Another fantastic day with Avanti

[gazzaa2]

I've never known the doors to shut at the station due to crowding issues as often as they do at Euston. Place isn't fit for purpose.

Avanti very much up against it today in fairness but at least with LNER when the ECML is knackered they still do their best to get people home.

 

[Tezza1978]

Thank you for telling me what I already know.

None of that excuses pretending that trains don't exist. Re-advertising "phantom" trains long after their supposed departure time (e.g. re-advertising the 19.40 around 20.30, minutes before it departed). Allowing passengers to crowd around the southern ends of platforms, next to Coach K of pendolinos, with staff telling angry passengers "we have no idea where this train is going, but watch the departure board at the front of the platforn". Followed by these hordes rushing to board the southern half of the train as soon as the guard shouts "it's a Manchester train, definitely a Manchester train" (leaving within 1 minute, perhaps? Nobody knows), resulting in passengers being stuck in the rear carriages, with the front carriages - according to the guard looking at the CCTV - having plenty of seats available!! Utter shambles by the management of Euston station.

This is the key point. We know there have been problems today. But the organisation and communication is - as always at Euston for Avanti - despicabally bad

 

[185143]

I've never been so glad to be booked on the Sleeper. Sat comfortably in the lounge with a drink awaiting boarding, which is late.

All the WMTs back to Crewe are cancelled as were seemingly a good proportion of the Avanti services I'd have used instead.

Someone in here who just left the guy he was talking to just said "You're trying to get to Manchester aren't you? Good luck!"

Looks like all the Overgrounds are cancelled now too. Has something else happened?

 

[WizCastro197]

I've never been so glad to be booked on the Sleeper. Sat comfortably in the lounge with a drink awaiting boarding, which is late.

All the WMTs back to Crewe are cancelled as were seemingly a good proportion of the Avanti services I'd have used instead.

Someone in here who just left the guy he was talking to just said "You're trying to get to Manchester aren't you? Good luck!"

Looks like all the Overgrounds are cancelled now too. Has something else happened?

Most Overgrounds seem to be starting from Kilburn High Road instead of Euston, but TfL hasn't updated their page with this information: Only minor delays to between Willesden and Clapham they claim:

https://tfl.gov.uk/tube-dlr-overground/status/#line-raillo-overground

London Overground: Minor delays between Stratford and Richmond and between Willesden Junction and Clapham Junction due to an earlier signal failure. GOOD SERVICE on other London Overground routes.

Nothing else seems to have happened apart from the aforementioned, earlier in the thread.

 

[Welshman]

In all fairness if the Avanti 05.51 is cancelled from Holyhead it would be a rail replacement taxi and only a 4 seater would be required.

With respect that's not always the case.
On the occasions my wife has used it, and she travels fairly frequently, it has been well-filled by Chester, and the five-car set from Wrexham has been needed.

We opt for off-peak any valid route but that is not usable on the 0448 or 0551 Holyhead departures. Gives us the flexibility to hop on what ever train shows up.

The earliest off-peak (TfW change at Crew and Chester) arrives at Euston around 11:00. --- Of course that assumes you make both connections and the Avanti train from Crewe is running.


Today looks grim for a day return. Cancled: 17:50 Crewe to Bangor 18:10 Euston to Wrexham. This train divides with 1 set continuing to Holyhead. 18:30 Euston to Glasgow 18:43 Euston to Crewe terminates at Wolverhampton


If I had to go to London between now and January, I'd hire a car and drive. Ugh.

That's a good idea, but not possible if you have an early meeting in London.
Also it means changing at Chester, usually from plat.4 and over the bridge to the Crewe shuttle in plat.1, which is often quite full to start with. And then again at Crewe from plat. 9 or 10 and over the bridge to plat. 5 or 1. Not the best arrangement if you have heavy luggage.
I'm afraid she does appreciate the one remaining through train per day - when it runs properly, that is!

 

[Andrew*Debbie]

Tomorrow’s Avanti cancellations and alterations are starting to be rolled out internally. I expect these will be advertised publicly shortly if not done so already.

They are on the public website.

 

[LNW-GW Joint]

Is that the same VTWC that resisted introducing much needed additional 390s until they could obtain favourable terms?

If you mean delaying the 11-car extension and extra sets, that was wholly down to DfT not accepting Virgin's (with Alstom) several upgrade proposals.
In the end DfT itself ordered 104 vehicles, and then contracted Virgin to project manage the work.
All part of the "anyone but Virgin" tactic at the DfT.
More widely, Virgin itself lost interest in ICWC after the 2012 debacle, and let Stagecoach bid the replacement - and lost to First as a result.

