Available but Unused Passenger Stock

[WillPS]

Simply, what passenger stock is presently stored/out of use but could be used once again in regular service?

There must be a few Mk3s (CargoD? DRS? DBS?) which are not being used regularly at the moment.

And then there's the SouthEastern and Silverlink 508s, which always bugs me when there are DMUs spending their whole day over third rail lines...

But what else actually is there which could potentially be drafted back in to service?

 

[Nym]

The old Gatwick Express Fleet...

 

[90019]

And then there's the SouthEastern and Silverlink 508s, which always bugs me when there are DMUs spending their whole day over third rail lines...

Aren't the remaining ones in store all in pretty bad condition and not really usable?

 

[NSEFAN]

Aren't the remaining ones in store all in pretty bad condition and not really usable?

Indeed. There's more to running trains that just owning them. They have to be maintained, too. I guess it's like with cars; after a while they become worth more as scrap/source of spares than as a useful machine!

 

[cj_1985]

basically as has been said above...

# 508/2 and 508/3s... which most observers would have said should have been refurbished/overhauled for Southern instead of the 313s, since the 313s spend their lives on 3rd rail routes only... plus AIUI the 313s had their pantographs removed anyway. Dual Voltage units could be better used elsewhere

# the Class 460s... although again AIUI they could have been allocated for reforming with the class 458s if the DfT hadnt dragged their feet regarding the options for 10 carraige operation at SWT... provided that SWT/DfT didnt prefer the extra Desiro carraige option


i think thats it though... apart from DVTs, a few mk.2s and a whole hell of a lot of HST and LHCS restaurant carraiges, that would probably require a lot of money spent to get it fit for use again..

the DB mk.3s are in use with Chiltern or earmarked for "rebuilding" with electric doors to replace the "slam" doors fitted at the moment

 

[466.networkers]

Aren't the remaining ones in store all in pretty bad condition and not really usable?

With regards to the SET 508/2s ...

508212 is/was being used as a Christmas tree to keep the other 11 working ..

IIRC only 6 were in decent nick, with the other 5 proving more unreliable that the rest ...

 

[WillPS]

If there's none salvageable, then it annoys me that they were left to deteriorate when DMUs regularly run over third rails.

 

[Kingfisher200262]

With regards to the SET 508/2s ...

508212 is/was being used as a Christmas tree to keep the other 11 working ..

IIRC only 6 were in decent nick, with the other 5 proving more unreliable that the rest ...

Any idea what the painted numbers are on the six good ones?

 

[ACE1888]

Another downside to privatisation for me, so much hauled stock has disappeared when thinking about it, a few locomotives and Mk3 stock SHOULD have been allocated to ALL TOC's at the time for 'flexibility' in services (Virgin then Cross Country in particular down this way). All this Government 'spin' regarding 'more coaches' on routes when we had quality stock that just needed upgrading/full refurbishment, with ideally new Locomotives to pull them, instead of re engined 47's, is another example of short sightedness on the Railways

 

[BestWestern]

Regarding the 508's, I understand that SWT are eyeing up a centre coach from one of these sets to help with the recommisssioning of the wrecked 455 that a cement lorry fell on?

 

[Matt Taylor]

That would complicate matters as the unit involved was a 455/9 but the Class 508 centre cars are in the 455/7 units, in any case my understanding is that an ex Class 210 vehicle is available for the rebuild of 455913.

 

[mallard]

Are the 508s push-pull compatible with anything? Don't supposed they could work with 33s or 73s like most of the old slam-door SR stock?

 

[starrymarkb]

I call Bullpoo on SWT looking at a 508 trailer...

The wrecked 455 coach was the unit's motor coach. it doesn't need a new trailer!

 

[jopsuk]

Simply, what passenger stock is presently stored/out of use but could be used once again in regular service?

There must be a few Mk3s (CargoD? DRS? DBS?) which are not being used regularly at the moment.

And then there's the SouthEastern and Silverlink 508s, which always bugs me when there are DMUs spending their whole day over third rail lines...

But what else actually is there which could potentially be drafted back in to service?

The 508s would be of most use to merseyrail, but they're in such poor condition they don't want the hassle of getting them up the standard of their existing fleet.

other than the Lymington branch, are there actually any other DMUs that spend all day on 3rd rail routes? Thought all the other SWT and Southern DMU routes involve non-electrified lines for part of the journey?

The loco hauled stock isn't of that much use really- can't be used to lengthen MU formations, wouldn't be able to keep to MU timings.

 

[Lampshade]

What's the formation of a (four car) 508?

 

[ainsworth74]

What's the formation of a (four car) 508?

I believe it's DMSO+TSO+TSO+DMSO.

 

[73129]

Are the 508s push-pull compatible with anything? Don't supposed they could work with 33s or 73s like most of the old slam-door SR stock?

I believe they are compatible with the 3xx series EMUs including 313s, 314s and 315s, I don't know about 317-322 classes though.

 

[158722]

Any idea what the painted numbers are on the six good ones?

I believe they would be the 6 reliveried ones - 508203/205/207/208/210/211.

15 3-car 508s = 45 vehicles. Southern have 44 class 171 vehicles. Electrify to Uckfield and the Ashford-Hastings line and use the 508s along with Southern's existing 313s. Double gain in allowing the 171s to be reformed into 12 3-car units and 4 2-car sets for say FGW Pompey-Cardiff plus a few others, with a cascade of 158s, 153s and 150s allowing 143s to be displaced along with some 142/143s from ATW as well.

 

[DarloRich]

there is still some lhcs in store (NOT MUCH) and some strange ones like the couple of MKii owned by GC and the MKiii rake owned by DRS. Otherwise there is nothing i can think of that hasnt been mentioned

 

[mallard]

I believe they would be the 6 reliveried ones - 508203/205/207/208/210/211.

15 3-car 508s = 45 vehicles. Southern have 44 class 171 vehicles. Electrify to Uckfield and the Ashford-Hastings line and use the 508s along with Southern's existing 313s. Double gain in allowing the 171s to be reformed into 12 3-car units and 4 2-car sets for say FGW Pompey-Cardiff plus a few others, with a cascade of 158s, 153s and 150s allowing 143s to be displaced along with some 142/143s from ATW as well.

Would the 508s be fast enough for use on those lines? (Including the runs in/out of London) They are only 75mph units...

 

[sprinterguy]

there is still some lhcs in store (NOT MUCH) and some strange ones like the couple of MKii owned by GC and the MKiii rake owned by DRS. Otherwise there is nothing i can think of that hasnt been mentioned

DRS' mark 3 rake has been bought by DB Schenker, presumably for future conversion to powered door form for use by Chiltern. GCs' mark 2s are simply barrier vehicles and are probably fairly knackered internally, so would need to be completely gutted and refitted I'd imagine before they were fit for passenger use.

There's actually quite a few former Crosscountry mark 2s still owned by Eversholt and stored out of use at the likes of Kineton and Long Marston, though I would strongly suggest that the amount of work required to make them railworthy again would be fairly extensive. I can count in the region of 30 air con mark 2 TSOs and a couple of FOs that have lain out of use for some time. Around ten BSO vehicles as well.

ATW also have about nine mark 2 TSOs and a BSO in store, and there's six mark 2 DBSOs currently unused.

I can't see much of that lot been of much use to anyone though after a few years in storage, and while there might be enough spot hire 37s and 47s available from the likes of DRS and WCRC to haul them if they could be returned to service, it's probably not particularly cost effective except in times of extreme stock shortages, when the TOC is incapable of providing even the minimum service requirement.