ATOC - Connecting Communities

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Masboroughlad

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How likely is this to happen in the near future?

http://www.atoc.org/clientfiles/File/publicationsdocuments/ConnectingCommunitiesReport_S10.pdf

ATOC said:
This report seeks to complement recent and ongoing studies
into such options for capacity enhancement by looking at other
opportunities to connect communities which have grown in recent
years but which do not have good access to the rail network.

In particular, this report has focused on schemes which could be
delivered relatively quickly, through short links to (or new stations
on) existing lines, and by making use of freight lines (current or
recently closed) as well as railway land left by the line closures
and capacity reductions of the 1960s and 70s.

Many past studies have looked at re-opening old railways, but this
one looks first at the market, not the map. It starts with people,
where they live and where they want to travel. The schemes
identified in this paper as having a positive business case would
provide access directly and indirectly for a million people not
currently well served by rail...

This outlines lots of re-openings, missing links etc that ATOC have identified. What are the chances that these will happen? I am particularly interested in Shrewsbury to Stafford (as, if I buy a house, it may be at the bottom of my garden :D but also :(?)

But generally just wondered if we will see closures from Beeching reversed. The Government have just announced one. The first of many or a political sop?
 
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ainsworth74

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Define near future? If it ain't in the HLOS for CP5 then it ain't going to be happening until at least CP6 (2019-2024). Unless a local authority decides to try and do it on their own.
 

Masboroughlad

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Define near future? If it ain't in the HLOS for CP5 then it ain't going to be happening until at least CP6 (2019-2024). Unless a local authority decides to try and do it on their own.

I suppose when I say near future - I probably mean ever?!

I guess they would be relevant to me in the next (hopefully!) 40 years?
 

LE Greys

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I notice that Hythe seems to have the highest BCR, but there seems to have been no action so far. There's also a rather interesting idea about accessing Brixham (and presumably Kingswear) via the P&DR, which might make a good test case for other heritage lines.
 

Masboroughlad

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It all makes me wonder what the role of ATOC actually is? Does the rail industry need it? I think it does but it needs much more beef and muscle.

Does ATOC REALLY have the muscle to drive re-openings?
 

ainsworth74

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Is ATOC even the right body to be driving this sort of thing? And more to the point why would you want ATOC to be stronger? It's distinctly anti-passenger!
 

Morgsie

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There is a report by the Campaign for Better Transport which is related to Rail re-openings.

Rail 700: pp66-69

One of the things is that there is no clear process to open lines
 
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Tiny Tim

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Of course ATOC doesn't have any formal role in re-opening railways, but they're entitled to express an opinion as an interested party. It's really quite a good 'wish' list.
 

billio

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The Rawtenstall proposal that will virtually take over the East Lancashire Railway looks interesting.

Initially I would have thought that rather than run through Heywood, a better and cheaper option would be to run to a new Metrolink interchange station located on the other side of Buckley Wells.

But on the other hand, giving Heywood and possibly a re-opened station at Broadfield would greatly improve access to Manchester from that area.
 

scandal

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Arguably Portishead is going ahead now with the Bristol Metro project, I was somewhat surprised not to see any of these routes such as Skelmersdale or Burton to Leicester (or even a stub to just Coalville) announced in CP5 bearing in mind the current Government's agenda of investing in infrastructure to increase access to markets. However I did note there is now a £20m fund for new stations (which at current costs must be what 5 stations...) with Ilkeston likely to be connected.

http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-england-derbyshire-18875298
 

talltim

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Why are we so obsessed by re-opening? There's a reason why lines closed, and while sometimes those reason were, or are now wrong, often they were right. The roads people seem to have no problem with planning completely new roads to serve today's requirements, why not the same for rail?
 

swt_passenger

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I notice that Hythe seems to have the highest BCR, but there seems to have been no action so far.

Which is odd because there's a pretty detailed section about this in the more recent London and SE RUS that explains why it isn't likely to open, including this:

The high capital cost of reintroducing DDA compliant
stations and the need to procure additional rolling
stock mean that a scheme to introduce passenger
services to the line will have a low value for money
business case
 

yorksrob

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Why are we so obsessed by re-opening? There's a reason why lines closed, and while sometimes those reason were, or are now wrong, often they were right. The roads people seem to have no problem with planning completely new roads to serve today's requirements, why not the same for rail?

Generally the ones that are proposed for re-opening are those that shouldn't have been closed in the first place, along with some such as Skelmersdale that have increased in population since closure.

We've had a growing railway in terms of passenger use for around thirty years now. It's inconceivable that some of the towns left high and dry at the low ebb of railway usage wouldn't benefit from being reconnected.

I welcome any organisation, including ATOC supporting re-openings. We just need a bit of Government assistance now.
 

IanXC

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It all makes me wonder what the role of ATOC actually is? Does the rail industry need it? I think it does but it needs much more beef and muscle.

Does ATOC REALLY have the muscle to drive re-openings?

Remember that ATOC are in many ways the rail industry association. Its clearly in the interest of their members, and therefore ATOC for there to be route reopenings, as more railway means more business for the TOCs and hence more profit for them!

Having said that it is good to hear any organisation proposing reopening, long term planning for beyond the currently planned Control Periods needs to start now, and I think a debate about reopening lines should be welcomed.
 

yorksrob

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"The high capital cost of reintroducing DDA compliant
stations and the need to procure additional rolling
stock mean that a scheme to introduce passenger
services to the line will have a low value for money
business case"

I'm not entirely convinced by this argument. Sure, trains cost money (although why they couldn't recondition a few old ones along the lines of the 121 bubble cars I don't know), But DDA compliant stations ! Isn't that just a station with a ramp to each platform and decent lighting - we're hardly talking St Pancras here.
 

Tiny Tim

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more railway means more business for the TOCs and hence more profit for them!

Not all reopenings are necessarily profitable for the TOC. For some stations (Melksham, perhaps?) it probably costs more to stop there than it's worth. Some TOCs have failed to support reopenings on this basis. FGW, for instance, didn't support the campaign for a Devizes Parkway Station. (Effectively the reopening of Patney & Chirton).
 
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