 

[Hadders]

Euston is a disgrace tonight. I have never seen the station so tense. Half the trains listed in the "emergency timetable" - advertised online and in apps earlier this afternoon - aren't listed on the main concourse departure boards at all; the other half are listed as cancelled. There are hordes of angry (potential) passengers on the platforms. A very angry, argumentative atmosphere. I pity the staff, some will be assaulted at this rate. Few police officers to be seen.

I went to Euston too see off a colleague who was travelling North tonight. I agree with this, it wasn't at all good.

 

[Jimini]

I haven't seen it like that in a fair old while. Carnage would best describe it!

 

[GoneSouth]

We opt for off-peak any valid route but that is not usable on the 0448 or 0551 Holyhead departures. Gives us the flexibility to hop on what ever train shows up.

The earliest off-peak (TfW change at Crew and Chester) arrives at Euston around 11:00. --- Of course that assumes you make both connections and the Avanti train from Crewe is running.


Today looks grim for a day return. Cancled: 17:50 Crewe to Bangor 18:10 Euston to Wrexham. This train divides with 1 set continuing to Holyhead. 18:30 Euston to Glasgow 18:43 Euston to Crewe terminates at Wolverhampton


If I had to go to London between now and January, I'd hire a car and drive. Ugh.

I don’t have that option sadly. For those of us who RELY on trains to travel to work and can’t drive it’s a very depressing future

 

[Aaron1]

I was talking about Euston station to my brother last night, he's never been but I have and I told him how in my opinion Euston station simply is not fit for purpose, gets ridiculously crowded at the best of times and often has to close as a result which just moves the crowds out side, not exactly fit for purpose unfortunately

 

[Andrew*Debbie]

I don’t have that option sadly. For those of us who RELY on trains to travel to work and can’t drive it’s a very depressing future

I have been commuting by rail since the Menai Bridge closed. Fortunately I use TfW and have backups. In the past six weeks I had to use an alternate once. That was due to points failure.

 

[Bletchleyite]

I was talking about Euston station to my brother last night, he's never been but I have and I told him how in my opinion Euston station simply is not fit for purpose, gets ridiculously crowded at the best of times and often has to close as a result which just moves the crowds out side, not exactly fit for purpose unfortunately

Often? Never, ever happened to me. It does happen occasionally though.

There are options to get rid of the "Euston scrum" but the TOCs and Network Rail fail to take them. It was nowhere near as bad in the days Silverlink didn't suppress platform numbers - heck, all the peak ones used to be on a sheet of paper in the Tube station!

 

[zwk500]

Often? Never, ever happened to me. It does happen occasionally though.

No me either but I've never gone during high peak.

There are options to get rid of the "Euston scrum" but the TOCs and Network Rail fail to take them. It was nowhere near as bad in the days Silverlink didn't suppress platform numbers - heck, all the peak ones used to be on a sheet of paper in the Tube station!

I can get suppressing platforms when they're shared with avanti, but trains from 8 or 11 should be advertised pretty much as soon as the previous train has departed.

 

[Andrew*Debbie]

Looking ahead . . .

Monday 12 December Avanti have tickets for sale on these Holyhead (HHD) to Euston (EUS)

04:48 -> 08:35 Direct
05:45 -> 09:35 Direct
06:49 -> 11:03 Change at Crewe(CRE) First Off-peak
07:31 -> 12:10 Change at Chester(CTR), CRE
08:53 -> 12:35 Direct
09:27 -> 14:09 Change at CTR, CRE
10:40 -> 14:35 Change at CTR
12:46 -> 16:35 Direct
13:27 -> 17:35 Change at CTR
14:49 -> 18:35 Direct

+ 3 more later in the day with changes at Chester and Crewe


A quick search also shows 5 direct trains per day from Euston to Holyhead.


I'll be watching from the sidelines.

 

[Bletchleyite]

No me either but I've never gone during high peak.

I can get suppressing platforms when they're shared with avanti, but trains from 8 or 11 should be advertised pretty much as soon as the previous train has departed.

The other case for this is where there are units being split or joined at Euston where people boarding can be a nuisance as at Euston it's not permitted with passengers on board (why I don't quite know). However there will if I recall be none of this from Sunday - pretty much everything is just 8 car all day.

 

[Jimini]

Bit of a result, last night. Managed to scramble and get the 2023 to that left pretty much on time and landed in Cov a minute early at 2140.

Next three trains:

2139 -- departed 39 mins late at 2218, arrived at 0001, 74 mins late

2230 -- departed 44 mins late at 2314, arrived at 0045, 33 mins late

2330 -- departed 220 mins late at 2350, arrived at 0123, 10 mins late

Hat tip to whoever was responsible for the journey into town in the morning though. Yes the 1031 terminated short at MK at 1109 on platform 4, but I think the signallers may have pulled a crafty move, as the Northampton train due on platform 3 (cross-platform) was moved elsewhere and the LNWR service coming down from Crewe was signalled into P3, so it hoovered all of us up about four mins after we got to MK, which significantly minimised the ultimate arrival time at Euston. Yes it was cosy but was fully expecting to be stuck for a fair old while, so great result.

