Avantix replacement (previously: Arriva ditch Avantix)

[Adam0984]

Northern (or whoever takes over) are replacing the Avantix too. With the Fijitsu been 1 of 3 I think that's was been considered and I believe that once the winning bidder has been announced the order for X amount of trial machines will go in for the preferred one (and possibly the other 2 for comparison) for a quick roll out as soon as possible

 

[Blindtraveler]

What are all 3 options? Just nozy

 

[ainsworth74]

I've merged (and renamed for clarity) two threads regarding Avantix replacement together so it might be worth going back and skimming through the older posts in this new combined thread to see previous discussion and information.

 

[Blindtraveler]

Thanks Ainsworth

 

[bb21]

STARmobile? If STAR is anything to go by I think I prefer Avantix. :roll:

 

[Simon11]

If Abellio are going with one supplier, it will then be the fujitsu star mobile.

Compared to the heavy avantix and now able to read smart tickets with one device, this seems a far better solution.

 

[turboslug]

TPE have told their staff that there will be a new ticket machine by april 2016 as the avantix wont update after march 31st, staff training will be early next year with an announcement to what replacement they will be using due soon

 

[JaJaWa]

Looks like there's this system that offers more than Avantix and prints proper tickets, and there's the other system GWR are rumoured to be going for which only offers a limited range of tickets and prints on bus-style stock?

 

[Haywain]

Printing "proper" (CCST) tickets is all very well, but that requires a pretty bulky printer, whereas "bus-style" stock can mean a much smaller belt mounted printer.

 

[FordFocus]

Arriva are using this new STAR system for all it's rail operations.

 

[dcsprior]

Printing "proper" (CCST) tickets is all very well, but that requires a pretty bulky printer, whereas "bus-style" stock can mean a much smaller belt mounted printer.

Will the "bus-style" tickets have a 2D barcode on to work ticket gates, like print at home tickets do?

 

[NorthernSpirit]

Printing "proper" (CCST) tickets is all very well, but that requires a pretty bulky printer, whereas "bus-style" stock can mean a much smaller belt mounted printer.

Will the tickets be similar to the old SPORTIS design?

 

[causton]

A colleague of mine went up to HQ to see one of these in action to tell the makers what was good and bad. I assume it is the same as this and can't wait personally!

 

[Haywain]

Will the "bus-style" tickets have a 2D barcode on to work ticket gates, like print at home tickets do?

I believe that at least on TOC is looking at that solution. But that might raise the question of how many gatelines are suitably equipped.

Will the tickets be similar to the old SPORTIS design?

I have no idea what they might look like, but tickets will have to be produced so that they are accepted by other operators so there may be an RSP standard to meet.

 

[WelshBluebird]

Not looking forward to these "bus style" tickets for return tickets. Can't see them lasting well for more than a couple of days!

 

[SpacePhoenix]

Will they be able to do online checks of Oyster/Key/etc cards?

 

[andrewkeith5]

Will they be able to do online checks of Oyster/Key/etc cards?

If I were doing the buying I wouldn't be accepting a solution that didn't without very good reason......

I wonder whether the paper tickets will just be barcode type tickets that only the operator issuing them would accept, and possibly that could be exchanged for an interoperable ticket later. Bus tickets last a day or week for many people who take care of them...

I wonder what sort of tickets are issued on the train - I imagine it's mostly only tickets for use on that particular route, day returns or singles I imagine mostly.... For which paper tickets would be perfectly fine, and for anything more would probably still do a reasonable job.

 

[Starmill]

I wonder what sort of tickets are issued on the train - I imagine it's mostly only tickets for use on that particular route, day returns or singles I imagine mostly.... For which paper tickets would be perfectly fine, and for anything more would probably still do a reasonable job.

Well it's a good solution in your imaginary world then. In reality all kinds of tickets are issued onboard in places where there aren't ticket offices.

 

[grumblingalong]

Well it's a good solution in your imaginary world then. In reality all kinds of tickets are issued onboard in places where there aren't ticket offices.

Seconded you need a machine capable of printing "proper" tickets. The prototypes I've seen do so, just carry fewer tickets than Avantix to make the printer less bulky.

 

[WelshBluebird]

I wonder what sort of tickets are issued on the train

All sorts. From the day singles / returns you mention to weekly season tickets, returns where the return part is valid for a month, rovers etc. And all of the above possibly covering both short and long distance journeys.

I wonder whether the paper tickets will just be barcode type tickets that only the operator issuing them would accept, and possibly that could be exchanged for an interoperable ticket later.

That would cause total and utter chaos at places like Cardiff Central and Bristol Temple Meads where large numbers of passengers interchange from local services (where they may have bought a ticket on the train) to longer distance services.

Bus tickets last a day or week for many people who take care of them...

