Seat layout map for East Coast stock

Justin Smith · 3 Apr 2010

Does anyone know were I can find a seat layout map for East Coast coaching stock ?

My wife and I are going up to Aberdeen and I phoned up (and paid an extra 10%.....) so I could select the Duo seats in the First class, i.e. the opposed singles.
We've got L51AN/53AN one way and 31AN/33AN the other, are they the Duo seats ?

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MCR247 · 4 Apr 2010

Wouldn't you have got those seats if you specified seats with a 'view' and 'window' online?

Justin Smith · 4 Apr 2010

MCR247 said:
Wouldn't you have got those seats if you specified seats with a 'view' and 'window' online?

Apparently not, you would be just as likely to get the window seats in a "four", and obviously the Duo seats are more comfy for a couple travelling together.
The person on the telephone booking line said that, at the moment, the only way you can book a specific seat is by phoning. The thing is by doing that you don't get the 10% discount for Online bookings, and two first class tickets from Sheffield to Aberdeen (even 1st Advance) are about £222 !
We're actually getting the East Coast train from Doncaster because an HST is a lot more comfy, quieter and more refined than a Voyager, and we're going to be on it a long time.......

yorkie · 4 Apr 2010

MCR247 said:
Wouldn't you have got those seats if you specified seats with a 'view' and 'window' online?

Roughly 50% chance of being allocated them. However it does tell you the seat numbers before you pay, and you can change them (you can't choose them as such but it you can make it give you a different allocation) and you can keep doing that until it (hopefully) gives suitable seats. But without a diagram there would be only a 50% chance as you'd have no way of knowing if they were at a table of 2 or 4.

LE Greys · 5 Apr 2010

AFAIK, window seats are odd-numbered and aisle seats are even-numbered since the 'Mallard' refurb, but I'm not entirely certain. However, a window seat does not guarantee a window. If you're really unlucky, there are four seats with a nice view of a plastic window pillar in each coach.

rail-britain · 5 Apr 2010

Justin Smith said:
so I could select the Duo seats in the First class, i.e. the opposed singles.
We`ve got L51AN/53AN one way and 31AN/33AN the other, are they the Duo seats ?

The first two are Coach L 51 and 53, these are opposite each other on a table of four
The next two are Coach L 31 and 33, these are also opposite each other on a table of four

If you want the tables of two, the numbers are :
Coach L; 11/13, 19/21, 27/29, 39/41, 47/49, 55/57, 63/65
Coach M; 3/5, and then same as above

Justin Smith · 6 Apr 2010

rail-britain said:
The first two are Coach L 51 and 53, these are opposite each other on a table of four
The next two are Coach L 31 and 33, these are also opposite each other on a table of four

If you want the tables of two, the numbers are :
Coach L; 11/13, 19/21, 27/29, 39/41, 47/49, 55/57, 63/65
Coach M; 3/5, and then same as above

Bleedin' hell, I'll get onto them first chance I get then. I'll be a bit annoyed actually because, as explained above, I paid an extra £22 so as to ensure we got the Duo seats and the chap said we had got them !

--- old post above --- --- new post below ---

rail-britain said:
The first two are Coach L 51 and 53, these are opposite each other on a table of four
The next two are Coach L 31 and 33, these are also opposite each other on a table of four

If you want the tables of two, the numbers are :
Coach L; 11/13, 19/21, 27/29, 39/41, 47/49, 55/57, 63/65
Coach M; 3/5, and then same as above

I've just phoned up East Coast and they said that for the outbound journey we have indeed got the two window seats on a table of 4, but for the return journey we've got the table of 2 which we were supposed to have.
The outbound trip requires a change at Edinburgh so I assume that's a Mk4 coach, the return is direct from Aberdeen to Doncaster so that'll be Mk3 coaches on an HST.
Some people may feel I'm being a bit fussy, but my wife is not a particular fan of train travel so I wanted to make it as pleasant as possible, and obviously having a table to yourself is nicer.
I must confess to feeling a bit annoyed because I paid an extra £22 and now I've just been told by East Coast that not only have we not got a table of 2 but there are no tables of 2 left to book on that outbound train, despite the fact that it's still 2 months away.
Basically I've paid £22 just to get what I want on the return half of the journey, that's effectively a seat booking fee of £11 per seat, and that's a bit steep I feel !

jon0844 · 6 Apr 2010

I'd ask for a refund of the £11 given that you paid someone to book it for you, and then on the day perhaps ask someone nicely if they'll swap.

When I last went to Edinburgh when it was still GNER, we were in first class on a table of four and there was nobody else with us anyway! This was mid-morning though.

Justin Smith · 7 Apr 2010

jonmorris0844 said:
I'd ask for a refund of the £11 given that you paid someone to book it for you, and then on the day perhaps ask someone nicely if they'll swap.

When I last went to Edinburgh when it was still GNER, we were in first class on a table of four and there was nobody else with us anyway! This was mid-morning though.

You're right a table for four is even better than one for two, but only if you've got it for yourselves !
The lady at Eastcoast offered to cancel the tickets, but that then puts us back to square one, and knowing our luck the price and avaiability on the internet will probably have changed by now.
I'll certainly be asking for a refund of all the £22 if we get on the train at Aberdeen and find we've not even got the two seat table for that leg.
Sods law being what it is, we'll get on the trains and they'll be half empty anyway !

At least we've got the better seats for the longer leg, I think it's 6 hours from Aberdeen to Doncaster !
The interesting thing is the service seems to take about 30min longer than it should and doesn't call at Leuchars, Kirkaldy and Inverkeithing, so I'm wondering if it's been diverted due to engineering works.

jopsuk · 7 Apr 2010

Sundays in May (except 2nd):

All-day, engineering work will be taking place between Edinburgh and Inverkeithing.

Trains to and from Aberdeen will take a diversionary route and will be unable to call at Inverkeithing, Kirkcaldy or Leuchars. Rail replacement coaches will operate in both directions between Edinburgh, Inverkeithing, Kirkcaldy, Leuchars and Dundee.

Sundays 6th and 13th in June:

All-day, engineering work will be taking place between Leuchars and Dundee.

Trains to and from Aberdeen will take a diversionary route and will be unable to call at Inverkeithing, Kirkcaldy or Leuchars. Rail replacement coaches will operate in both directions between Edinburgh, Inverkeithing, Kirkcaldy , Leuchars and Dundee.

At a guess, you'll be running non-stop Dundee-Edinburgh Haymarket via Perth, Stirling and Falkirk

Justin Smith · 7 Apr 2010

jopsuk said:
Sundays in May (except 2nd):

Sundays 6th and 13th in June:

At a guess, you'll be running non-stop Dundee-Edinburgh Haymarket via Perth, Stirling and Falkirk

Sounds about right although our train is actually on a Saturday, or it should be !
On the one hand it`ll get me on a bit of track I haven`t been on, but on the other hand it`ll add half an hour to the trip and we`ll miss going over the Tay bridge and the greatest bridge in the world, namely, of course, the Forth Bridge.

rail-britain · 10 Apr 2010

Apologies for slightly incorrect info for your return journey, I assumed it was a HST throughout as you didn't give any details for a change of train

I tend to always book tables of two, rather than four, when travelling myself
There are also some good tables of one, but it depends on the type of train
Equally, I have most of the seat plans for long distance trains which makes booking seats easier

If you have advance tickets then you can enquire about a change of seat
If you have other types of tickets then you can enquire about a new reservation, to see what is available, if a better seat is available book that, then present your original reservation and ask them to cancel that
I did that last year on my ATW Cardiff - Crewe, although I had to book it to Chester, "That train doesn't call at Crewe"

neelie · 26 Apr 2010

I'm going to Aberdeen with a change at Edinburgh and then onward to Kyle of Lochalsh but its too early to get tickets.

I'd love to know where to find seat plans for East coast trains and Scotrail - I have impaired mobility and need to be on the aisle and fairly near the door.

I've had no success with search engines.

silentone · 26 Apr 2010

neelie said:
I'm going to Aberdeen with a change at Edinburgh and then onward to Kyle of Lochalsh but its too early to get tickets.

I'd love to know where to find seat plans for East coast trains and Scotrail - I have impaired mobility and need to be on the aisle and fairly near the door.

I've had no success with search engines.

When booking you should be allocated one of the priority seats which are located at the end of each carriage near the doors, they also tend to have slightly more legroom. You could also be allocated a seat in Coach F, this has wheelchair access and provides additional space to allow for easier access.

Pumbaa · 26 Apr 2010

Here we go - looks tatty but perfectly accurate!

jon0844 · 26 Apr 2010

What is the reason for the odd coach letters, compared to before (ABCDE...) and now with letters missed out?

DaveNewcastle · 26 Apr 2010

Pumbaa said:
Here we go - looks tatty but perfectly accurate!

and VERY usefull, thanks. That's the seating plan for the 225's / 91's.

What about the HSTs? Do any of us have an up-to-date seat plan for EC's HSTs?

Failed Unit · 27 Apr 2010

jonmorris0844 said:
What is the reason for the odd coach letters, compared to before (ABCDE...) and now with letters missed out?

It goes back to the days of smoking. The smoking car was always b so on the hst coach a was the gaurds van and a wasn't needed on the mk4 as the last coach could be b. When smoking was banned coach a is the baggage space for reservations so both kinds of sets start with b as the first passenger car. B is always the quite coach. We the have the standards taking us to f with the disabled bit. Hst has 6 standard hence g which is missing on mk4. Mk4 have catering standard which is why the have h and the hst don't. The hst has catering first which is j and missing from the mk4. The extra first is k on the mk4 missing on the hst. The l is on both sets which is the 1st with disabled access. M was the first with smoking. Finally on mk4 the dvt is p. I is missing on all uk trains.

Just to add at the time this was done the mallard refurb was happening so it so the quite coach also always had the same letter. These were the options.

