92s on third rail

Richard Scott

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Are there currently any workings for 92s on third rail? Which locos are still capable of using third rail i.e. retain shoe gear?
 
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DEAN MURPHY

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I have a photo somewhere of a diverted service going to Dover through Balham with a 57 hauling a powered down 92! This was about 5 years ago. Never seen anything like it since. A great cop though!
 

JN114

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92s were staple traction on the majority of stuff out of Dollands Moor, at least from the late 90s onwards - given way to 66s now?
 

tramdan

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GBRF ones definitely still use the third rail. Was chatting to one of our drivers on Tuesday night who had done such a move with one very recently and was a big fan of them!
 

tramdan

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That's good, do you know what way through South London they go and at what times?
Absolutely no idea, sorry! Just know I've spent the last couple of days at Dollands Moor and there were quite a few 92s around. I noted 011 and 019 in attendance on Friday morning, and other movements in and out while I was there last night. Sorry theres no more details than that!
 

DBS92042

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Are there currently any workings for 92s on third rail? Which locos are still capable of using third rail i.e. retain shoe gear?
All of the GBRF fleet currently retain shoe gear but I'm not sure if it can still be used on all of them (92032 definitely still runs on 3rd rail though). The DB 92s no longer work on 3rd rail with 92011, 92019, 92041 & 92042 now without shoe gear (92015 & 92036 still retain them for now)
 

fgwrich

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All of the GBRF fleet currently retain shoe gear but I'm not sure if it can still be used on all of them (92032 definitely still runs on 3rd rail though). The DB 92s no longer work on 3rd rail with 92011, 92019, 92041 & 92042 now without shoe gear (92015 & 92036 still retain them for now)
I believe the DB ones can’t work on conventional U.K. Railways (other than the aforementioned HS1) at all now, unless being hauled by something else?
 

DBS92042

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I believe the DB ones can’t work on conventional U.K. Railways (other than the aforementioned HS1) at all now, unless being hauled by something else?
That's true as well. I believe they're confined to HS1 and Dollands Moor/Channel Tunnel when they're under their own power. Usually a 66/67/90 that moves them on the 0K06/0A06 to/from Crewe for maintenance.
 

DBS92042

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Could you elaborate further on this please? On the map I can’t see a way of leaving HS1 at Dagenham into Essex
I believe this is an example of the working being referenced:

Not being too familiar with HS1, I can't tell you exactly where it joins but hopefully it gives an idea as to the route it takes
 
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fgwrich

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That's true as well. I believe they're confined to HS1 and Dollands Moor/Channel Tunnel when they're under their own power. Usually a 66/67/90 that moves them on the 0K06/0A06 to/from Crewe for maintenance.
Thanks, I thought that was the case. A Real shame to be honest, but DB & EWS's treatment of these locos has always been pretty poor.

Could you elaborate further on this please? On the map I can’t see a way of leaving HS1 at Dagenham into Essex
There seems to be two junctions off, both linking into Ripple Lane Sidings. One can be found here:


While the other can be found here (opposite the soon to be built Beam Park station and former Ford Dagenham site)

 

pompeyfan

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Is there any particular reason why DB’s 92s are not permitted to use their on power on conventional rail?

I’m surprised the juice can take a 92 with all the modern stuff around pulling more amps.
 

D7666

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Isn't it really just simply a case of there is no real need to use 92s on third rail as long as they can get away with using 66s etc ?
 

popeter45

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i believe there high power draw limits them to the lines that had the power upgrades for Eurostar 373's to run so while yes they can run on third rail but only some lines
 

59CosG95

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i believe there high power draw limits them to the lines that had the power upgrades for Eurostar 373's to run so while yes they can run on third rail but only some lines
Yes - that's certainly been the case for DB's locos. GBRf's fleet, which has had huge overhauls done, can operate further without drawing as much power as the unmodded ones.

Funnily enough, I recall that 92s kept tripping signalling around Preston last year...which, perhaps coincidentally, got cut out of the WCRM Auto-Transformer upgrades (which included extensive immunisation works in signalling troughs AIUI).
 

themiller

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Yes - that's certainly been the case for DB's locos. GBRf's fleet, which has had huge overhauls done, can operate further without drawing as much power as the unmodded ones.

Funnily enough, I recall that 92s kept tripping signalling around Preston last year...which, perhaps coincidentally, got cut out of the WCRM Auto-Transformer upgrades (which included extensive immunisation works in signalling troughs AIUI).
The 92s performed OK until CAF's EMUs started stabling with pantographs up. It was in one of the posts on another thread if I remember correctly. The CAF units (331s & 397s) had to stable with pantographs down as far away as Blackpool.
 

Elecman

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The 92s performed OK until CAF's EMUs started stabling with pantographs up. It was in one of the posts on another thread if I remember correctly. The CAF units (331s & 397s) had to stable with pantographs down as far away as Blackpool.
Pan down Stabled anywhere in the Catterall Feeder area
 

Fincra5

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Seems to be issues with fairly outdated power supply vs demand. 3rd Rail Units struggle enough as is, hence a load of new substations (especially on the West Coast out of Brighton) for all the new Thameslink Units.
 

fgwrich

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Seems to be issues with fairly outdated power supply vs demand. 3rd Rail Units struggle enough as is, hence a load of new substations (especially on the West Coast out of Brighton) for all the new Thameslink Units.
Indeed, it's the reason why the 92s haven't been able to branch out from their main operations on the DC Kent line (Ashford to London, Tonbridge / Redhill). I hope that one day, with projects like "The electric spine" (if it hasn't completely died a death) that we may see situations where the 92s could be used down to Southampton.
 

GRALISTAIR

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Funnily enough, I recall that 92s kept tripping signalling around Preston last year...which, perhaps coincidentally, got cut out of the WCRM Auto-Transformer upgrades (which included extensive immunisation works in signalling troughs AIUI).
Indeed- most of the insulators are in place from Euxton to Catterall but nothing else. Preston station itself is as far as I could see completely devoid of AT upgrade kit though.
 

Fincra5

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Indeed, it's the reason why the 92s haven't been able to branch out from their main operations on the DC Kent line (Ashford to London, Tonbridge / Redhill). I hope that one day, with projects like "The electric spine" (if it hasn't completely died a death) that we may see situations where the 92s could be used down to Southampton.
Yeah, there are upgrades needed to the 3rd Rail system, especially with the increase in units! Hopefully then, as you say, 92s can stretch their legs a bit further in DC land.
 

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