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Airport Expansion in South East England

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HSTEd

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The Isle of Grain proposal has all the problems of the true offshore proposal (new London connections, huge birdstrike problems and so on) without any of the real benefits (noise patterns over water for a large part of the time, essentially unlimited space for future expansions, et. al).

You need six runways really to get all the benefits, like that "Jubillee Airport" proposal.

New airports are go big or go home.
 
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Does anybody know the % of traffic that uses Heathrow as a hub? Are the majority of passengers using Heathrow for travelling point to point or indeed another hub in another continent?

Heathrow Airport Ltd's own stats for 2014 give the following....

Number of pax arriving and departing in 2014: 73.4 million
Percentage of transfer passengers in 2014: 26.3 million (36%)



 
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AM9

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I would put money on Gatwick being chosen if any decision is made late this year.
Given the determination that the last two governments have for HS2 and its lack of a direct LHR link, an HS route from there to Gatwick would be deliverable, - of course tunneled under the AoNCV (Areas of Natural Consider that with the GWML Conservative Voters).
Then consider the value of the western chord from LHR to the GWML.
 

Aictos

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If the UK Govt goes with Gatwick due to the whims of a few NIMBY West London MPs, then it be a scandal with £20 million being wasted on a pointless study if they've just going to ignore the study. Aviationgate anyone?

I know the study is only a recommendation but if they chose to ignore it then it's been a waste of 3 years and millions of pounds down the drain.

Heathrow needs the third runway as it is the best option for the UK as it delivers much more in economic benefits then Gatwick could hope to deliver not only for cargo flights but to offer more competition between legacy flights from British Airways etc and low cost flights from Easyjet etc...

Besides FIVE UK airports plus various industry leaders can all see Heathrow if done right is the right choice, what I can't fathom is why should the whims of a few overtake the demands of the many?

Now Heathrow isn't my local airport but with all the evidence in place, I fail to see why UK Govt won't g with it.
 

ivanhoe

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Heathrow Airport Ltd's own stats for 2014 give the following....

Number of pax arriving and departing in 2014: 73.4 million
Percentage of transfer passengers in 2014: 26.3 million (36%)




Thanks for that. It's an important hub then.
 

freetoview33

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If the UK Govt goes with Gatwick due to the whims of a few NIMBY West London MPs, then it be a scandal with £20 million being wasted on a pointless study if they've just going to ignore the study. Aviationgate anyone?

I know the study is only a recommendation but if they chose to ignore it then it's been a waste of 3 years and millions of pounds down the drain.

Heathrow needs the third runway as it is the best option for the UK as it delivers much more in economic benefits then Gatwick could hope to deliver not only for cargo flights but to offer more competition between legacy flights from British Airways etc and low cost flights from Easyjet etc...

Besides FIVE UK airports plus various industry leaders can all see Heathrow if done right is the right choice, what I can't fathom is why should the whims of a few overtake the demands of the many?

Now Heathrow isn't my local airport but with all the evidence in place, I fail to see why UK Govt won't g with it.
That is the thing. If it is done right.
 

Wolfie

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If the UK Govt goes with Gatwick due to the whims of a few NIMBY West London MPs, then it be a scandal with £20 million being wasted on a pointless study if they've just going to ignore the study. Aviationgate anyone?

I know the study is only a recommendation but if they chose to ignore it then it's been a waste of 3 years and millions of pounds down the drain.

Heathrow needs the third runway as it is the best option for the UK as it delivers much more in economic benefits then Gatwick could hope to deliver not only for cargo flights but to offer more competition between legacy flights from British Airways etc and low cost flights from Easyjet etc...

Besides FIVE UK airports plus various industry leaders can all see Heathrow if done right is the right choice, what I can't fathom is why should the whims of a few overtake the demands of the many?

Now Heathrow isn't my local airport but with all the evidence in place, I fail to see why UK Govt won't g with it.

Because it isn't legally deliverable. The same lawyers who defeated the Govt over failure to comply with air pollution limits earlier this year have said that they will litigate over Heathrow pollution issues..... The Davies Commission effectively ignored the previous Court decision
 

Aictos

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Because it isn't legally deliverable. The same lawyers who defeated the Govt over failure to comply with air pollution limits earlier this year have said that they will litigate over Heathrow pollution issues..... The Davies Commission effectively ignored the previous Court decision

Have you actually read the main points the Davies Commission has made towards Heathrow being expanded? :roll:

One of the main points covered air and noise pollution with heavy restrictions to reduce air and noise pollution so it will be expanded just a case of when not if.
 

radamfi

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As far as I can see, the report does not appraise the option of moving hub traffic from Heathrow to other European airports that already have or will have capacity. Indeed, the terms of reference specifically restrict the discussion to a UK-only perspective. That is a major flaw in the report.

1.3 The Government set the following terms of reference:

The Airports Commission will examine the scale and timing of any requirement for
additional capacity to maintain the UK’s position as Europe’s most important
aviation hub
, and it will identify and evaluate how any need for additional capacity
should be met in the short, medium and long term.

It should maintain a UK-wide perspective, taking appropriate account of the
national, regional and local implications of any proposals.


It should engage openly with interested parties and members of the public,
providing opportunities to submit evidence and proposals and to set out views
relevant to its work.

It should seek to engage with a range of stakeholders, including with local and
devolved government as well as the opposition, to build consensus in support of its
approach and recommendations.

The Commission should report no later than the end of 2013 on:

• its assessment of the evidence on the nature, scale and timing of the steps
needed to maintain the UK’s global hub status; and

• its recommendation(s) for immediate actions to improve the use of existing
runway capacity in the next 5 years – consistent with credible long term options
 
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......the terms of reference specifically restrict the discussion to a UK-only perspective. That is a major flaw in the report.

It isn't any sort of flaw whatsoever.
The whole point is to provide the capacity to both maintain and enhance London's prominence as a major air hub and to safeguard and grow the economic benefits to the UK that accrue from having that facility.

Simply saying we can lose traffic to our neighbouring competitors will not address either of those issues. In fact it would have very damaging consequences.


 

radamfi

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It isn't any sort of flaw whatsoever.
The whole point is to provide the capacity to both maintain and enhance London's prominence as a major air hub and to safeguard and grow the economic benefits to the UK that accrue from having that facility.

Simply saying we can lose traffic to our neighbouring competitors will not address either of those issues. In fact it would have very damaging consequences.

London doesn't have to have a major air hub, it just needs to have adequate access. The alternative hubs are in the same single market, so not really "competitors".
 

edwin_m

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The idea, if you buy it, is that by being a hub London has direct flights to more other places than it otherwise would.

Personally I'm not sure I do buy it. Firstly, as I've posted before, London is in the wrong place to act as a hub for the emerging markets to the east. Secondly, as Europe's largest city it is surely important enough to have direct flights to a wide range of cities regardless.
 

DimTim

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I seem to recall 30/40 years ago the oil was likely to run out around 2050.

In view of the timeframe require to build another runway what impact does this have?
 

HSTEd

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The oil is not going to run out.

LTO/Shale and tar sands have seen to that.
Tar Sands production is still increasing as the breakeven price has fallen to or below current oil prices.
 
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The idea, if you buy it, is that by being a hub London has direct flights to more other places than it otherwise would.

......as Europe's largest city it is surely important enough to have direct flights to a wide range of cities regardless.

Currently, there isn't the capacity to add new routes to various new destinations in the Far East and other parts of the globe.
By comparison, Frankfurt and Amsterdam handle flights to a number of relatively new destinations in China and other places, which London doesn't serve. So London may already be losing out on a lot of new trade, due to the lack of direct links.
 

dosxuk

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Firstly, as I've posted before, London is in the wrong place to act as a hub for the emerging markets to the east.

The only (popular) places you couldn't fly to direct at present is the east coast of Australia and New Zealand. If there was the demand, and slots available, the West Coast of Australia is in range of direct flights from Heathrow. There are already flights across the whole of Asia from Heathrow.
 

Busaholic

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Here's another scenario: dismiss it as fanciful if you wish.

Gatwick gets go-ahead for second runway, which will almost certainly happen anyway while the Heathrow debate rages for decades. HS2 gets link to HS1 plan reinstated. Some trains on HS2 then circumnavigate the north and eastern sides of London to Ebbsfleet, whereupon a new rail line alongside or near to the M25/M23 brings it to Gatwick. Maybe even part tunnelled to avoid North Downs. The capacity on HS1 is there- Stratford International would need to come into play too of course. I suggest this is viable.
 

Haydn1971

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Here's another scenario: dismiss it as fanciful if you wish.