Hst
a b c d e f j l m

mk4
b c d e f g j m l non refurbished normal
b c d e f j k l m non refurbished Pullman
b c d e f h k l m mallard

the f was always the wheelchair as stated above

the eurostar sets followed a similar logic just can't remember it the standard at the kings cross end went upto v iirc

I think gner did it so a passenger knows that coaches h and below are always standard and j and above always first.

jon0844 · 27 Apr 2010

Thank you so much. I will see how long it is until I forget all of that! Probably about a second after I close the window.

Justin Smith · 13 Jun 2010

Well we`ve just got back from our trip and when we actually got on the trains I found out that none of the seats booked for us were the "Duo" type.
As it happens it didn`t matter because the trains weren`t that full in First class, but the fact remains that I paid an extra £20 odd for buggar all and I`m not very happy about it. I`m thinking of phoning East Coast to complain but it`s all extra hassle....
Still, it`s the principle, so we`ll see what happens.

Incidentally we changed from the East Coast HST onto a Cross Country Voyager at Newcastle (both First class) and I have to say the difference was HUGE, even my wife commented on it. The Voyager was noisier and seemed more cramped, the constant noise and vibration of the engine was annoying after the relative silence of the HST, and then there`s the smell of those chemical toilets.......
What a difference, and the 1970s train was the best !
Progress ?
I don`t think so.

Failed Unit · 13 Jun 2010

You have restricted views on a Voyager

I wonder when we can have an online system similar to the airlines where we can point and click at the seats we want.

MCR247 · 13 Jun 2010

You can on CrossCountry I think

route:oxford · 13 Jun 2010

Failed Unit said:
You have restricted views on a Voyager I wonder when we can have an online system similar to the airlines where we can point and click at the seats we want.

Maybe if they switched to a booking system similar to Ryanair, there would be the income available to cover the costs. £10 each way should about cover it.

Ideally linked to an electronic seat reservation system on the trains that would permit a £5 refund if a seat was cancelled on-line prior to the booked departure time. This would help mitigate the rows of empty, yet "reserved" seats found on many departures.

Failed Unit · 13 Jun 2010

route:oxford said:
Maybe if they switched to a booking system similar to Ryanair, there would be the income available to cover the costs. £10 each way should about cover it.

Ideally linked to an electronic seat reservation system on the trains that would permit a £5 refund if a seat was cancelled on-line prior to the booked departure time. This would help mitigate the rows of empty, yet "reserved" seats found on many departures.

You can do it in Italy for free, on the TVM's for that matter. But thier "eurostar" services are reservation only.

If xc can do it that is quite good considering their trains reverse on route so much.

neelie · 14 Jun 2010

I've found a seating plan (without numbering) in East Coast's "Disabled Person's Protection Policy" which I picked up at York station. It shows coach L (first class) and coach F (standard class) for HST trains and InterCity 225 trains. I'm going to ask for assistance next time I travel because even if I had a seating plan I can't always tell from the carriage which way round it is. The last time I travelled the carriage were back to front and there wasn't time to get off and get in at the other end.

Justin Smith · 14 Jun 2010

Justin Smith said:
Well we've just got back from our trip and when we actually got on the trains I found out that none of the seats booked for us were the "Duo" type.
As it happens it didn't matter because the trains weren't that full in First class, but the fact remains that I paid an extra £20 odd for buggar all and I'm not very happy about it. I'm thinking of phoning East Coast to complain but it's all extra hassle....
Still, it's the principle, so we'll see what happens.
Incidentally we changed from the East Coast HST onto a Cross Country Voyager at Newcastle (both First class) and I have to say the difference was HUGE, even my wife commented on it. The Voyager was noisier and seemed more cramped, the constant noise and vibration of the engine was annoying after the relative silence of the HST, and then there's the smell of those chemical toilets.......
What a difference, and the 1970s train was the best !
Progress ?
I don't think so.

I've just phoned up East Coast.
First I was told by Sales I'd have to speak to Customer Services.
Then Customer Services told me I'd have to speak to Sales.
Eventually Sales told me that they could only think about helping me if I returned the ticket together with a covering letter, this is despite them having the seat booking on their computer system.
This is all getting a hell of a lot of hassle.
The thing is if they're deliberately trying to fob me off by making it as complex as possible that's a good reason for going through with it !
It's all time and hassle though......

jdtaylor · 18 Jun 2010

Hi,

Can anyone confirm normally which way round in coach L seat 54AN is, I believe this airline style, and I've got a feeling it's at a table, but can't be sure which way around it is, and if it helps it 's the Friday 13.17pm service from Peterbroiugh up towards Durham

ainsworth74 · 18 Jun 2010

Assuming I'm reading the diagram posted further up this thread correct, 54A in Coach L is at a table of four and it is next to the aisle, and I think its backwards facing (as in your back will be facing the direction of travel) as long as the 91 is leading.

northwichcat · 18 Jun 2010

When I ordered from GNER's site and booked on a GNER train quite a while ago now they included a seating plan when they posted the tickets - at that time it still had the smoking carriages marked.

Justin Smith · 19 Jun 2010

jcollins said:
When I ordered from GNER's site and booked on a GNER train quite a while ago now they included a seating plan when they posted the tickets - at that time it still had the smoking carriages marked.

Ahh, GNER ! Surely the best of the TOCs, by far ?

Seat layout map for East Coast stock

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