 

[Horizon22]

No me either but I've never gone during high peak.

I can get suppressing platforms when they're shared with avanti, but trains from 8 or 11 should be advertised pretty much as soon as the previous train has departed.

At Paddington they seemed to manage with advertising GWR trains as requested when ready whilst letting the TfL Rail / Elizabeth trains be boarded ASAP. Same at Liverpool Street.

Sharing the station between inter-city and metro/regional operators shouldn’t be an issue.

 

[zwk500]

At Paddington they seemed to manage with advertising GWR trains as requested when ready whilst letting the TfL Rail / Elizabeth trains be boarded ASAP. Same at Liverpool Street.

Sharing the station between inter-city and metro/regional operators shouldn’t be an issue.

The Euston platform plan was historically always more changeable than most other terminals due to the flexibility of the layout, although this has changed recently.

 

[Bletchleyite]

The Euston platform plan was historically always more changeable than most other terminals due to the flexibility of the layout, although this has changed recently.

It's been almost 100% consistent (barring serious disruption) since Virgin introduced the VHF timetable, to the point that a lot of commuters on trains using 16-18 used to just enter via the side entrance and go straight to the train without bothering to check anything (I did, and only once wasn't it there that I recall). Before that it did vary a bit on Virgin services but the Silverlink services were consistent enough to be on a paper poster in the Tube station.

 

[bleeder4]

The problems between Carlisle and Lancaster this morning had knock on effects to Avanti services today. A lot of platform swapping and set changing at Euston. I had a family member waiting at Birmingham New Street to catch 9S69 to Edinburgh but that was 46 mins late leaving Euston due to delays sourcing a train crew. At Rugby Trent Valley Jn, as a time saving measure, it was then going to turn right instead of left and head straight up the WCML through Nuneaton to rejoin it's booked route at Stafford. So I had to get my relative to board the WMR 1F46 train to Liverpool, where she should be able to get off at Crewe and rejoin her originally booked train 9S69 to Edinburgh.

 

[Peter0124]

Looks like the 14.23 and 16.23 Euston to Edinburghs have both been diverted to Glasgow Central

 

[SCDR_WMR]

The other case for this is where there are units being split or joined at Euston where people boarding can be a nuisance as at Euston it's not permitted with passengers on board (why I don't quite know). However there will if I recall be none of this from Sunday - pretty much everything is just 8 car all day.

It's not just a Euston thing, I believe it's a NR instruction as it's the same at New St with attaching (as attaching at Northampton is fine as seen on the 08.04 inbound from New St). We can also split off an empty unit with pax on the other part as long as the unit that moves is empty - which I think is why the attach to form a 12 car is ECS given its added to a unit already in the platform.

 

[Bungle965]

Looks like the 14.23 and 16.23 Euston to Edinburghs have both been diverted to Glasgow Central

No driver to take the sets back to Polmadie, NR have refused before (unsure on this specific example) to have sets outstable in Edinburgh overnight.

 

[boiledbeans2]

It's not just a Euston thing, I believe it's a NR instruction as it's the same at New St with attaching (as attaching at Northampton is fine as seen on the 08.04 inbound from New St). We can also split off an empty unit with pax on the other part as long as the unit that moves is empty - which I think is why the attach to form a 12 car is ECS given its added to a unit already in the platform.

No issues with SWR's Class 450s though. Splitting and joining with pax onboard both parts of the train.

 

[Nicholas Lewis]

No issues with SWR's Class 450s though. Splitting and joining with pax onboard both parts of the train.

Likewise 377's at Haywards Heath, Horsham, Redhill & Eastbourne.

 

[thedbdiboy]

LNWR should be given at least one of the Avanti MAN - LON routes per hour. Give Avanti some competition to think about.

DfT aren't going to allow one contracted [ex-franchised] TOC to compete with another. Open Access paths and a willing operator are what would be needed.

 

[D6130]

Likewise 377's at Haywards Heath, Horsham, Redhill & Eastbourne.

Is it not an issue with units coupling and dividing on reversible lines with permissive working? (Don't ask me why!).

 

[zwk500]

Is it not an issue with units coupling and dividing on reversible lines with permissive working? (Don't ask me why!).

HHE (1 and 4) and EBN are fully reversible, and Euston and New Street are cleared for all forms of permissive working on all lines.

 

[LYuen]

More widely, Virgin itself lost interest in ICWC after the 2012 debacle, and let Stagecoach bid the replacement - and lost to First as a result.

They didn't lose, their bid were 'disqualified' and First earned the franchise without a contest.