Yes it is... Ebbsfleet to Gatwick is about the same as the crow flies as a direct link from HS2 that also includes a call at Heathrow ! Plus, you wouldn't need the HS1-HS2 link
 

Busaholic

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Yes it is... Ebbsfleet to Gatwick is about the same as the crow flies as a direct link from HS2 that also includes a call at Heathrow ! Plus, you wouldn't need the HS1-HS2 link

Please provide what you regard as the respective distances, and define what you mean by 'a direct link from HS2 that also includes a call at Heathrow' - I am not aware of a Gatwick to Heathrow rail link at present, which is why coach companies can sting people up to £40 for the journey.:)

I am also not suggesting that Gatwick expansion be the sole reason for reinstatement of the HS1/2 link - a number of respected (by me, anyway) industry journalists feel it is vital, indeed at least one thinks HS2 has no case for being built without it!
 

Haydn1971

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Please provide what you regard as the respective distances, and define what you mean by 'a direct link from HS2 that also includes a call at Heathrow' - I am not aware of a Gatwick to Heathrow rail link at present, which is why coach companies can sting people up to £40 for the journey.:)

You would require a new HS line from Ebbsfleet so, HS1 at Ebbsfleet to Gatwick is about 35 miles as a straight line - source iOS Google Maps by foot.

Proposed HS2 line into London passes a point near Denham Aerodrome to Gatwick is about 38 miles as a straight line - passing just to the east of Heathrow - source iOS Google Maps by foot - route via Terminal 5 and you'd be looking at about 40 miles.

Time wise, travelling to Gatwick via a route that goes via the HS1-HS2 link and Ebbsfleet would be longer than a direct line to Gatwick via Heathrow

I am also not suggesting that Gatwick expansion be the sole reason for reinstatement of the HS1/2 link - a number of respected (by me, anyway) industry journalists feel it is vital, indeed at least one thinks HS2 has no case for being built without it!


HS2 is for displacing long distance passengers from the three mainlines to the north - railway enthusiasts like the idea of through services to Europe. However direct services are difficult for one reason key reason - that is you would need to provide immigration facilities at every station in the north. Meaning every station you run services from needs an isolated platform, immigration staff, security staff, luggage scanners etc - it's a nice idea, but fantasy in terms of the actual numbers of passengers that would make the limited journey options vs the flexibility of airports.

However, I do agree that a HS1-HS2 link would improve HS2 in dispersing passengers at the London end. The current plan drops passengers at Euston, my "ideal" would be to distribute this load by terminating services at several locations, namely, Old Oak, Heathrow, Euston, St Pancras and Stratford. I'd go further in that a tunnel extension to an underground location South of the river inbetween Waterloo and London Bridge with travelators and people mover vehicles to the two aforementioned would spread the benefits further.... However, I'm being far to forward thinking here ;)
 

Peter Mugridge

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For some time now the question of whether or not HS2 should serve Heathrow and if so how has been somewhat of a thorn in the side of the debate on the exact details of the project.

On the one hand, serving Heathrow brings with it the potential to transfer considerable volumes of currently domestic air travel to rail. This would involve mainly people connecting to and from intercontinental flights. On the other hand, running via Heathrow would add to the journey time to and from London with a consequent negative effect on the attraction of HS2 services for purely domestic journey options.

Solutions that have been floated over the past few years have involved huge nearby interchanges with connections, diverting the line a few miles and permutations of both that include triangular junctions to allow some trains to literally bypass the question altogether. There are also suggestions that involve connections with HS1 to the airport.

None of this so far seems very elegant and each of the proposed solutions seems to bring with it a new set of problems. So let us stop and think about a number of factors for a moment:

• To stand any chance of picking up connecting intercontinental passengers, HS2 must serve Heathrow directly – the time taken for a connecting transfer to be made would mean that for these passengers a domestic flight connection would still be an attractive proposition.


• To maximise the attraction of HS2 for purely domestic travel ( that is travel which starts or finishes in or goes via London itself ) services need to take the shortest route in or out of London with the fewest stops.


• A connection with HS1 is essential in order to maximise network benefits – a quick connection between services on the two lines as well as the ability to run at least some through services is very important.

There was already a suggestion, before it was shelved, that the proposed direct link between HS1 and HS2 should be twin track instead of the originally planned single track link; this is good and it deals with the third point, as does the proposal for a single large interchange at Euston and King’s Cross / St Pancras. The question of the airport does, however, remain largely – please excuse the pun – in the air.

Looking at this logically, the suggestions of a large triangular junction do seem to be the most sensible as this would allow services to and from London and through direct services between HS2 and HS1 to make their way without being delayed by going via Heathrow or a nearby interchange by using the north side of the triangle – which would be similar to the complex south of Lille in France.

Through services between Heathrow and HS1 would use the eastern side of the triangle. Such services would most logically consist mainly of an expansion with additional services of the current Southeastern High Speed domestic services to the airport. In addition some international services could potentially be run as connections between Heathrow and the near continent.

The west side of the triangle would allow for HS2 services starting and terminating at Heathrow itself; this would effectively turn Heathrow into a second southern terminus for HS2 and would allow the airport services to be operated distinctly from the central London services and provides the vital direct link at the heart of the airport that is needed to make the airport option viable.

With an HS2 station directly under Heathrow the potential would then exist to do something very exciting as an “add on” project – an extension of HS2 to Gatwick. The distance between the two airports is not huge – 43 miles by road and 24 miles as the crow flies. A high speed rail link could therefore be expected to be approximately 30 miles, similar to the distance between Ebbsfleet and Ashford which implies that if this section was engineered for 140mph then a 15 minute transit time between the two would be a reasonable expectation.

This relatively short distance means that there is little point in engineering for higher speeds as it is reasonable to expect that all services would call at both airports. As a result, the line need not be quite as arrow straight as HS2 which means it would be easier to find a route for it through what is an area with a relatively dense population – an approximate route running along the course of the M25 to roughly half way between junctions 9 and 10 then passing in a long tunnel ( on the face of it this would be yet another NIMBY tunnel but it does also allow the most direct route to be taken so in this case it would be required anyway! ) from north of Effingham Common and running underneath Mickleham and Box Hill; this would emerge roughly half way between Dorking and Reigate leaving the line a fairly straight run direct to Gatwick through a largely open area.

The tricky bit, really, is going to be the section between the northern portal of this Box Hill tunnel and Heathrow as this is the area of extremely dense population and there are also numerous important parks and heritage sites that need to be avoided. For this sector, the line would probably need to literally “hug” the M25!

To extend the line like this would effectively turn Heathrow and Gatwick into a single airport over two sites. You would not be running all the HS2 services through the Gatwick – rather you would have a high frequency shuttle service using an additional build of class 395s between the airports running every 10 minutes or so with perhaps two HS2 through services every hour running below Heathrow to Gatwick. Most of the HS2 services would not run below Heathrow.

This carries other benefits as well – if half of these Heathrow – Gatwick class 395 shuttles were then extended to central London ( the Euston / St Pancras interchange ) using the eastern side of the previously described triangle, you would have a 20 minute interval service between London and Gatwick via Heathrow taking roughly 35 minutes end to end; this could allow the present Gatwick Express to be removed from the northern part of the Brighton Line which would considerably ease the pathing on that route and allow a re-cast of that line’s services without losing any direct services to or through Gatwick from anywhere else.

The suggested HS2 Gatwick station would be separate from the present railway infrastructure, but it may be worth considering a link to the present tracks south of the airport in order to allow some of these class 395 workings to run through, at conventional speeds, below Gatwick to Brighton in order to allow easier connections to Heathrow and HS2 from the south coast. There is little point in building a high speed alignment below Gatwick – the distances are not great so the speed would be far less beneficial than the connections gained. There would also be serious cost implications plus we are again in an area of quite dense population meaning routing such a line would be very difficult.

So, we should perhaps not be asking whether or not HS2 should serve Heathrow directly but instead whether or not we can use HS2 to create a true interface between domestic rail and intercontinental air travel without the need for additional runways or short stubs of high speed line or diverting high speed services out of London itself. This article suggests we can and at the same time ease pressure on the Brighton line and improve connectivity for a large chunk of the south coast.

In a sense, then, the answer is that HS2 should not run to Heathrow. It should run to Gatwick via Heathrow,
 
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....To extend the line like this would effectively turn Heathrow and Gatwick into a single airport over two sites.....
......you would have a high frequency shuttle service using an additional build of class 395s between the airports running every 10 minutes or so

....create a true interface between domestic rail and intercontinental air travel without the need for additional runways......

The single airport complex over two sites is a complete nonsense, if by that you imagine that passengers would transfer between flights using both airports. A most unappealling prospect for travellers and a logistical nightmare, with huge obstacles that would be difficult if not impossible to overcome. The business would simply avoid flying via London would choose to connect through another hub.

As for removing the need for additional runways, how?
The whole point of the exercise to decide where additional runway capacity could or should be built, is because the two largest London airports are virtually full.
There is no proposal on the table to do as you suggest for obvious reasons, because it won't solve the problem of providing the extra capacity needed.

Heathrow is full and Gatwick is full for large parts of the day. It too will need a second runway in due course, even if Heathrow gets it's new runway.
Simply assuming that Gatwick can take the extra traffic without additional runways, is naive in the extreme.
 

Rhydgaled

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I seem to recall 30/40 years ago the oil was likely to run out around 2050.

In view of the timeframe require to build another runway what impact does this have?
The oil is not going to run out.

LTO/Shale and tar sands have seen to that.
Tar Sands production is still increasing as the breakeven price has fallen to or below current oil prices.
If we keep burning it, oil will in theory eventually run out. However that is just theory, because if we keep burning fossil fuels at the current rate a large poportion of life on earth, perhaps including ourselves, is likely to go extinct before we run out. The Gatwick/Heathrow debate may be interesting, but it completely overlooks climate change. I would suggest that is the elephant in the room here. My opinion is that any airport expansion is unjustifyable, unsustainable and unacceptable unless the expansion is solely to move flights from other airports to consolidate at a single hub (in which case the airport from which flights are removed must not be permitted to allow the released capacity for additional flights).

For some time now the question of whether or not HS2 should serve Heathrow and if so how has been somewhat of a thorn in the side of the debate on the exact details of the project.

Looking at this logically, the suggestions of a large triangular junction do seem to be the most sensible as this would allow services to and from London and through direct services between HS2 and HS1 to make their way without being delayed by going via Heathrow or a nearby interchange by using the north side of the triangle – which would be similar to the complex south of Lille in France.

Through services between Heathrow and HS1 would use the eastern side of the triangle. Such services would most logically consist mainly of an expansion with additional services of the current Southeastern High Speed domestic services to the airport. In addition some international services could potentially be run as connections between Heathrow and the near continent.

The west side of the triangle would allow for HS2 services starting and terminating at Heathrow itself; this would effectively turn Heathrow into a second southern terminus for HS2 and would allow the airport services to be operated distinctly from the central London services and provides the vital direct link at the heart of the airport that is needed to make the airport option viable.
Personally, I don't see much point in the 'west side of the triangle'. Unfortunately the 'Euston Cross' proposal (an underground through station linking HS2 and HS1) would probably be prohibitively expensive, but IF the UK's HSR network is to be as London-centric as the classic network it is a shame something more ambious wasn't proposed. For example, a 4-track core HSR from Stratford International (or that area anyway) to Old Oak Common with double-track branches:
  • From Stratford International to Ashford/Channel Tunnel (HS1)
  • From Stratford International to York, with a branch to Leeds
  • From Old Oak Common to Manchester via Central Birmingham, a branch to Liverpool (or at least passive provision for one)
  • From Old Oak Common to Heathrow (with passive provision for extension to one or more of Southampton/Bristol/Reading)

  • High-Speed trains would run Manchester/Liverpool-London-York/Leeds
  • As you suggested, the Javelin service would extend to Heathrow
  • Some international trains could run from Manchester/Liverpool/Birmingham/Heathrow
  • If the extension(s) south/west from Heathrow were built, you would also have High-Speed trains running Bristol/Southampton-London-York/Leeds

IF however the HSR doesn't need to be London-centric, you could make Euston become the spur, forget the East Coast route to Leeds/York and instead centre the network on Birmingham with something like this:
  • York-Leeds-Birmingham-Bristol-Taunton
  • Manchester-Birmingham-Heathrow-Southampton
  • Liverpool-Birmingham-London
 

edwin_m

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The HS2 network (including phases 1 and 2) is Birmingham-centric already. The service pattern is London-centric simply because that is the pattern of demand. However the network is capable of running a different service pattern if that becomes necessary.

Any route to the Continent is likely to run through or near London on simple grounds of geography.
 

freetoview33

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The HS2 network (including phases 1 and 2) is Birmingham-centric already. The service pattern is London-centric simply because that is the pattern of demand. However the network is capable of running a different service pattern if that becomes necessary.

Any route to the Continent is likely to run through or near London on simple grounds of geography.

I'm still not convinced HS2 is the answer to anything.
 
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I'm still not convinced HS2 is the answer to anything.

It depends what the question is?

Contrary to what the railway enthusiast fantasists seem to think, there are no plans for a national high speed rail "network", other than the Y shaped HS2 route as proposed and currently being designed.

The HS3 "idea" (it isn't yet a proposal") is simply a recognition that the inadequate cross Pennine rail links between the north of England 's largest and most important centres, need to be significantly improved or replaced with a faster and more appropriate rail link.
HS3 may or may not end up being a HS line.

HS2 remains as the preferred answer to the question of how to resolve the forecast lack of capacity on the main north-south rail axis.
The answer being a completely new main line.
It has subsequently been decided that it will be built as a HS line, designed to take the bulk of passenger traffic travelling between the major English provincial business centres and London, off the existing main lines (most notably off the WCML); thus releasing further capacity on the classic lines.
End of !

L
 

Peter Mugridge

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The single airport complex over two sites is a complete nonsense, if by that you imagine that passengers would transfer between flights using both airports. A most unappealling prospect for travellers and a logistical nightmare, with huge obstacles that would be difficult if not impossible to overcome. The business would simply avoid flying via London would choose to connect through another hub.

As for removing the need for additional runways, how?
The whole point of the exercise to decide where additional runway capacity could or should be built, is because the two largest London airports are virtually full.
There is no proposal on the table to do as you suggest for obvious reasons, because it won't solve the problem of providing the extra capacity needed.

Heathrow is full and Gatwick is full for large parts of the day. It too will need a second runway in due course, even if Heathrow gets it's new runway.
Simply assuming that Gatwick can take the extra traffic without additional runways, is naive in the extreme.


1) With the high speed high frequency link, the transfer time would be more or less the same as some of the present inter-terminal transfers within Heathrow. That makes the question of a split site irrelevant.

2) Eventually HS2 will be built and will be extended to Scotland; at that point it becomes feasible to remove the vast majority of domestic flight from Heathrow / Gatwick completely. Given that we have spent 30 or so years already just talking about a new runway and we still don't have definitive answer despite the publication of a report that was supposed to settle the matter once and for all, it would not surprise me at all if HS2 was completed first...

3) I do agree that if they are going to build new runways, both Heathrow AND Gatwick should get one - and the one at Heathrow should be a full standalone third runway, not the extension to the existing northern runway that has been floated. Where we differ is that I would expect this extra capacity to be used for additional international flights and still shove the domestic travel onto HS2; which I would still expect to see completed before any new runways given the aforementioned lethargy over runways.




I should at this point say that I will be without internet access for most of the coming week and after tonight it may be a few days before I can respond further in this debate - I will not be ignoring anyone. :)
 

edwin_m

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1) With the high speed high frequency link, the transfer time would be more or less the same as some of the present inter-terminal transfers within Heathrow. That makes the question of a split site irrelevant.

This will only work if the high speed rail link can be treated as airside, so that passengers and their luggage don't have to go through passport and security checks when transferring between airports. This would, I think, be very challenging.

2) Eventually HS2 will be built and will be extended to Scotland; at that point it becomes feasible to remove the vast majority of domestic flight from Heathrow / Gatwick completely.

That was the stated reason to drop the third runway in 2010 but I'm not sure it stacks up. Assuming the train takes three hours, generally considered the figure at which rail wins out over air, a passenger leaving central Edinburgh or Glasgow will be at Heathrow at about the same time whether travelling by rail or air. But the crucial difference is, again, that the air passenger will be airside having been fully processed before joining their connecting flight. Making the rail link time-competitive for this journey would involve further acceleration by the best part of an hour - in this case making the train airside would be even more challenging and actually wouldn't help much.

I should at this point say that I will be without internet access for most of the coming week and after tonight it may be a few days before I can respond further in this debate - I will not be ignoring anyone. :)

Or you are expressing total impartiality and ignoring us all equally!
--- old post above --- --- new post below ---
Currently, there isn't the capacity to add new routes to various new destinations in the Far East and other parts of the globe.
By comparison, Frankfurt and Amsterdam handle flights to a number of relatively new destinations in China and other places, which London doesn't serve. So London may already be losing out on a lot of new trade, due to the lack of direct links.

Thinking aloud here, not sure where this is going...

If Heathrow didn't have any aspiration to be a hub, then maybe it wouldn't need so many short-haul flights, which could use one of the other London airports instead and would be moreorless equally convenient given the market for these flights is now people travelling to/from London not making longer-distance connections. This would free up capacity for flights to new destinations, which would be justified by the demand to/from London (and much of England now easily accessible by HS2) rather than by connecting flights.

I guess the problem with that is that Heathrow is a hub today, notably for trans-Atlantic flights for which it is geographically well positioned, and that status relies on the short-haul flights. But I still can't see people from mainland Europe choosing to connect at London into long-haul flights eastward, when a hub east of Europe would save an hour or two's flying time with a corresponding reduction in the airline's costs and fares. So maybe the suggested new flights to China etc are only justified by the London area market, so could use one of the other airports?

Discuss.
 
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