What about a month?

 

[Flying Snail]

Seconded you need a machine capable of printing "proper" tickets. The prototypes I've seen do so, just carry fewer tickets than Avantix to make the printer less bulky.

Individual tickets and a quick loading hopper would be better than the current rolls as guards could easily carry extras in a pocket and load a smaller size case rather than having to carry a bulky machine designed to hold a full roll.

Dual printing would also be a possible compromise, thermal paper for simple tickets or optional printing onto standard stock either held in a hopper or manually fed for journeys requiring connections, entry/exit through standard gates or seasons.

 

[tsr]

Individual tickets and a quick loading hopper would be better than the current rolls as guards could easily carry extras in a pocket and load a smaller size case rather than having to carry a bulky machine designed to hold a full roll.

Dual printing would also be a possible compromise, thermal paper for simple tickets or optional printing onto standard stock either held in a hopper or manually fed for journeys requiring connections, entry/exit through standard gates or seasons.

Oh good, more things to put in pockets! Yes, what a good idea. Just what a guard needs. Along with keys (lots), phones, the odd travel pass, pens, notebook, gloves and what have you. "What have you" often being a lot.

No thanks. I don't particularly like the reliability of the Avantix equipment, but one advantage is that if I load one up with a big stack of tickets, it should last a while.

I'd also like it if all receipts could also be printed on ticket stock by default, but obviously making it a little plainer that it is a receipt. It would lead to the simplicity of only one printer and all the maintenance and time savings that brings.

 

[40129]

Well said tsr. Couldn't agree more

 

[HowardGWR]

I can never make a ticket issued with Avantix work in any barrier. Mind you, it didn't help that the tickets we acquired on the Wessex line were made out to Bath when we had asked for Bristol!!!

I had to ask for a personal message of excuse to be written on the receipt so that we could - oh you don't want to read the entire saga do you?

 

[ALEMASTER]

The worry that strikes me with the idea of using a smart phone as the base of a ticket machine is battery life!

 

[causton]

The worry that strikes me with the idea of using a smart phone as the base of a ticket machine is battery life!

Avantix Mobile PDAs have rubbish battery life as it is, don't worry

...hopefully as battery technology improves this will not be much of an issue and there are always portable battery packs/charging cases for it!

 

[Clip]

The worry that strikes me with the idea of using a smart phone as the base of a ticket machine is battery life!

Smart phones are generally fine but with peoples need to be always looking at them and using apps and not closing them that's what runs the battery down.

Given the menu is only going to be text based and no use for a 10kmp front facing camera they shouldn't use much power anyway.

 

[PermitToTravel]

Cellular internet access inside a train uses a lot of power though, as the transmit intensity has to be cranked right up to get through the metal walls. Printers aren't exactly low-power either.

On the flip side there's no requirement for it to be as thin or light as the average phone, so they can just stick a ludicrously massive battery in it and be done.

 

[JaJaWa]

Cellular internet access inside a train uses a lot of power though, as the transmit intensity has to be cranked right up to get through the metal walls. Printers aren't exactly low-power either.

On the flip side there's no requirement for it to be as thin or light as the average phone, so they can just stick a ludicrously massive battery in it and be done.

The link posted above shows what phone is being used. Its a Samsung Galaxy in a Morphie power case. I presume they do not require internet access, and I presume they will not be powering the printer either.

 

[450.emu]

link here:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=VJfX7RzwXzI&feature=youtu.be

The thyron (chip and pin machine) PDA (Portable computer) and printer housing (ticket stock, printer batteries) that guards, gateline, RPOs, ATEs use dates from 2002

a replacement is finally on the horizon with GWR and XC known to be replacing theirs

Rumour there will be the ability to sell monthlies and advances

obviously internet connection for cards for online authorization

timetable info up to date with delays and platform numbers

automatic detection of railcard validity, off peak and peak and minimum fares to make the job much easier and ticket swipes

I used to work for the company who used to maintain the Thyron's along with the Swecoin and the rest of the Tribute kit. I'm sure in 2002 it was fantastic, but the world has moved on. The Swecoins would clog up due to excess ticket dust (one unit in Kings Langley was replaced 5 times in one week due to DOA printers, or ones that worked for half the morning )

After Abellio Greater Anglia ditched the Tribute for new Fujitsu kit, a lot of the other TOCs started to follow suit - I think now only London Midland and C2C use the kit - though they've replaced the printers with Newbury Data machines - I'm not sure if the Thyron's are still around. I used to love the way a new one would rattle, and as soon as you plug it in there's a Tamper Warning because it was not repaired properly. In an effort to rob Peter to pay Paul, I once took one on a long car ride from Enfield Town to Ipswich, only to plug it in and find it tampered :roll: