Abellio Greater Anglia Class 755s (Regional Trains)

[fat_boy_pete]

When, some time ago, the length of the 755/3s was revealed I did pace out the platform at Marks Tey, while waiting for a train. I thought it was marginal but assumed the head of the train (pointing at main line) would be further forward than it seems to be.
But you would hope that someone actually got a tape measure out and worked out the various scenarios (ironically in web design we call these user journeys) and suss cyclists would have a problem. They could have extended both platforms.

No need to pace, the sectional appendix gives Sudbury at 52 metres long. E.g. about 10 metres too short for a 755/3.

 

[Bikeman78]

The NINs are advertised as standard class only with no refreshment facilties, so ideal for a pair of 755s or an Aventra.

Yes that makes perfect sense in the short term. Not sure about the wisdom of having no first class on the fast trains. How well used is it on weekdays? I did the 11:00 down on a Saturday and there were at least 40 people in first, nearly all on the day upgrades as far as i could tell.

Of course they could also put 755s on another diagram that starts and ends in Norwich but do they'd have to avoid peak trains in or out of Liverpool Street. I'm assuming that FC is well used in the peaks.

 

[MikePJ]

755 reached Sudbury in service today: https://twitter.com/GreaterAngliaPR/status/1219599097067450368

 

[F Great Eastern]

Did nobody see that coming until now?

Surely they checked with the relevant operational staff member?

Another gold star for the bid team?

 

[eastdyke]

Surely they checked with the relevant operational staff member?
Another gold star for the bid team?

I don't think anybody here saw it coming either, I assumed (never never assume!) that the stopping position would be sufficiently flexible
I did question the stepping distance from a door positioned near centre carriage but that must be ok. There were I think issues with 150s back in the day.

 

[Grumbler]

I don't think anybody here saw it coming either, I assumed (never never assume!) that the stopping position would be sufficiently flexible
I did question the stepping distance from a door positioned near centre carriage but that must be ok. There were I think issues with 150s back in the day.

How difficult would it be to move the cycle places to the centre coach?

 

[Ianno87]

How difficult would it be to move the cycle places to the centre coach?

That's where the bogs are?

 

[Icky Qualms]

It seems the only option is to ban cycles or lease a suitable unit to carry them in until the platform at marks tey is lengthened

 

[eastdyke]

It seems the only option is to ban cycles or lease a suitable unit to carry them in until the platform at marks tey is lengthened

RRBT:
https://pendle-bike.co.uk/products/6-bike-trailer

 

[Tim Regester]

Here is the front of the train at Sudbury, the centre doors are quite a way forward of the platform.
The guard said they were putting bicycles in the centre carriage for now.
But this really should have been foreseen. They knew the specs of the trains a year ago, I can only presume the shortage of railway trained construction workers and shortage of funds is the reason the work has not been carried out.

 

[Tim Regester]

Or the dutch solution

 

[eastdyke]

Or the dutch solution
View attachment 73023

Nah, this is the Dutch solution:

 

[Meerkat]

Here is the front of the train at Sudbury, the centre doors are quite a way forward of the platform.
The guard said they were putting bicycles in the centre carriage for now.
But this really should have been foreseen. They knew the specs of the trains a year ago, I can only presume the shortage of railway trained construction workers and shortage of funds is the reason the work has not been carried out.View attachment 73022

i am guessing moving that stop board is a lot of paperwork?

 

[vinnym70]

Here is the front of the train at Sudbury, the centre doors are quite a way forward of the platform.
The guard said they were putting bicycles in the centre carriage for now.
But this really should have been foreseen. They knew the specs of the trains a year ago, I can only presume the shortage of railway trained construction workers and shortage of funds is the reason the work has not been carried out.View attachment 73022

As a non-railway person it looks like the measurements have never been made (or taken seriously)
Surely when the trains were tested the drivers would have noted they had to walk through the unit rather than use the drivers door?
And whilst i have no idea on the Stop board shown in the picture, surely the fact that it's no longer in the drivers view before departure is of concern?

 

[Meerkat]

Surely when the trains were tested the drivers would have noted they had to walk through the unit rather than use the drivers door?

“Not my job mate!”
No insult aimed at drivers - I have worked with plenty of people who wouldn’t say anything.
Either “oh, were you expecting me to pay attention and think a bit wider than my own task?!”
Or “did wonder, but assumed someone else would notice”

 

[East74]

I can remember when the platform at the old Sudbury station had a wooden extension because the platform in front of the station building was sealed off due to vandalism. Can they not do the same here as a temporary measure, or do regulations no longer allow it?

 

[Shunter_69]

i am guessing moving that stop board is a lot of paperwork?

They actually installed another stop board behind that one.

 

[F Great Eastern]

I don't think anybody here saw it coming either, I assumed (never never assume!) that the stopping position would be sufficiently flexible
I did question the stepping distance from a door positioned near centre carriage but that must be ok. There were I think issues with 150s back in the day.

But at the end of the day it's not our job to see these things coming but someone in Greater Anglia should have taken all of the measurements at the routes that these trains were going to run on, because it was obvious that all of the regional lines would be dealing with longer trains than have run on them before.

This is where it comes back time and time again about a bid team full of people who know the theory and cost of everything but the practice and reality of nothing. Then to top it off they install someone at the top of the engineering department who had no experience on trains before the start of the franchise.

What I would like to know is how this was only discovered when they started running real trains on there. Was this not spotted when they were testing trains on the line before they ran in service? If not, then it doesn't say much about how rigorous their testing is, which doesn't exactly inspire confidence for whats ahead with the further roll out of other fleets that are still to happen.

 

[eastdyke]

But at the end of the day it's not our job to see these things coming ......

It most certainly is not our job, was just saying ....
I'm sure along with all the other niggles etc. all will be sorted in due course.
I worry far more about next Autumn.

 

[stonojnr]

What I would like to know is how this was only discovered when they started running real trains on there. Was this not spotted when they were testing trains on the line before they ran in service? If not, then it doesn't say much about how rigorous their testing is, which doesn't exactly inspire confidence for whats ahead with the further roll out of other fleets that are still to happen.

I suspect because they werent even thinking of cyclists as a particular use case to test on the trains, for instance they regularly quote theres space for 6 bikes on these trains, but from the space Ive seen you could probably only fit maybe 4 at most, before blocking the aisle to other passengers, and probably 2 at most if they are carrying panniers/luggage, plus you have to play bike jenga to get the things in/out assuming no-one has decided to stand there, dump their luggage/pushchairs there.so actually I suspect on the 755s at least people will just park up in the doorways like they do on the Overground in london or on EMUs which may or may not cause more problems for other passengers, but thats about the best theyll be able to do on the Sudbury service unless they extend the platform.

presumably they got the length right at Sherringham ?

 

[Tim Regester]

Getting a bicycle through the narrow corridor in the power unit to reach the other side of a 3-car unit will be a challenge though!

With the width of my handlebars it could not be done.

 

[Class 170101]

Here is the front of the train at Sudbury, the centre doors are quite a way forward of the platform.
The guard said they were putting bicycles in the centre carriage for now.
But this really should have been foreseen. They knew the specs of the trains a year ago, I can only presume the shortage of railway trained construction workers and shortage of funds is the reason the work has not been carried out.

Does the wheelchair space platform at all the stations on the branch?

 

[TheEdge]

Does the wheelchair space platform at all the stations on the branch?

Wheelchair space is in Coach C which is platformed at every station on the network with the exception (I think) of Berney Arms. I'm sure that shouldn't cause many issues

 

[Bletchleyite]

It seems the only option is to ban cycles or lease a suitable unit to carry them in until the platform at marks tey is lengthened

They can probably be wheeled through at the risk of a bit of seat damage. I've seen people do that on Pendolinos where (as often happens) the crew don't show up to open the van area door, and the aisle is far narrower on those.

 

[Bletchleyite]

What I would like to know is how this was only discovered when they started running real trains on there. Was this not spotted when they were testing trains on the line before they ran in service? If not, then it doesn't say much about how rigorous their testing is, which doesn't exactly inspire confidence for whats ahead with the further roll out of other fleets that are still to happen.

They are not the only ones. MK Council built a fancy new bus station at MKC station a while back (it's actually really rubbish, but that's for another thread). However, they built the lanes too narrow for a full-sized bus to pass one at a stand and had to dig it up and do it again. Allegedly they'd used measurements from a Merc breadvan instead of the full-size Wrights Arriva mostly use and have for years. Muppets.

It might be an entry for the thread on "SDO at termini" though!

 

[Abbo]

I suspect because they werent even thinking of cyclists as a particular use case to test on the trains, for instance they regularly quote theres space for 6 bikes on these trains, but from the space Ive seen you could probably only fit maybe 4 at most, before blocking the aisle to other passengers, and probably 2 at most if they are carrying panniers/luggage, plus you have to play bike jenga to get the things in/out assuming no-one has decided to stand there, dump their luggage/pushchairs there.so actually I suspect on the 755s at least people will just park up in the doorways like they do on the Overground in london or on EMUs which may or may not cause more problems for other passengers, but thats about the best theyll be able to do on the Sudbury service unless they extend the platform.

presumably they got the length right at Sherringham ?

Yes Sheringham snugly accomodates a 4 car FLIRT but in these days when passing a signal by a few inches is considered a SPAD how does this rank the STOP board at Suidbury. Not sure how an arrival at Sudbury is recorded in the box at Marks Tey but is the unit depicted in the image actually in clear on arrival. ?

 

[TheEdge]

Yes Sheringham snugly accomodates a 4 car FLIRT but in these days when passing a signal by a few inches is considered a SPAD how does this rank the STOP board at Suidbury. Not sure how an arrival at Sudbury is recorded in the box at Marks Tey but is the unit depicted in the image actually in clear on arrival. ?

I believe the Sudbury branch is basically signalled in a similar way to "One Engine in Steam" controlled from Liverpool Street PSB. If I recal correctly there is are signals at Marks Tey and then at Sudbury the driver just requests permission to head back and pass the board. So being in clear is not critical.

 

[Aureol Colin]

I suspect the lack of changes at Sudbury, reflects the importance of the branch to the management.

Moderator note: discussion regarding potential through services to Sudbury can be found at https://www.railforums.co.uk/threads/could-we-see-through-running-from-colchester-to-sudbury.198924/

 

[rdlover777]

Here is the front of the train at Sudbury, the centre doors are quite a way forward of the platform.
The guard said they were putting bicycles in the centre carriage for now.
But this really should have been foreseen. They knew the specs of the trains a year ago, I can only presume the shortage of railway trained construction workers and shortage of funds is the reason the work has not been carried out.View attachment 73022

That coach isn't the bike one, it doesn't have the blue band above the window

 

[dk1]

That coach isn't the bike one, it doesn't have the blue band above the window

Green for bikes. I tell everyone it's a green form of transport so remember it that way.