Cummins ones were completely opposite in my view going like **** of a shovel.
Sam
Jordan Adam
Established Member
I'd agree with you there, however the Solos these days are vastly different to those nearly 20 years ago.
The Cummins/Voith ones on offer now are not slow, but they're hardly fast and i suppose the biggest issue with them is the sheer vibrations you get off the engine. The Merc/Alison's ones on the otherhand are smooth, fast and don't rattle half as much!
I didn't mean 20 year old parts in that sense, more that it was a 20 year old design, my apologies. In terms of the mini/midibus sector, ADL have not produced a proper short lightweight bus like Optare have with the Solo and Wrightbus to a lesser extent with the Streetlite, what they would probably call an Enviro 100. Optare I can remember reading were not going to do anything with the Metrodecker as previous double deck efforts had not gone as well. The thing is getting back to Lothian, they have tried Wrightbus, they were big customers for over a decade, surely you would think that in order to keep Lothian, they would actually listen to their customers instead of losing orders hand over fist to ADL.
I also have to ask, how have the other types seemed to fare in Lothian's fleet other than the usual Wrightbus fare, I know the original Hybrid deckers had their issues, but how have the volvo electric buses and the streetair's (I know they are wrightbus too) been?
I also have to ask, how have the other types seemed to fare in Lothian's fleet other than the usual Wrightbus fare, I know the original Hybrid deckers had their issues, but how have the volvo electric buses and the streetair's (I know they are wrightbus too) been?
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